Mini Cyclones for CT 22, CT 33 et al

[T. Michael]

Hi, I'm transferring 3 posts from What size hose for my CT 22 topic where Toolpig wanted to hook up a table saw to his CT 22E.  Corwin suggested I start a new topic, and I thought these three topics might get one going.  Mike
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I got the Clear Vue first, less expensive, direct to 2.25 vacuum hose right out of the box.  But, one has to make an adapter to a 5 gallon bucket.  So, fishing around the basement, found my wife's old beer making kit with a screw on lid to a 5 gallon bucket.  ( she hasn't noticed it's gone yet). 

It is way cool to watch the chips go round and round, then down.  Some light one's just go round and round til you turn it off.  Interesting.  This one I have hooked up to a Lee Valley clear tube dust collection kit, plumbed up the the ceiling, with drops for my sanders over the work bench.  Sort of a poor man's boom arm, but with three drops, and little gates.  I hooked up a multi outlet extension cord so that it terminates at each vacuum drop.  I can have two or three sanders plugged in at once, and each will actuate the vacuum -- in this case a WAP.

Also hook up the Domino to it, and that works great.  But, as someone said I loose the anti static feature of the hose.  No sparks and fires, but a little van de graff (sp?) generated spark goes from my knuckle to the hose coming out of the side of the Domino.  Tickling, but irritating.  May have to figure out how to ground that later.

Got the Dust Deputy a year later, after I got the CT 33 for the router table.  That one is, so far, dedicated.  DD makes one with 1.5" hose inleta and outlets, steel, very subtantial. The also offer a 2" model for an up lift to an already high price.  But, it does come with the clampable 5 gallon steel bucket with a big O-ring around the lid.  Bolt it together and you're almost ready to go.  you have to figure out how to get form 1.5 or 2.0 inches up to 2 1/4"; standard shop vac and US CT hose fitting size.  Dust Deputy sell their own hoses, but I chose to adapt to my nice Festool ones.  Also lost the grounding feature because I used wood and plastic step up and step down hose adapters.

Like them both, Dust Deputy  is more stable on the ground, (shorter, and wider)  Clear Vue seems to have all the features of their big cyclones; angled input, long slim taper.  And the plastic is tough.  It's fallen over several times, no damage whatsoever.  Both seem to catch a lot of chips.

I'll take pics tomorrow and post them of each system.

Hope this helps.  Ask any questions of things I may have over looked.

Mike

 

[T. Michael]

2nd copied message, from Corwin.

Mike,  Thanks for all the info on your cyclone setups!  I will also be looking forward to further information and photos you have to share as I have had one of these little babies on my wish list for some time now.  Haven't gone back to check, but those must have been your photos on the old board that showed a cyclone sitting atop a CT -- in any event, that was a sweet looking setup. 

I had read elswhere some time ago that the guys at ClearVue felt that tools like router tables and planers produced too much (volume & size) waste for vacuum-based dust control, and a larger DC system would be required.  But I really don't want a separate DC system for just these tools -- well, not if my CT will work.  So, how well do these systems work on your planer and router table? 

May need to start a new thread, 'cause I am sure this will stir up a few more questions 

Thanks,
Corwin

 

[T. Michael]

3rd copied message: from me.
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Hi Corwin,

I know these photo's don't pass the uncluttered test, so I hope they suffice.

The first pic shows my mini dust collection system with a WAP, Clear Vue cyclone and Lee Valley small tube plastic distribution system along with a multi-tap extension cord.http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=30042&cat=1,42401 http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=51162&cat=1,240,41065

Second pic shows 2 of the 3 down drops (one off camera to the right).  I didn't glue the plastic tubing, so can swing it up and down in one axis.

Pic 3 shows the small blast gate and power connection.  As someone noted the other day, this does lose the anti-static feature of the hose.

Pic 4 is the CT-33 and the Dust Deputy dedicated to the router station.

Pic 5 is another view of the Dust Deputy and various hose adapters.  This Dust Deputy is the large model with a 2" port; their standard is 1 1/2" port (may be fine, but I wanted one nearer to the Festool hose size.)  .

Any other details needed?

Best, Mike 

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Clear Vue & WAP.jpg (36.67 KB, 600x450 - viewed 3 times.)

Festool vac drops.jpg (42.05 KB, 600x450 - viewed 3 times.)

Elec & Vac connection.jpg (30.19 KB, 400x533 - viewed 3 times.)

Dust Deputy & CT 33.jpg (53.82 KB, 600x450 - viewed 3 times.)

Dust Deputy Connections closeup.jpg (42.61 KB, 600x450 - viewed 3 times.)

Report to moderator    71.131.200.87 

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T. Michael Ward

 

[Dan Clark]

Mike,

Very cool!  Many thanks for posting the pics.

Regards,

Dan

 

[Corwin]

Thank you so much for posting this!  I have been very interested in these cyclones.  I thought either unit would work with CT vacs for sanding, but wondered if the waste from larger chip producers (like a router table and benchtop planer) would merely blow on through to the vac.  Sounds as if these units a working good enough.

Now I'll have to look into the antistatic aspect of connecting a system together...  I am guessing that one could attach copper wire to a Festool AS fitting and fix wire both inside and out of the cyclone, then to another AS fitting to complete the circuit.  Would you need to do a similar thing at the tool end?  With our rubber hose ends, I wouldn't think so.

I'll have a few projects ahead of this cyclone thing, but this will remain on the to-do list.

Thanks again,
Corwin

 

[James Metcalf]

Corwin

Here is a more thorough explanation from the Festool knowledge base:

What makes an antistatic hose antistatic is that it conducts static electricity to ground. Festool antistatic hoses have no visible electric leads; the high-carbon plastic they are made from conducts high voltage. The tool is grounded by way of the hose, through dust extractor, to the ground where it is plugged. If there is an open ground where the dust extractor is plugged, there is still the possibility of electric shock from the high voltage static charge produced by moving dust.

Some dust extraction systems have a visible copper lead where you attach the hose. In that case, the conductive Festool antistatic hose will work to ground the tool to that dust extraction system. The ground must be continuous however for the system to work. The outlet it's plugged into must be grounded for the system to be antistatic.

Shop vacs are generally not antistatic. If you are using your Festool with a standard shop vac or another brand of dust extractor that is not antistatic then there is no need to purchase an antistatic hose, it won't eliminate static charge.

Best Regards
James Metcalf

 

[Corwin]

Thanks James, I had read that and taken it to mean that I could in fact connect a copper wire between the AS fittings at either end of a cyclone.  As to the tool end, I can only guess that there is no need -- and the tool would be connected the the vacs power supply.  Am I missing something?

Corwin

 

[Tinker]

I admit it, when it comes to electricity, i am totally stupid.  When i was learning the building trades back in the late 40's and into the 50's, I tried everything.  It did not take me very long to find out i hated working with BX cables as i had to tie myself into knots just to cut the stuff.  you right handed guys do not, and never will, have the slightest idea of what i am talking about.  anyhow, as i hated working with that darned BX cable, i developed an almost equal dislikeing towards working with anything electric.  If i plugged it in and it did not work, i always had lots of friends in the trades who were glad to swap a smmall electrical problem for a small (and sometimes large) masonry (my main area of expertise) project.  voila! Who needs to know ANY THING about electricity.  a week or so ago, we had a problem in our house where all lights, stove, TV, computer, etc, every thing except the fridge.  i was telling a friend about the problem.  he started telling me what to do about it.  I told him i had a fol proof method.  i just go to the wall by my kitchen door, look at a small list that is stashed there, start punching key buttons on the funny looking little box on the wall, and within a very short time, a truck come driving into my yard loaded with two men and lots of tools, and even more knowledge.  And that is the extent of my electrical knowledge.  And, guess what!!!  I am happy as lonf as when i plug in my Festool toys, they continue to make noise.

What my question is, after reading the above, I am still not quite sure if i would need to run some sort of a wire from hose to hose to bypass the cyclone?  Or do i run one thru the cyclone? 

I have looked at cyclones as a way to cut down on bag emtying frequency of my CT's.  also, i have been concerned about someday a large piece of wood coliding with the motor on my Penn State 4" vac.  So far, I use that only for my planer, so I don't run into the problem, but i do wonder about it.  From looking at the above pics (after being directed to Oneida web site which was also helpful), i can see the major problem i have had with thinking about cyclones has now been solved.  I do not have anywhere near the headroom for a fullsized cyclone.  This little Dust Deputy looks to be jst the ticket for my shop.  And it could be portable so i can hook up to all of my toys, except, probably the planer.  I think it would even work with my HL 850hand planer. 

i just am not exactly sure of the exact proper way to eliminate static problems.  i have never had a problem there, so i guess what my grandmother used to say (Ignorance is Bliss) is true.  The one thng i have always been very careful of as far as fire hazzard, is to NEVER pile rags, brushes or any materials even spotted with flammable or finishing materials of any kind or fuel and oil on them.  Even when my crew is working outside, away from buildings, i go ballistic about that.  i don't sand off finishes from anything, even if they are totally dry and cured, without throwing out the sanding dust IMMEDIATELY.  Been there, seen that, just never want it to happen to me.  how many here have seen barns burn down just from a little bit of wet hay.  this is off topic, i admit, but it doesn't hurt to return a little of the enlightenment about fire hazzard you guys have been aiming my way.
Thanks
Tinker

 

[James Metcalf]

Corwin & Tinker

Sorry for slow response on static aspect, we have a lot going on. Short answer is in my view is you are not missing anything.We have some on the forum with more electrons above the neck than I do  and who may have more clarity on the subject.Try "rick_christopherson"

 

[Corwin]

Hydraulics and pneumatics are more where I live.

In addition to machining metal, I also worked with hydraulics and pneumatics prior to getting into computers.  And here we are playing with wood...

Thanks for your input,
Corwin

 

[Michael Kellough]

Have you pneumatics guys seen this? Festo muscle;
http://news.thomasnet.com/fullstory/6158/1620

 

[James Metcalf]

Thats deep .I think I need to stay with simple Hydraulic cylinders.They only need an OL to be Festool.
James Metcalf

 

[3mbjts]

Hi Mike,
Have you figured out a way to stop the static charge on your CT33 and Dust deputy? I have a similar setup with a CT22, but because of the rubber connectors for hose adapters, I get quite a bit of static charge. Not quite sure how to solve this,  and any help would be appreciated.
Thanks, Mike

 

[larrysee]

Here is an easy way to carry electrical continuity across an insulator (plastic cyclone, rubber fittings). Get some thin copper adhesive tape about a quarter to half inch wide and run a strip across the object so that the conductive parts are touching the tape on either side.

e.g., for the rubber fitting, run a strip of tape across the outside from one side to the other, wrapping the tape over into the inside to secure it and provide the contact to the hoses. Clean well before applying.

Google "copper tape" for lots of sources.

Regards, Larry

 

[Dave Ronyak]

I have not noticed a static build-up problem with my DD setup using Festool hoses and rubber adapters from Oneida and the plumbing section of HD.  But your copper tape idea is an elegantly simple solution!

Dave R.

 

[Don Bullock]

What do I need to hook the Oneida Dust Deputy hose to a Festool sander. Is there an adaptor that will make the connection? ???

 

[Eli]

So, fishing around the basement, found my wife's old beer making kit with a screw on lid to a 5 gallon bucket.  ( she hasn't noticed it's gone yet). 

I'm just wondering why nobody has noticed that you cut off your supply of free beer! You would really put DC in line in front of a beer making wife? Man, you got the bug bad! To hell with the static and dust, I wants the beer!

 

[Dave Ronyak]

What do I need to hook the Oneida Dust Deputy hose to a Festool sander. Is there an adaptor that will make the connection? ???

For the hookup of the vacuum machine end (of any Festool hose (27, 36, or 50 mm diameter) you need to get one of those rubber reducing adapters that can be found in the plumbing section of a hardware or Home Depot or Lowe's store.  I can't remember the exact size.  If you have a Festool 36 mm hose and are willing to remove the fitting from the end of the hose, it will fit snugly over the inlet fitting of Oneida's metal Dust Deputy, which is a nominal 1 1/2 inch OD.

Dave R.