Handles on Systainer

[tadge]

Hi just had delivered a SYS3 M 437 box and was expecting a fold out handle as per my domino machine, however its a fixed one.  Am  missing something or is this satndard?  Can only get my fingertips on it so cant use as a handle really.

Thanks

 

[ghhsolutions]

It's standard, if it had a folding front handle it would bang into your leg and be lop-sided.

 

[Mark Katz]

Hi just had delivered a SYS3 M 437 box and was expecting a fold out handle as per my domino machine, however its a fixed one.  Am  missing something or is this satndard?  Can only get my fingertips on it so cant use as a handle really.

Thanks

The top handle does fold out but it snaps in very tightly. Pry it out near the ends. Once it’s out, it’s like the old top handle. Terrible design decision.

 

[squall_line]

Because the Sys3 is intended to be used with a Bott racking system, the front "handle" on the larger units is there as a finger-hold to help you pull the systainer out on the racks, rather than as an actual carry handle.

Only the smaller Systainers have actual folding handles that can be used for carrying.

To wit, the finger holds are at the bottom of the Systainer; there is no way that would be a stable location for a balanced side-carry of the Systainer.  If the handle was in the middle of the front of a SysM-437, I don't know how you'd actually carry it comfortably, assuming the front of the Sys could even handle the strain without breaking into pieces or jamming the lid.

 

[Cheese]

The top handle does fold out but it snaps in very tightly. Pry it out near the ends. Once it’s out, it’s like the old top handle. Terrible design decision.

PLUS 1 on that.  [big grin]

 

[semenza]

The front handle is NOT a fold out handle on the larger sizes. It is only a drawer pull for those.

Seth

 

[Crazyraceguy]

The top handle does fold out but it snaps in very tightly. Pry it out near the ends. Once it’s out, it’s like the old top handle. Terrible design decision.

PLUS 1 on that.  [big grin]

And, it's not the only one....

 

[Cheese]

Ya, I've had enough of this foolishness...having to jamb a flat blade screwdriver under the handle just to lift it up on a Systainer 3 handle, now that's certainly convenient.  This is exactly where we were at 10 years ago with the original Systainer...when we had to trim plastic off of the detents of the original Systainers to allow us to open the things up without breaking our finger nails.

One would hope someone in Festool Product Management would have learned from their previous foolishness, but alas...here we go again...round 2.

Sheesh, if Festool owners weren't so flipping loyal this company would have gone the way of Delta or Porter Cable.

Before

[attachimg=1]

After...just pare off one of the detents with a sharp chisel and the handle will still remain in place but it can be grabbed easily and folded forward.

[attachimg=2]

 

[luvmytoolz]

I also found those detents extremely annoying, and I took to them with a chisel pretty quickly.

The thing that really baffles me though with all these cases to many that seem so blindingly obvious, is that these sorts of stupid things don't happen by accident, it usually goes through several design meetings and trials, and committee's and approvals, so you'd think one person might have said at some point "have end users asked for this?", or perhaps even "do you think this would annoy our customers?"!

As a parallel, Microsoft boffins decided for the latest server and consumer releases of Windows, to remove the one pixel border around windows. A horrible idea that absolutely no one in the world wanted, and makes it incredibly difficult to see where one window ends and another starts! But they actually spent time and money to change the code and builds to introduce that "feature"!

 

[tadge]

Thank you all, I presumed this was the case a pull handle, and thats how I intend to use it, however my sausage fingers only just go in when pulling so though flip out handle wouel be better.
Thanks for all the replies.

 

[Coen]

Hi just had delivered a SYS3 M 437 box and was expecting a fold out handle as per my domino machine, however its a fixed one.  Am  missing something or is this satndard?  Can only get my fingertips on it so cant use as a handle really.

Thanks

The top handle does fold out but it snaps in very tightly. Pry it out near the ends. Once it’s out, it’s like the old top handle. Terrible design decision.

He was talking about the front handle. Which on larger boxes is not a handle, but just something to pull the box out of the rack. Just like the L-Boxx'es

 

[Imemiter]

He was talking about the front handle. Which on larger boxes is not a handle, but just something to pull the box out of the rack. Just like the L-Boxx'es

Without a re-thinking of the tool inserts, the new front handles aren't much of a handle on any size Systainer. That is, unless you don't mind scrambling the contents of your toolbox every time you carry one by that handle. I think this is true of every insert but the parts bins. Bosch did the exact same thing when they redesigned the L-Boxx. 

 

[semenza]

He was talking about the front handle. Which on larger boxes is not a handle, but just something to pull the box out of the rack. Just like the L-Boxx'es

Without a re-thinking of the tool inserts, the new front handles aren't much of a handle on any size Systainer. That is, unless you don't mind scrambling the contents of your toolbox every time you carry one by that handle. I think this is true of every insert but the parts bins. Bosch did the exact same thing when they redesigned the L-Boxx.

I think it (the front handle) is mostly intended to make it easy to pull the Systainer from racking / shelving. Not really a carrying handle.

Seth

 

[MAK]

He was talking about the front handle. Which on larger boxes is not a handle, but just something to pull the box out of the rack. Just like the L-Boxx'es

Without a re-thinking of the tool inserts, the new front handles aren't much of a handle on any size Systainer. That is, unless you don't mind scrambling the contents of your toolbox every time you carry one by that handle. I think this is true of every insert but the parts bins. Bosch did the exact same thing when they redesigned the L-Boxx.

I think it (the front handle) is mostly intended to make it easy to pull the Systainer from racking / shelving. Not really a carrying handle.

Seth

Yes but you can't easily pull the top handle up.
I recently bought 3 new tools with the new systainers, keeping tools obviously but selling systainers.

 

[Coen]

He was talking about the front handle. Which on larger boxes is not a handle, but just something to pull the box out of the rack. Just like the L-Boxx'es

Without a re-thinking of the tool inserts, the new front handles aren't much of a handle on any size Systainer. That is, unless you don't mind scrambling the contents of your toolbox every time you carry one by that handle. I think this is true of every insert but the parts bins. Bosch did the exact same thing when they redesigned the L-Boxx.

A lot of inlays actually don't allow for stuff to scramble. My scare with Systainers is the T opening while walking with them, a risk not present with L-boxxes.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

From what I have been told, the point of the hard snap top handle is to stop it from rattling in the Bott rack, while moving down the road.

 

[semenza]

From what I have been told, the point of the hard snap top handle is to stop it from rattling in the Bott rack, while moving down the road.

My thought was that it was to keep it from flopping down when opening the lid. Could be both. A whole bunch of rattling Systainers would make me nuts while driving.

Seth

 

[squall_line]

From what I have been told, the point of the hard snap top handle is to stop it from rattling in the Bott rack, while moving down the road.

My thought was that it was to keep it from flopping down when opening the lid. Could be both. A whole bunch of rattling Systainers would make me nuts while driving.

Seth

Quoted for truth.

I forgot to set the lock on my CT-MIDI-I once in the back of our SUV.  I had two short T-Loc stacks next to it to more or less wedge it into place, but there was more than enough handle-rattling and MIDI-rolling in the short 5 minute trip that I would have stopped and set the brake and tossed a blanket over everything if I was going much further.

 

[Cheese]

Well let me just take the devils advocate position on this little gem...squall_line, SRSemenza & Crazyraceguy.

This whole need for a handle lock down rationale could make sense if looked at from the 15,000 foot level but when viewed from the macro level, this explanation just does not have much validity.

So, Festool is greatly concerned about a handle that's already in the horizontal (dead, low energy) position, and it's pretty benign, becoming a noise maker yet there's no concern at all about a handle that's in the vertical position and is free to pivot, swing and slap the Systainer underneath it? This handle position "klacks" over bumps, it "klacks around corners and it "klacks" when accelerating and braking. It's a nuisance and I mentioned it over 2 year ago...so much for Festool corporate being interested in user feedback.
I'm with Mino's assessment on this situation. 2025...2026...2027...well one of these years they'll finally get it.

Check out reply #138
https://www.festoolownersgroup.com/...iners/systainer3-available-from-september/60/

[attachimg=1]

 

[Coen]

Check out reply #138
https://www.festoolownersgroup.com/...iners/systainer3-available-from-september/60/

[attachimg=1]

#138 in that thread is this;

Do the handles lock in a straight outward position too, or only in the downward position?

Only in the downward position. So if you have a van full of stacked Systainers mixed in with Systainer³ items, the front handle just flops around and slaps the Systainer as you go around corners and roll over bumps...Nice.  [doh]

I guess driving styles might come into play.  I can’t see this as an issue, but others will certainly have their doubts and opinions.

Peter

L-Boxx front handles (only on the two smaller sizes 102 and 136) (not on 238, 374) have some friction on the hinges so they don't flap around even without "lock". Problem solved!

The top handle 'lock' became 'necessary' because they reversed it's direction compared to the T-Loc Systainers. This reversion in turn became 'necessary' because of the racking ability, so a handle that was 'up' would be pushed down when the Systainer gets racked instead of blocking the (de-)racking.

But note that the L-Boxxes maintained a logical height system, the four sizes being 3*, 4*, 7*, 11* multiples of 34mm. Something the Systainer USED to have with multiples of 52.5mm. Now however... it's X*50mm + Y. The Y component makes it nearly impossible to create equal-height stacks with differently sized Systainers.

I think a lot of this was even unkown by users as Festool never promoted these features properly. Like you can easily make a Systainer stack that equals the height of the MFT... but not with Sys3