Just realized the disadvantage of cutting on the MFT...

[Julian Tracy]

I have three of the 48 tooth blades, so I figured I'd do some testing to see which might need sharpening.  Tested on basic cheap white Melamine board, which is the toughest stuff to get good cuts on.

All gave near perfect results on the top edge.  All but one had some significant chipout on the bottom (underside) of the cut.  Had a theory that maybe it was because of the limited depth you have to be set at so you don't chew up the top, so I did a test off the MFT with the blade lower by about 1/2" more.  Result is near perfect as the top of cut.

Damn!  I thought there'd be only pluses with the MFT, this is a huge disadvantage.    I know, the snobs will say, we don't use lowly crap like Melamine, but the fact is, it makes for durable, easy to clean and simple built in bookshelves that have a place in some remodels.

And this is not with a dogged out table surface, actually it's a relatively clean and narrow single kerf table top.

Why doesn't Festool introduce a TCG-type blade for Melamine board?  I have a specific type one from CMT for my 12" saw.  Same teeth pattern as the Festool plastics blade.  Anybody use the plastics blade for Melamine?

JT

 

[sw1211]

Have you checked the Tenryu blade offerings, they might have something.

 

[Brice Burrell]

I believe the late John Lucas did a test with all of the Festool blades and found the stock 48t blade preformed best on melamine.    

 

[blanning]

I have three of the 48 tooth blades, so I figured I'd do some testing to see which might need sharpening.  Tested on basic cheap white Melamine board, which is the toughest stuff to get good cuts on.

All gave near perfect results on the top edge.  All but one had some significant chipout on the bottom (underside) of the cut.  Had a theory that maybe it was because of the limited depth you have to be set at so you don't chew up the top, so I did a test off the MFT with the blade lower by about 1/2" more.  Result is near perfect as the top of cut.

Damn!  I thought there'd be only pluses with the MFT, this is a huge disadvantage.    I know, the snobs will say, we don't use lowly crap like Melamine, but the fact is, it makes for durable, easy to clean and simple built in bookshelves that have a place in some remodels.

And this is not with a dogged out table surface, actually it's a relatively clean and narrow single kerf table top.

Why doesn't Festool introduce a TCG-type blade for Melamine board?  I have a specific type one from CMT for my 12" saw.  Same teeth pattern as the Festool plastics blade.  Anybody use the plastics blade for Melamine?

JT

You could put another board under the melamine.

I thought there was a melamine blade.

brian

 

[Julian Tracy]

I guess the question is, can you set the MFT3 guide rail off to the right so that the blade was hanging off the table a bit.  If the table surface offers no real anti-chip properties, why bother cutting into it?

Another thing that's not too impressive - and I've head it brought up elsewhere, is the front rail support has some slot in it where it interfaces in the undergroove of the rail.

A full 1/32" play to and fro.  Not sure why it's not a tapered design to allow it to seat fully and tightly.

Anybody else notice that?  For precision stuff, that's a lot of play.

JT

 

[ccarrolladams]

Julian,
My experience is that Festool plunge saws are designed to work best when the splinter guards are making solid contact with the work on top and the bottom of the work is also in firm contact with a relatively smooth and solid sacrificial surface. So, my own practice which has been very successful for me, is to use sheets of cabinet 19mm plywood as the sacrificial surface. The price of shop birch plywood is noting compared to the high-quality plywood we use of most parts of cabinets.

I prefer to clamp my guide rails, as much to hold the work tight to the sacrificial surface as to ensure the rail does not move.

My experience is that the  48 tooth 2.2mm kerf Fine Tooth blade shipped on the TS55 is very good for breaking down pltwood and ending up with a glue-ready edge.

However, I switch to the Festool Solid Surface/Laminate blade for Melamine and similar products. On my sliding table cabinet saw and on my pressure beam saw I cut Melamine and laminates using the scoring feature, but those do not exist on hand saws. On the big saws I do also switch to a blade designed for laminates. The Festool Solid Surface blade for the TS55 is also 48 tooth.

One serious problem with the new catalog is the typos on pages 62 and 63 dealing with circular saw blades. So I will not cite cat. numbers. All the current Festool TS55 blades have a 2.2mm kerf. The Festool Solid Surface blade is carbide tipped TC, while the Fine tooth is carbide tipped ATB, Each has a purpose. On my big saws I use ATB for plywood and TC for laminates.

When I use a MFT as a cutting surface, I make sure the cut runs between rows of holes. Most of my work tables have the same hole pattern over 4x10' which we make on our CNC machine.

Give these suggestions a try. I think you will be pleased with the results.

I have three of the 48 tooth blades, so I figured I'd do some testing to see which might need sharpening.  Tested on basic cheap white Melamine board, which is the toughest stuff to get good cuts on.

All gave near perfect results on the top edge.  All but one had some significant chipout on the bottom (underside) of the cut.  Had a theory that maybe it was because of the limited depth you have to be set at so you don't chew up the top, so I did a test off the MFT with the blade lower by about 1/2" more.  Result is near perfect as the top of cut.

Damn!  I thought there'd be only pluses with the MFT, this is a huge disadvantage.    I know, the snobs will say, we don't use lowly crap like Melamine, but the fact is, it makes for durable, easy to clean and simple built in bookshelves that have a place in some remodels.

And this is not with a dogged out table surface, actually it's a relatively clean and narrow single kerf table top.

Why doesn't Festool introduce a TCG-type blade for Melamine board?  I have a specific type one from CMT for my 12" saw.  Same teeth pattern as the Festool plastics blade.  Anybody use the plastics blade for Melamine?

JT

 

[Julian Tracy]

I just picked up one of those Plastics blades, I'll give it a try.  But if I can get a clean cut without even trying (with a quite used 48 tooth standard blade) just by lowering the blade a bit, that is easier than using some sacrificial cutting surface.  That's just one more darn thing to get in the way and shift and whatnot.

On the jobsite - simpler = better.

I find clamping the rails is only necessary with slippery stuff or very critical stuff or bevel cuts.  Clamping at the ends does nothing to pull the rail tight in the middle.

JT

 

[tiralie]

I cut melamine with my 55 all the time. Melamine is difficult to work with but is great for some things such as closet organizers etc.
There is differences in the quality of melamine. Depending on the supplier and even through the thicknesses (1/2", 5/8", 3/4" etc.) the big box store melamine will vary in quality. If you can get your melamine from a supplier that sells "cabinet grade" materials.
Out of the box the standard Festool blade (48T) cuts one side of melamine very clean. The other side left or right side depending on the cut has more or less chips in it. Over time the Festool blade seems to dull faster and show more chips than either the  Tenryu blade or even the Freud blade designed for the 55. Even after cleaning the blade, you cannot get as many good cuts with the Festool blade as you can with the Tenryu or Freud blades. Both blades have a 2.2mm kerf.
So, it's important to use good quality melamine, support the underside as ccarrolladams has indicated, make sure there is no "slop" when running the saw on the rail.

 

[ccarrolladams]

Tim R is absolutely correct, not all so-called Melamine is created equal.

My experience is that the Solid Surface/Laminate Festool blade out-performs the other brands using a TS55 cutting laminates and I have tried them all.

Of course there are many reasons shops like mine invest in pressure beam saws. When the work is moving on a beam saw the air table lifts the bottom of the work. The air is turned off and the pressure beams clamp the top of the work to the table just before the blade is moved underneath. The table's slot is just the width of the thickest kerf, which with my blades on that saw vary from 4.8mm to 5.2mm The beams only have a 6.0mm gap, so they function like the splinter guards of a Festool system on steroids.

The scoring saw runs in reverse of the main blade and turns much faster. It is ahead of the main blade. A benefit is the combination of a scoring blade and a main blade is you get far more than twice the feet of cut per sharpening. I use over 100 sheets of the best Melamine my wholesaler can sell me every week. We have not been embarrassed by a chip-out or tear-out since our beam saw became operational last August.

Our large Felder sliding table saw has a scoring unit which can be parked to allow use of 550mm blades. We use those when ripping thick rough pieces of hardwood. That does not benefit from a scoring cut. The melamine blades for the Felder are smaller so we can and do use the scoring saw. The beam saw only makes right angle cuts. We cut miters on plywood with guide rails and the TS55, but whenever possible we make the miters on melamine using the slider saw with the appropriate blade.

My experience is that using a beam saw improves the performance of less expensive melamine. I assume this is why Ikea uses so many beam saws.

 

[tiralie]

My experience is that the Solid Surface/Laminate Festool blade out-performs the other brands using a TS55 cutting laminates and I have tried them all.

Hmmm, I have not tried the Solid Surface/Laminate blade.
Sometime ago someone on this forum did a test and didn't rate it very highly.
I will pick some up and see how they compare to the Tenryu and Freud blades.

Careful handling Melamine, a freshly cut panel can really shred your hands unless you use gloves. I like the fastcap "skin" gloves. 
Tim

 

[Julian Tracy]

I've always heard about the myth of different grades of Melamine, but the stuff I get from my pro plywood house is just as crappy when cutting as the stuff at HD.

And this is a plywood shop that specializes in cabinet grade plywood.  They carry Melamine in 20 different colors.

Either way, it's a bear to cut.

JT

 

[Sparktrician]

I've been using my own TS55 for cutting melamine with no problems.  Depending on the item's visibility, I may do a light scoring cut on the opposite side before making the plunge cut to ensure a clean cut on both sides.  Also, if I don't do a scoring cut first, I have to make sure that the underside is fully supported by a slab of foamboard to get a clean cut.  If cutting on a well-used MFT top, the pre-existing kerf will cause minor chipping unless the foamboard is used. 

[smile]

 

[AlexThePalex]

I use the solid surface/laminate blade with the CS70 all the time for melamine and it works great. No tear out at all on both sides as long as the blade stays reasonably sharp. I also found that the 48 blade works very good. However, the 48 blade needs to be razorsharp. As soon as it dulls just a little bit you'll get tear out.

 

[mouppe]

Another thing that's not too impressive - and I've head it brought up elsewhere, is the front rail support has some slot in it where it interfaces in the undergroove of the rail.

A full 1/32" play to and fro.  Not sure why it's not a tapered design to allow it to seat fully and tightly.

Anybody else notice that?  For precision stuff, that's a lot of play.

JT

Wrap some masking tape around the tooth on the front rail support to thicken it up a bit. This will take out the slop.

 

[junk731]

An alternative to melamine on particle board is melamine on MDF. Much easier to get a superior cut, weight and cost is about the same.

John

 

[USPcompact]

Another thing that's not too impressive - and I've head it brought up elsewhere, is the front rail support has some slot in it where it interfaces in the undergroove of the rail.

A full 1/32" play to and fro.  Not sure why it's not a tapered design to allow it to seat fully and tightly.

Anybody else notice that?  For precision stuff, that's a lot of play.

JT

Wrap some masking tape around the tooth on the front rail support to thicken it up a bit. This will take out the slop.

Do that, or offset the guide rail just a bit so you have to move it slightly to the left (when facing the table) in order for it to engage the tooth. 

 

[tjbnwi]

Cut a piece of 1 1/2" thick foam that is the size of the MFT top. Place that on the MFT, place the melamine on the foam, raise the rail brackets to the proper height, set the saw to cut the additional 1/2" into the foam.

Tom