Have TS55 - Getting a table saw

[Adon]

Hi all,
It's my first post! I don't want to open the table saw debate, as I figured out the answer for the type of work I am doing. I need a table saw for repetitive cuts on mostly small pieces. I'm about to grab the SS with 30" extension, which I think should be enough for me given I have the TS55 saw. Does anyone have any experience with this decision?

Also I noticed on the NAINA sticky the TS insert for the CMS isn't mentioned. If I could get the insert I wouldn't be agonizing over this table saw purchase. Am I wrong to assume there is no chance we'll see this here in NA?

Thanks for all the great content!

 

[RKA]

Welcome to the FOG!

I think you'd have to be a mind reader to answer that question, but my take on it is if they intended to release it here, they probably would have already done so.  It fits nicely in their ecosystem and makes the CMS more than just an expensive router table.  That fact that they haven't extinguishes any hope that they will.  To say why would only be speculation on my part.

 

[Administrator_JSVN]

Welcome to the forum.

No plans to introduce the TS module for the CMS in North America. I would expect not to see it in the future either as it stands.

 

[amt]

Does SS = SawStop?  You will probably be happy with any cabinet grade saw.  Also check out the Incra TS-LS table saw fence.

Table saw is great for cutting smaller pieces and repetitive cuts.  However, if you want similar dust collection as the track saw (assuming you are already doing it on that), then it can get more expensive quickly.  Regardless, I still find it  very practical to have both a table saw and a track saw

 

[Birdhunter]

If "SS" means SawStop, you will be elated with the product. I replaced my 25 year old Unisaw with a SawStop Industrial model. It is the best engineered non-Festool power tool I have ever used. The instant stop feature is a wonderful aspect of the saw, but the saw itself is worth the price premium. Every facet of the saw is well considered and executed.

 

[canadamike]

I have the TS55 and MTF, as well as SawStop Industial.

I am surprised how much I use the TS and MTF (they are set up beside each other). But there are many occasions when I need the SS. Such as dados, long rips and short cut-offs with the sled. I have lots of Qwas Dogs and other MFT jigs, mainly use them to break down stock quickly. I am still adapting to/learning the Festool system, but I am fortunate enough to have the space for the SS. You'll learn lots from these generous FOG members!

Cheers Mike

 

[ccarrolladams]

I have the TS55 and MTF, as well as SawStop Industial.

I am surprised how much I use the TS and MTF (they are set up beside each other). But there are many occasions when I need the SS. Such as dados, long rips and short cut-offs with the sled. I have lots of Qwas Dogs and other MFT jigs, mainly use them to break down stock quickly. I am still adapting to/learning the Festool system, but I am fortunate enough to have the space for the SS. You'll learn lots from these generous FOG members!

Cheers Mike

Are you running a woodworking business with employees?

I ask because here in California we have not been allowed to use dado heads in business for a long time. Perhaps in Canada Saw Stops are different because mine will not accept a traditional dado head. Sure I prefer using a dado head, but long ago I had to learn to make rabbets and dadoes with routers. Doing so with Festool plunge routers and guide rails is very effective.

 

[Adon]

Thanks for the responses, and the confirmation on the CMS module. I'm looking at getting the sawstop to replace a bench top King contractor saw which is a menace (I hoped to never use it after getting the TS55). The safety of the SS along with the excellent dust collection is the main appeal. Based on success reported in another thread, I'm going to use my CT26 with the SS.

I can't do it on the King saw, but I plan to cut dados with the standard blade and multiple passes on the sled I'm going to make. The iffy technique has worked well for me in the past. Changing the blade AND the cartridge every time, isn't likely to happen. For longer dados I"ll probably stick to the router on the track.

 

[canadamike]

I have the TS55 and MTF, as well as SawStop Industial.

I am surprised how much I use the TS and MTF (they are set up beside each other). But there are many occasions when I need the SS. Such as dados, long rips and short cut-offs with the sled. I have lots of Qwas Dogs and other MFT jigs, mainly use them to break down stock quickly. I am still adapting to/learning the Festool system, but I am fortunate enough to have the space for the SS. You'll learn lots from these generous FOG members!

Cheers Mike

Are you running a woodworking business with employees?

I ask because here in California we have not been allowed to use dado heads in business for a long time. Perhaps in Canada Saw Stops are different because mine will not accept a traditional dado head. Sure I prefer using a dado head, but long ago I had to learn to make rabbets and dadoes with routers. Doing so with Festool plunge routers and guide rails is very effective.

Hello Carroll,

My SS does accept a dadoe cutter, with the safety brake installed (I need to swap the brakes out). My shop is a part time venture, but is has been inspected. I am going to follow your pointers and look using routers. But in my experience to date, cutting long 1/2" dados is faster on a dedicated table saw (given my available real estate).

I would welcome any advice, you have much more time under your belt with working wood than I do.

Thx Mike

 

[ccarrolladams]

Mike,

For the first 60 years of my cabinet making career I cut dadoes on a table saw using a dado head. The advantage is that neither saw blade is asked to make a climb cut as is the case with one side of the router bit. The work around with the router is to use an undersize bit, make one cut such that the good side is not a climb cut, then move the router slightly and make the other cut in the opposite direction so it is not a climb cut.

Making dadoes this way with a router is labor intensive even using guide rails, but less of a problem on a CNC router. The CNC downside is the cost of the machine and the energy to provide the vacuum hold-down.

However, ages ago in California we lost the legal battle with the safety regulators. Consequently we had to become at one using other methods to cut dadoes in a production situation. Yes, in my older shop one of the table saws with power feed was dedicated to making dadoes.

Personally I am still not convinced there is any inherent danger using a dado set on a table saw. When preparing for the legal battle I did research into dado industrial accidents within California. Compared to other woodworking accidents, such as lifting and dropping accidents, the dado accidents were statistically insignificant, but the Court ruled against us. So, we learned to adjust our workflow.

 

[Papajoe]

in my opinion, you are spot on with the decision to add a sawstop. I'm new to setting up a "woodworking" shop, but have construction experience. for small, and/or repetitive  cuts it has to be 10x faster. 1 example, we installed a t&g hardwood floor 72' long, the last row was 1.06" wide, set the fence and ran all the pieces. 2nd example, 23 replacement windows in an old-thick walled house; build out 1.5x2 inch frames in oak (300lf), rip, miter, domino.  my new shop has or soon will has a full line of festool products 25+, with only 3 other brands of power tools(SS ics 52", delta dc580 h.d. planer, a floor drill press). the SS would have been 30", except I found a really great deal on the 52"; there are many, many great people on this site that have years (more) experience with festools than I, that can and likely will shed light on the subject for you. best of luck
joseph

 

[Guilliaume woodworks]

Mike,

For the first 60 years of my cabinet making career I cut dadoes on a table saw using a dado head. The advantage is that neither saw blade is asked to make a climb cut as is the case with one side of the router bit. The work around with the router is to use an undersize bit, make one cut such that the good side is not a climb cut, then move the router slightly and make the other cut in the opposite direction so it is not a climb cut.

Making dadoes this way with a router is labor intensive even using guide rails, but less of a problem on a CNC router. The CNC downside is the cost of the machine and the energy to provide the vacuum hold-down.

However, ages ago in California we lost the legal battle with the safety regulators. Consequently we had to become at one using other methods to cut dadoes in a production situation. Yes, in my older shop one of the table saws with power feed was dedicated to making dadoes.

Personally I am still not convinced there is any inherent danger using a dado set on a table saw. When preparing for the legal battle I did research into dado industrial accidents within California. Compared to other woodworking accidents, such as lifting and dropping accidents, the dado accidents were statistically insignificant, but the Court ruled against us. So, we learned to adjust our workflow.

Carroll,
  I believe what your saying is true, because I Know from your past posts your very knowledgable in the business of woodworking. However, I'm shocked to hear this. Every shop I've ever worked in used dados on ts's. I take advanced woodworking classes at a local state college and we frequently use dado blades. Just another stupid calif. rule aimed at small business owners.

 

[Guilliaume woodworks]

To me a table saw and a track saw are two totally different animals. There are things that one or the other simply cannot do. But I will say after getting track saws I use my ts a lot less, breaking down sheet goods mainly . A good table saw is still the heart of a good wood shop. IMHO . Get the Saw Stop, you'll never regret it. Promise.

 

[Birdhunter]

If the money males sense, I'd strongly suggest going with the Industrial SawStop over the Professional. Both are excellent, but the Industrial has a larger table and is a lot heavier made. The mobile base with the pump up lift is great if you have to move equipment around.

Believe it of not, but a nickel coin (US coinage) is an important adjustment tool for the SawStop. It's used to set the spacing between the brake and the blade.

The dado diameter must be exactly that specified by SawStop and you must use the dado specific brake and the dado specific  table top insert.

The SawStop blade stop makes me even more careful as I don't want to trigger it. Kind of reverse psychology.

 

[barnowl]

... I'm looking at getting the sawstop to replace a bench top King contractor saw which is a menace (I hoped to never use it after getting the TS55). The safety of the SS along with the excellent dust collection is the main appeal. ...

I have a Saw Stop contractors saw, as I'm always moving it, and it's lighter on my uneven floor.

The dust collection is great form under the table. Above the table, you need additional dust collection, which is why I purchased their dust collecting blade guard. (It may come standard now, I don't know)

I connect my Festool 36 mm hose to it, to my CT-26, as well as the 4" hose under the saw to my dust collector, and dust is a distant memory.

 

[RONWEN]

Mike,

For the first 60 years of my cabinet making career I cut dadoes on a table saw using a dado head. The advantage is that neither saw blade is asked to make a climb cut as is the case with one side of the router bit. The work around with the router is to use an undersize bit, make one cut such that the good side is not a climb cut, then move the router slightly and make the other cut in the opposite direction so it is not a climb cut.

Making dadoes this way with a router is labor intensive even using guide rails, but less of a problem on a CNC router. The CNC downside is the cost of the machine and the energy to provide the vacuum hold-down.

However, ages ago in California we lost the legal battle with the safety regulators. Consequently we had to become at one using other methods to cut dadoes in a production situation. Yes, in my older shop one of the table saws with power feed was dedicated to making dadoes.

Personally I am still not convinced there is any inherent danger using a dado set on a table saw. When preparing for the legal battle I did research into dado industrial accidents within California. Compared to other woodworking accidents, such as lifting and dropping accidents, the dado accidents were statistically insignificant, but the Court ruled against us. So, we learned to adjust our workflow.

Hopefully they had good reason(s) for such a decision but to the rest of the "normal" country it seems like just another silly California law...  [blink]

 

[bruegf]

I did the same thing, bought the MFT and TS55.  Later replaced my Ryobi contractor saw with a SS contractor with 30" fence and cast iron wings.  I still like the table saw better for repetitive rip cuts, both narrow and wide, and dust collection with the optional blade guard with dust port is even better than dust collection on the TS55.

The other "must have" accessory for the SS, at least for me, is the Wixey digital read out.  Very easy to install.

Fred

 

[peter halle]

If I am not mistaken i have read here from members that commercial shops in the UK also can't use dado blades.

Peter

 

[jonny round boy]

If I am not mistaken i have read here from members that commercial shops in the UK also can't use dado blades.

Peter

That's correct. Although you can still buy them... [huh]

 

[ccarrolladams]

If I am not mistaken i have read here from members that commercial shops in the UK also can't use dado blades.

Peter

Peter, For a long time industrial safety regulations within the European Union have prohibited dado heads used by employees. Some manufacturere, such as Felder of Austria, have not built saws able to accept a dado head in 20 years.

That information was presented by the attorneys representing Cal OSHA during the legal case about dado heads. Funny thing is the fact that I like the quality of cut and efficiency of dado heads on table saws did not influence the judge, who might or might not have ever worked with wood.

In my case it was so silly because the table saw I used for dadoes was dedicated for that purpose and always ran with a power feed which precluded the operator from putting a hand anywhere near the dado head, or a saw blade, except with the power off while adjusting the dado head.