Helix Planer

[Owego]

I'm looking for reviews/opinions of 20" Helix planers, Jet, PowerMatic, Grizzly, etc.  Also  mobile bases for the same.  I'm under the impression that the helical cutters will reduce tear-out on figured wood and, handle end grain better than my Tersa knives.

Tom

 

[jacko9]

Tom,

I replaced the cutter head on my 12" Powermatic Planer with the Shelix Cutter head.  Yes it does cut quieter with less tear out but the resulting surface finish is a scalloped appearance that has to be sanded or scraped.  If I had know this I would have purchased solid carbide knives for my 12" planer.  I realize that for a 20" wide planer solid carbide knives are most likely not available and If I weren't a one man shop I wouldn't consider them.  I do have solid carbide knives on my 8" wide Poitras Jointer and they perform excellent.

Here are a few pictures to give you an idea of what to expect with sharp cutters on the Shelix cutter head.  It took sanding with 100 grit to remove the scalloped topography on these boards.

Jack

 

[chrisrosenb]

I have a Terminus (Tersa style) head on my 18" Powermatic planer & a Byrd head on my jointer. They are about equal as far as tearout goes. I still get tearout at times, but not near as much as I did with standard straight knives. I do not believe you will see a lot of reduction in tearout with a helix head over your Tersa head. Taking lighter cuts & reducing feed rates are the best way to reduce tearout on figured wood.

 

[Owego]

I have a Terminus (Tersa style) head on my 18" Powermatic planer & a Byrd head on my jointer. They are about equal as far as tearout goes. I still get tearout at times, but not near as much as I did with standard straight knives. I do not believe you will see a lot of reduction in tearout with a helix head over your Tersa head. Taking lighter cuts & reducing feed rates are the best way to reduce tearout on figured wood.

I failed to mention in the opening post that my current planer is only a 12".  A major reason for my interest in a new planer is to get greater width.  I haven't seen any Tersa stye 20" planers.  So I believe my choices are limited to straight blade or helix.

 

[alex946]

Hmm, this should not be, it seems to vibrate the shaft or the board. Perhaps we should increase the speed of rotation of the shaft.

This is my result the shaft birdtool

 

[chrisrosenb]

I have a Terminus (Tersa style) head on my 18" Powermatic planer & a Byrd head on my jointer. They are about equal as far as tearout goes. I still get tearout at times, but not near as much as I did with standard straight knives. I do not believe you will see a lot of reduction in tearout with a helix head over your Tersa head. Taking lighter cuts & reducing feed rates are the best way to reduce tearout on figured wood.

I failed to mention in the opening post that my current planer is only a 12".  A major reason for my interest in a new planer is to get greater width.  I haven't seen any Tersa stye 20" planers.  So I believe my choices are limited to straight blade or helix.

That changes things. I have seen Tersa heads come on some higher end machines, such as Mini Max & SCMI. Byrd, Tersa & Terminus do make after market heads for many planers & jointers. So you do not have to base your buying choices on just the type of head the planer has. The helix heads are more readily available on new planers. I have only used the Byrd head. There are other brands available. 

 

[Birdhunter]

I have a wide Powermatic planer and separate Powermatic jointer both with helical heads. I can run Birdseye maple through them with no tear out. The surfaces almost do not need sanding. The machines are significantly quieter than the old bladed machines I had. The thickness planer will still snipe unless you lock the head on the last couple of passes.

 

[hopper]

Tom,

I replaced the cutter head on my 12" Powermatic Planer with the Shelix Cutter head.  Yes it does cut quieter with less tear out but the resulting surface finish is a scalloped appearance that has to be sanded or scraped.  If I had know this I would have purchased solid carbide knives for my 12" planer.  I realize that for a 20" wide planer solid carbide knives are most likely not available and If I weren't a one man shop I wouldn't consider them.  I do have solid carbide knives on my 8" wide Poitras Jointer and they perform excellent.

Here are a few pictures to give you an idea of what to expect with sharp cutters on the Shelix cutter head.  It took sanding with 100 grit to remove the scalloped topography on these boards.

Jack

The scalloped surface you are experiencing is probably caused from too fast of a feed rate. Can you slow down your rate of feed and see if it helps? At least that is my experience over decades of planer and jointer use.

 

[grbmds]

Tom,

I replaced the cutter head on my 12" Powermatic Planer with the Shelix Cutter head.  Yes it does cut quieter with less tear out but the resulting surface finish is a scalloped appearance that has to be sanded or scraped.  If I had know this I would have purchased solid carbide knives for my 12" planer.  I realize that for a 20" wide planer solid carbide knives are most likely not available and If I weren't a one man shop I wouldn't consider them.  I do have solid carbide knives on my 8" wide Poitras Jointer and they perform excellent.

Here are a few pictures to give you an idea of what to expect with sharp cutters on the Shelix cutter head.  It took sanding with 100 grit to remove the scalloped topography on these boards.

Jack

The scalloped surface you are experiencing is probably caused from too fast of a feed rate. Can you slow down your rate of feed and see if it helps? At least that is my experience over decades of planer and jointer use.

I was told up front when I bought my Jet 8" helical head jointer that slight scallops were a natural result of the helical knife configuration. The Jet head has less cutters than the Powermatic version and, I'm sure less than the Shelix head does. However, the resulting scallops are not significant for me because I always do some sanding before and during assembly, whether a shop project or something more refined. Any minimal sanding should erase the scallops just as it erases the ridges left by nicks in steel knives on jointers and planers. The improvement in the surface from the helical heads was dramatic for me, but then the upgrade to an 8" jointer in itself was a huge improvement. As with any jointer or planer, taking less of a bite should eliminate some of the problem. It does for me. If I take off 1/32" or less on a jointer pass, I can't feel or see the scallops.

 

[Jaybolishes]

Couldn't possibly be happier with my grizzly 15" spiral head planer. 

 

[jacko9]

There is no feed rate adjustment on my Powermatic model 100 planer, it's the old 1956 design with lots of cast iron.  I never had the surface finish issue (scalloped irregularities) with straight blades that I used for the first 25 years.

Here is a picture of the surface finish in white oak that was cut with the Shelix cutter head in my 12" planer.

Jack

 

[Wonderwino]

I have a Hammer A3-41 with their "Silent Power" helical cutter head.  I've had no problems with tear-out in figured wood or scalloping.  It really is quiet!

 

[WarnerConstCo.]

I still like my 4 knife head in my Buss. Having a grinder and jointing stone makes it even better.

Byrd heads will leave a scallop, others that don't have the cutters all proud of the head seem to not have as pronounced scallop.

 

[greg mann]

There is no feed rate adjustment on my Powermatic model 100 planer, it's the old 1956 design with lots of cast iron.  I never had the surface finish issue (scalloped irregularities) with straight blades that I used for the first 25 years.

Here is a picture of the surface finish in white oak that was cut with the Shelix cutter head in my 12" planer.

Jack

That looks to me like your cutter head has some run-out. The feed lines are not evenly spaced but uniform in their uneven-ness, if that makes any sense to you. I think one row of teeth is taking more stock than the others. That could be the result of the insert pockets being milled while the head was not running true. Just my guess here, and I would be hard pressed to describe how you could check this without pulling the head and mounting it on V-blocks or bench centers.

 

[jacko9]

Greg - what you say might be true however I have heard of several other Shelix owners that have the same surface morphology.  I even contacted the manufacturer and they told me that this is the way this cutter head works.

I'd be interested in hearing from others as well to see how much different my cutting head might be.  I did replace the head bearings when I replaced the cutting head and other than the surface texture it cuts very well.  I'm not ambitious enough to disassemble my machine and check the cutter head now after using it for a few years I'm sure the manufacturer would not be interested in any replacement if I did indeed find an issue with concentricity.  I think even trying to measure that on a spiral head would be very difficult with my limited ability to measure it accurately enough.

Thanks for the suggestion.

Jack

 

[greg mann]

I understand. I have a shelix on my 8 inch jointer(different circumstances of course) and the experience is very pleasing. My point really is that your experience could have been better. Sucks that it isn't.

 

[Cheese]

Greg, just curious if you're saying you don't have a scalloped surface or that you have a less scalloped surface than jack09 has?

It was my understanding that the scalloped surface was a natural product of all helical/Shelix heads. Some a little more, some a little less.

That's the reason I've yet to convert my 12" planer.

 

[Iceclimber]

I love my Helix. Well i guess Felder calls it a silent spiral cutter. My guess is its pretty much the same as a Helix. I do know the knifes on my head are set at a angle to produce a shearing action. Not sure how much difference it makes or not.

Tersa owners will talk smack about helical cutters but imop its just a psonal preference. I Use lots of heavily figurd lumber and get zero tear out. Im talking 99.9% zero tearout on heavily figurd birdseye.

My boards off either my jointer or planer do have a repetative pattern. This pattern is so minor many would glue the boards right off the machine. I opt to use a smoother or a quick blast with 220. Im talking quick!

My oppinion is all board require at least some finishing work off any machine regardless.

 

[greg mann]

Greg, just curious if you're saying you don't have a scalloped surface or that you have a less scalloped surface than jack09 has?

It was my understanding that the scalloped surface was a natural product of all helical/Shelix heads. Some a little more, some a little less.

That's the reason I've yet to convert my 12" planer.

I am very satisfied with the surface. I often will take a very light pass on the jointer after planing to remove the snipe I get from the planer. I have a Powermatic planer with their helical blades. Not the helical heads with carbide inserts but straight steel blades that are installed in helical slots, sprung into place so to speak. You don't read much on these heads but I have nothing bad to say about this style of head. I am sure a carbide inserted helical would last longer but I have run ipe through mine and they are still giving me good surface quality, except for the snipe and that is more about the machine than the head style, IMO. The Byrd head on the jointer gives me a comparable finish and no snipe. Again, I credit the machine for the lack of snipe.

If I have cut long to enable removing the sniped end I can go right to 180 grit on the ets150/3 and remove any machine marks in just a few passes, perhaps five strokes at most. This is true the jointer surface as well.

Edited for typos and clarity

 

[WarnerConstCo.]

Is it their quiet cut head or a newer import machine, Greg?