Improve your KAPEX Dust Collection with a new Design Methodology

[DrDrew]

Greetings...

I need to start with a DISCLAIMER:  I do not own a Kapex... so this Kapex enclosure is NOT ACCURATE... as accuracy requires extensive measuring... a challenging task without actually having a Kapex.

But... the methodology is valid... as I've designed an enclosure for a DeWalt Miter Saw that surpasses the dust collection capabilities of the Kapex.

This coming week I will be trying again to capture the dust collection capabilities of my enclosure design using a laser level on the line setting (e.g., a plane)... running across the front of the enclosure... to capture any sawdust that escapes.  Since I could not see ANY sawdust escaping... I dropped a 1/2 cup of sawdust in front of the enclosure to show what sawdust going across the laser looks like... but the sawdust was going from the outside of the enclosure to the inside... where it was sucked up by the dust enclosure's ports.  Getting this on video is the challenging part.

My Design Methodology requires SketchUp... something that we woodworkers should be using anyway.  SketchUp is also great for designing things that you cannot envision ahead of time... a "Form Follows Function" approach.

The Design aspects of this enclosure are as follows:

• The Enclosure completely covers a miter saw while allowing a hand to position the wood and another hand to operate the saw.
• The Enclosure has a small volume... as small as possible to allow all of the normal movements of a miter saw's components while inside of the enclosure.
• The Enclosure extends forward above the maximum vertical cut capacity of the saw... a feature that was also done in Tyme's "Magical Dustless Shop" videos on YouTube.
• The Enclosure supports the use of a manufacturer's blade guard dust collection port and hose... and also a large dust collection port.

You can see the METHODOLOGY and the ENCLOSURE DESIGN here:    Improve Your Kapex Dust Collection...!!!

You can see a more advanced design... also possible with good KAPEX measurements... here:

Please note that the modified designs incorporate a double polycarbonate (Lexan) shield... one for 90° cut and miters... and a wider opening for compound cuts.

I am not giving my permission for anyone or any firm to produce and sell these enclosures... and any person contemplating doing this should consider the YouTube videos to be PRIOR ART... both for the design and the design methodology (i.e., you cannot patent or sell my design).

If you want to make this enclosure for your own Kapex and need some guidance... please feel free to ask.

If Festool wants to send me a Kapex... I'd be glad to make an enclosure with the correct measurements.. and feature it in a new video.  [wink]

Regards,

Dr Drew

 

[festyrob]

id be interested in one as most of my work is in customers houses fitting kitchens and every bit of dust collection is appreciated by the customer

 

[Tyler Ernsberger]

All you have to do is convert your dust boot on a Dewalt to a Bosch cm12 dust boot and dust collection is around 90%.  The Kapex already has great dust collection.  Not sure why you would want to put it in a box.  The nice thing about the Kapex is its small light weight design.  Put a box around it doesn't make it a mobile saw anymore. 

 

[DrDrew]

All you have to do is convert your dust boot on a Dewalt to a Bosch cm12 dust boot and dust collection is around 90%.  The Kapex already has great dust collection.  Not sure why you would want to put it in a box.  The nice thing about the Kapex is its small light weight design.  Put a box around it doesn't make it a mobile saw anymore.

The DeWalt won the Dust Collection Comparison done by Woodworker's Journal... while the Bosch was dead last.

If you read the Kapex Dust Collection threads here in the Owner's Group... you will see that not everyone is happy with the standard Kapex, blade guard only, 90% dust collection rate.  This is a great tool if that's all that you need.

The enclosure is made of 1/8" plastic... not exactly heavy stuff.

 

[DB10]

Videos are a tad long!  Not really for my liking but good luck.

 

[nclemmons]

You might want to reach out to FastCap - they have a Miter Saw hood:

http://www.fastcap.com/estore/pc/ChopShop-Saw-Hood-p113.htm

But Paul, the founder also has a program for submitting ideas for tools and share in the profits with the inventor.

It sounds like you have done this in virtual space but have not built a prototype that shows how well it collects.  That would be a better demo to bring forward the discussion. 

Good luck -

 

[DrDrew]

You might want to reach out to FastCap - they have a Miter Saw hood:

http://www.fastcap.com/estore/pc/ChopShop-Saw-Hood-p113.htm

But Paul, the founder also has a program for submitting ideas for tools and share in the profits with the inventor.

It sounds like you have done this in virtual space but have not built a prototype that shows how well it collects.  That would be a better demo to bring forward the discussion. 

Good luck -

The Fastcap and other tent designs could bring an old miter saw up to Kapex collection levels... no better.  The volume is very large to accommodate all saws... which slows air flow.  One of my Masters degrees is engineering (PhD on hold right now)... but more importantly, I've been an engineering project manager for decades.  After doing simulations in virtual space for decades in the automotive industry... and reviewing simulations on a daily basis... I can tell by looking at the enclosure how much dust it will collect.

It sounds like I do not have a working model because you misread my post.  I have 2 enclosures... just challenged to record the results on video at the moment due to the intense light that a laser puts out.  I can see the effect... that very close to zero dust escapes.

 

[nclemmons]

The Fastcap and other tent designs could bring an old miter saw up to Kapex collection levels... no better.  The volume is very large to accommodate all saws... which slows air flow.  One of my Masters degrees is engineering (PhD on hold right now)... but more importantly, I've been an engineering project manager for decades.  After doing simulations in virtual space for decades in the automotive industry... and reviewing simulations on a daily basis... I can tell by looking at the enclosure how much dust it will collect.

It sounds like I do not have a working model because you misread my post.  I have 2 enclosures... just challenged to record the results on video at the moment due to the intense light that a laser puts out.  I can see the effect... that very close to zero dust escapes.

i did misread your post.  Good to hear you have a working model.  You may still want to chat with Paul at FastCap if you want to commercialize your product idea.

 

[DrDrew]

The Fastcap and other tent designs could bring an old miter saw up to Kapex collection levels... no better.  The volume is very large to accommodate all saws... which slows air flow.  One of my Masters degrees is engineering (PhD on hold right now)... but more importantly, I've been an engineering project manager for decades.  After doing simulations in virtual space for decades in the automotive industry... and reviewing simulations on a daily basis... I can tell by looking at the enclosure how much dust it will collect.

It sounds like I do not have a working model because you misread my post.  I have 2 enclosures... just challenged to record the results on video at the moment due to the intense light that a laser puts out.  I can see the effect... that very close to zero dust escapes.

i did misread your post.  Good to hear you have a working model.  You may still want to chat with Paul at FastCap if you want to commercialize your product idea.

I appreciate your suggestion... but I have my own patent law firm if I decide to file a patent.  By broadcasting Prior Art here and on other sites, I have the right to file a patent for one year.

I have bigger projects in the Automotive Industry to patent right now.

Feel free to build one - watch the videos - and watch out for more on YouTube.

 

[Kev]

[member=60760]DrDrew[/member]

The KAPEX and particularly the KAPEX + UG Set are exceptional because of the size, weight and portability.

Boxing it in with a hard shell to improve DC detracts from portability.

If I was going to build a permanent station for an SCMS, I'd choose something with a larger cut capacity. If I wasn't satisfied with the DC I would fashion a base with strategically placed ports for high volume downward suction as I would never was to clutter the workspace around and above an SCMS with a hood.

If I did want to fabricate a KAPEX specific hood with the purpose of it also being portable, I'd design it using a light weight "spring loaded tent pole" style frame and a "clip to" shroud that incorporated a suction connection. A clear front flap could be incorporated into the design, but I'd avoid it for the sake of simplicity. Something that could fit into a hiking tent sized bag wouldn't be too cumbersome to carry with the UG Set and could then be selectively deployed if the cutting environment dictated the need. Obviously another DC unit will be needed ... and daisy chaining them for auto starting is a NO NO [scared] [smile]

Other people have boxed in their SCMS's, lathes and similar tools with cocoons and are probably happy with the results, so please take this as feedback from my perspective - not criticism.

 

[Tyler Ernsberger]

This is a Dewalt 12in dual bevel with a Bosch CM12 dust shoot.  The shoot is at the back of the blade and follows the saw down when I make a cut.  I would say 90% of the dust is contained and the remaining 10% being small chips.  I'm able to cut inside a finished space with no issues. 

[attachimg=2]

 

[Cheese]

Interesting but...no thanks. As we say in the motorcycle world, less is more. So be it with this Kapex accessory. If I can capture 80-95% of the dust (just pick your number) with the Kapex with a 36mm hose, why would I want to operate a Kapex that's been subjected to solitary confinement so that I can remove an additional 5-15% of the dust? Seems like an unnecessary solution to produce a minimal increase in efficiency. Am I missing something here?

When it comes to cleaning up nuclear waste 5-15% is important...when cleaning up saw dust...not so much.

 

[P2P]

[/quote]

The DeWalt won the Dust Collection Comparison done by Woodworker's Journal... while the Bosch was dead last.

[/quote]

He says that he used the same Freud blade for each test.  Yet when he shows the close up shot of the Bosch it clearly does not have the Freud blade installed.  And he start off standing next to the Kapex yet doesn't seem to include it for his comparisons. He says he's testing seven saws, but the Kapex would make eight.

???

So did the DeWalt really win the comparison?

 

[Nat X]

Makes me wonder why more lawyers don't design tools.

OK, not really.

 

[DrDrew]

[member=60760]DrDrew[/member]

The KAPEX and particularly the KAPEX + UG Set are exceptional because of the size, weight and portability.

Boxing it in with a hard shell to improve DC detracts from portability.

If I was going to build a permanent station for an SCMS, I'd choose something with a larger cut capacity. If I wasn't satisfied with the DC I would fashion a base with strategically placed ports for high volume downward suction as I would never was to clutter the workspace around and above an SCMS with a hood.

If I did want to fabricate a KAPEX specific hood with the purpose of it also being portable, I'd design it using a light weight "spring loaded tent pole" style frame and a "clip to" shroud that incorporated a suction connection. A clear front flap could be incorporated into the design, but I'd avoid it for the sake of simplicity. Something that could fit into a hiking tent sized bag wouldn't be too cumbersome to carry with the UG Set and could then be selectively deployed if the cutting environment dictated the need. Obviously another DC unit will be needed ... and daisy chaining them for auto starting is a NO NO [scared] [smile]

Other people have boxed in their SCMS's, lathes and similar tools with cocoons and are probably happy with the results, so please take this as feedback from my perspective - not criticism.

I appreciate your input.

I've been woodworking 30+ years... and only worked one summer as a finish carpenter on job sites... while I was a starving grad student.  Since then... I've had many iterations of a basement shop for a serious Woodworking hobby.

My goal is a Dustless Woodworking Shop.

I think that a 4-year old could carry this enclosure... and it fits in the Kapex stand... but if you trade guys don't want it at a job site... that's fine with me.

I've been on hundreds of job sites... all over the planet... but my tools today are a hard had and CAD Applications... and decades of Project Management and Engineering.

I wear a mask in China because the air sucks... but I am not that concerned about the health issues of breathing sawdust... because to me... it smells like home.

This enclosure is great for me... not so great for you.

That's why we have different viewpoints.

 

[DrDrew]

The DeWalt won the Dust Collection Comparison done by Woodworker's Journal... while the Bosch was dead last.

[/quote]

He says that he used the same Freud blade for each test.  Yet when he shows the close up shot of the Bosch it clearly does not have the Freud blade installed.  And he start off standing next to the Kapex yet doesn't seem to include it for his comparisons. He says he's testing seven saws, but the Kapex would make eight.

???

So did the DeWalt really win the comparison?
[/quote]

If you look at the comments below this comparison... you will see that I was not a big fan of these guys either...

...and I agree... the Kapex would have won easily...IF it was included.

 

[DrDrew]

Interesting but...no thanks. As we say in the motorcycle world, less is more. So be it with this Kapex accessory. If I can capture 80-95% of the dust (just pick your number) with the Kapex with a 36mm hose, why would I want to operate a Kapex that's been subjected to solitary confinement so that I can remove an additional 5-15% of the dust? Seems like an unnecessary solution to produce a minimal increase in efficiency. Am I missing something here?

When it comes to cleaning up nuclear waste 5-15% is important...when cleaning up saw dust...not so much.

I've been riding motorcycles since I was 15... and I've never been without one.  IT seems to me that "the Motorcycle World" has more variation that the woodworking world.

If you ever want to see a great Motorcycling video... look up this in YouTube:

Red Square Harley Owners Group - Trip to Italy

Found it: 

Amazing how much money these Russians spend on bikes and Harley clothes.

I've worked in Russia - cool people

 

[AndyUK]

Although your idea of looking for airborne dust moving through a laser line possibly would work it wouldn't give you an accurate measurement to record the data.
Surely as an engineer you would want to use a tried and tested method such as a particle counter like this? :

 

[DrDrew]

WRONG...

And where would you place your "particle counter"... move it around outside the saw?

These Particle Meters or Air Quality Meters are popular now to measure PM2.5 particles in polluted areas... and work only when the air is saturated to a somewhat consistent extent... since the air has to pass by a 1/2 CM laser located inside the unit.  The US Embassy in Beijing uses these to measure Air Quality... but the air is uniformly saturated with particles.

That's a C R A Z Y idea.