Moving the TS-55 between festool and makita tracks

[mikev12345]

Right I have a TS-55 with a 55" track.  I'd like to get a few additional Festool tracks in the future especially the LR-32 version.  However the Festool 118" is about 4 times the cost of the Makita 118.  I was thinking of getting the Makita track but started to wonder how tight the fit would be and would I have to adjust my saw for the Makita track.  Curious to hear from others who have tried or are moving their saws between different track vendors. 

 

[TSO_Products]

[member=76417]mikev12345[/member] – “Don’t mix track brands”

as critical as guide rails are to track saws performance, I salute you for thinking ahead and asking first before “leaping” into a mix of system components.

Being the worlds undisputed Guide Rail Square innovator helps keep us abreast of all major guide rail brands and a cross section of customer experiences with different brands. Just because you can get your track saw / plunge saw to sit and slide on a guide rail does not translate into an optimized fit and performance. Why complicate your life with the introduction of variables?

Hans

 

[RussellS]

I do not have any experience with using the two rail brands on my 55 Festool saw.  But looking at the current prices right now, $235 for Makita 3meter or $545 for Festool 3meter, I would definitely go with the Makita and make any adjustments if needed.  For a $310 to $330 (sales tax) difference, I would make adjustments.  Or just consider buying a separate track saw with the difference in the guide rail prices.  The Festool 55 saw only, no track, is $599.  Only $270 more and you get 2 Festool track saws.  One dedicated exclusively to the Makita 3000 rail only.  Or just buy a separate Makita track saw.  Amazon is selling the Makita track saw only for an extra $369.  No track or case.  Just the saw.

So your choice is buy the Festool 3000 rail for $545.  Or buy the Makita 3000 rail AND Makita track saw for $604.  Not really that tough of a choice in my mind.

 

[ChuckM]

Another factor to consider is how often you'd need to make adjustments (in order to use the Makita track). If all the time, the saving might not be so attractive. But if you don't use the long track often enough, making the adjustments shouldn't impose lots of inconvenience to you. The saving shouldn't be ignored.

 

[mikev12345]

So your choice is buy the Festool 3000 rail for $545.  Or buy the Makita 3000 rail AND Makita track saw for $604.  Not really that tough of a choice in my mind.

Right now in Canada I can get the Makita 118" inch guide rail for $198 CAD. I get the Festool 3000 rail is $755.  If I had the battery festool TS I wholeheartedly considered getting the Makita TS to go with there rail.

I might just end up getting two 55" festool rails and permanently join them with the guild rail connectors. The new festool connectors are suppose to be much better. 

 

[krudawg]

Right I have a TS-55 with a 55" track.  I'd like to get a few additional Festool tracks in the future especially the LR-32 version.  However the Festool 118" is about 4 times the cost of the Makita 118.  I was thinking of getting the Makita track but started to wonder how tight the fit would be and would I have to adjust my saw for the Makita track.  Curious to hear from others who have tried or are moving their saws between different track vendors.

I bought the 118 Makita guide rail for taking down sheet goods on my STM 1800 and my TS55.  I have not experienced any issues as of yet.  Still using the  Shorter Festool Guide Rail on my MFT

 

[alltracman78]

I have all 3 Makita rails, plus the Makita saw.
I also have the Festool long and short FSK rails, along with a HK55, HK85, and a TS75.
The Festools run fine on the Makita track, but the saw blades are somewhere between 1/16" and 1/31" further from the track. So if I run my Makita on the track the splinter strip doesn't "seat" against the Festool blades. Nor can I use the edge of the strip as an exact line up guide.
Also IIRC the Makita guide rail in the center is very slightly thinner than the Festool, though that may also have to do with the Festool I'm comparing being the FSK rails and not the regular ones.

I also recently ran into the fact the Makita rails have a guide strip on the outer rail that the anti tip lever rides under. The Festool rails don't have this.
This means any rail adapter for a Festool tool that's designed to ride on the outer rail won't fit.

I had already been considering it just because, but that's going to drive me to pick up some Festool rails. Not right away because I have other things in line. And I may just join several shorter rails instead of buying the longer ones. Haven't decided which yet.

 

[alltracman78]

Carvex rail attachment on Makita rail.
[attachimg=1]

 

[Crazyraceguy]

Right I have a TS-55 with a 55" track.  I'd like to get a few additional Festool tracks in the future especially the LR-32 version.  However the Festool 118" is about 4 times the cost of the Makita 118.  I was thinking of getting the Makita track but started to wonder how tight the fit would be and would I have to adjust my saw for the Makita track.  Curious to hear from others who have tried or are moving their saws between different track vendors.

I bought the 118 Makita guide rail for taking down sheet goods on my STM 1800 and my TS55.  I have not experienced any issues as of yet.  Still using the  Shorter Festool Guide Rail on my MFT

Assuming that the rails are either new, or have a fresh anti-splinter strip, there should be no problem. The saw cuts the strip to match it. The problem with mixing rails is that there are enough differences in them that they don't fit together. Even if you never need to do that, you may still have to adjust the cams in the base to fit the track. Having to do that every time would get frustrating.

Also, that price difference is not even close. My 2022 catalog says the Festool rail is $435 and the Lowest price I see on Amazon for Makita is $350. Difference? sure. Significant? I'm not so sure.
A purchase like this is one of two things, a luxury/convenience or a commercial investment. At that point, the difference shrinks.

 

[ChuckM]

The convenience factor is important not just for those in the woodworking business, but also for amateur woodworkers who value productivity, of which I'm one. That's why I have multiples of identical tools -- tapes, squares, pencils, hearing and eye protections, etc. -- so I can put one at every machine/work station to keep me from walking around the shop just to grab a rule or an awl. Not only do I save time, but I also use my physical energy on what matters.

As a woodworker, if something becomes a frequent inconvenience in my shop, I'll try to make it away either by buying the right tool or more tools, or by coming up with a shop-made solution. I love to save money, but not when it is a "penny wise" act.

 

[RussellS]

Also, that price difference is not even close. My 2022 catalog says the Festool rail is $435 and the Lowest price I see on Amazon for Makita is $350. Difference? sure. Significant? I'm not so sure.

Do a Google search on Makita 3 meter rail and Festool 3 meter rail.  The Festool USA website lists the Festool FS 3000/2 at $545.  Tool Nut lists it for $545.  Acme Tools lists it for $545.  Diamond Tool .net lists it for $385.  They are in PA and NJ.  But extra shipping for oversized items.  Would have to check them out if wanting to buy this item.

Via Google search, the Makita 3 meter guide rail is $234 at Acme Tools.  They have a crazy $299 shipping charge on this item.  So I would need to drive 2 hours to a store "near" me to pick it up.  Place called Zoro has it for $256 + $145 shipping.  Tool Nut has it for $243 plus $50 delivery.  Place in Canada has it for $220 Canadian dollars I think.  Gosh!!!!!  Amazon is not always the lowest price on everything.

Amazon $350.  Tool Nut $293.  Acme $234 plus 4 hour round trip drive and gas.  $545 for the known Festool sellers.  Not sure about that super low price from Diamond Tool .net.  So it looks like a $200 to $300 price difference between Makita and Festool 3 meter rails.  Even if the Diamond Tool .net is real, its still $150 higher than Acme.

Maybe $150, $200, $300 is pocket change and means nothing.

 

[alltracman78]

4 Hour round trip (which is about $40 in gas for me), plus small amount of wear and tear on my vehicle, and 4 1/2+ hours of my time is definitely worth something to me. At LEAST $200, probably more if I sit down and calculate.

So $300 for the cheapest Makita 118 track.

Festool lists the 2700 (106 inches) at 465.
The 3000 (118 inches) is 545.

If all you want is to run your Makita (or Festool) track saw, sure, go Makita. I wouldn't have an issue. Not sure how long the groove thing would take to come into play, if ever. It could become a problem down the road, and cause some regrets. Dunno.

What if you have other Festool tools you want to run on your track. Now the Makita track could be a problem.
What if you want the Festool track with holes in it? Or the track with stickies to attach when you can't use clamps?
Someone mentioned mix and matching being a problem, and I would agree with that. So you're going to have a separate set of tracks to run this stuff? Now it becomes a hassle and extra storage.

If you don't want to buy/deal with the 3000, just pick up 2 or 3 1400s. They're not that hard to line up and are more flexible than 1 big.

Time is money, even if you're just a hobbiest. Unless you're single with no kids and nothing else to do $300 may (and can) be a lot short term, but it's not that much long term vs making things streamlined and simple.
Sometimes it's cheaper to spend the extra money.

 

[ferntree]

I remember reading elsewhere the saw is compatible, but other things might not be. I saw the pic of the carvex part. Not sure about parallel guides and other Festool accessories, etc. I was debating the Makita rail but paid the money to drive to woodcraft and fit the 3000 in my Honda Civic. It touched the rear trunk and the had an inch clearance from the windshield. I didn’t want to deal with whatever damage shipping it would entail. Both my MFT and STM were damaged in shipping. The replacement MFT extrusion was even more damaged than the original one. Hope this helps.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

I just checked it again, to make sure I didn't mis-read a line or something. My 2022 printed version of the catalog says item 491501 FS/3000 $435.
The online retailers have shipping problems with these monsters. It costs a ton and they still get damaged.
The losses just can't be worth the trouble.
This is the best item to buy from your local brick & mortar woodworking store. The "shipping" part of the deal happens going to them. Obviously, it helps if you are in a bigger city or at least a higher volume store.
I got both the FS/3000 and FS/2424 that way.
I have no idea where I could get a Makita that long in a retail store?

 

[RussellS]

I just checked it again, to make sure I didn't mis-read a line or something. My 2022 printed version of the catalog says item 491501 FS/3000 $435.

As of April 3, 2023, the Festool USA website lists the 491501 FS 3000/2 guide rail for $545.https://www.festoolusa.com/products/guide-systems/guide-rails/491501---fs-30002#Overview
I doubt Festool is going to honor its old, outdated 2022 catalog price.  It is April 2023 already.  I suspect the Festool 2022 print catalog was printed in September 2021.  1.5 years ago.  Is anything the same price today it was in September 2021?  I recall numerous threads over the past couple years talking about how Festool was raising prices on its products.  Looks like they raised the price on the 3 meter rail by $110.

I live 2 hours from a big city that has a tool store(s) that carry Festool products.  Long lengthy trip.  But if you are spending hundreds, thousands of dollars on once in a lifetime Festool products, probably worth it to spend a day doing it.

 

[RussellS]

4 Hour round trip (which is about $40 in gas for me), plus small amount of wear and tear on my vehicle, and 4 1/2+ hours of my time is definitely worth something to me. At LEAST $200, probably more if I sit down and calculate.

So $300 for the cheapest Makita 118 track.

Festool lists the 2700 (106 inches) at 465.
The 3000 (118 inches) is 545.

If all you want is to run your Makita (or Festool) track saw, sure, go Makita. I wouldn't have an issue. Not sure how long the groove thing would take to come into play, if ever. It could become a problem down the road, and cause some regrets. Dunno.

What if you have other Festool tools you want to run on your track. Now the Makita track could be a problem.
What if you want the Festool track with holes in it? Or the track with stickies to attach when you can't use clamps?
Someone mentioned mix and matching being a problem, and I would agree with that. So you're going to have a separate set of tracks to run this stuff? Now it becomes a hassle and extra storage.

If you don't want to buy/deal with the 3000, just pick up 2 or 3 1400s. They're not that hard to line up and are more flexible than 1 big.

Time is money, even if you're just a hobbiest. Unless you're single with no kids and nothing else to do $300 may (and can) be a lot short term, but it's not that much long term vs making things streamlined and simple.
Sometimes it's cheaper to spend the extra money.

In the third post in this thread I said for the difference in price between the Festool and Makita 3 meter tracks, about $300, you could simply buy a new Makita saw and run it exclusively on the Makita track.  Makita saw alone is $369.  No need to ever worry about switching accessories or saws between your Festool and Makita rails.  I assume the 3 meter rail would be exclusively used for cutting long straight edges on boards or for cutting the length of 4x8 plywood.  The 3 meter rail would not be used with accessories.

4 hour round trip, 250 miles.  Toyota Camry gets 30 mpg.  Camry has fold down rear seat so you can easily fit 9-10 foot long boards or guide rails through the trunk and have it rest on the dash.  8 gallons of gas at $3.00 per gallon.  Roughly.  $25 gas and time.  If you drive a pickup, you would be required to put the bed down and tie the rail into the bed somehow.  15 mpg truck.  My old 5.8 liter Ford 150 got that on the highway.  16.7 gallons.  $50 gas.  As for wear and tear, for vehicles which run 100,000 miles, or more, an extra 250 miles is nothing and costs a few pennies.

As for 4.5 hours of your time being worth at LEAST $200, that must mean you earn at least $44.44 per hour.  Or $92,444 per year.  Assuming it took you 15 minutes to read this thread and write your reply, you lost/wasted a potential $11.11.  I would guess most/many of the people participating in this forum are hobby woodworkers.  Not paid woodworkers.  So their woodworking time in the shop or participating in forums such as this or shopping for tools is free.  A hobby, diversion from real life.  They do it on the weekends when not at paid work.  So I don't think you can assign an hourly wage to that time.

 

[squall_line]

As for 4.5 hours of your time being worth at LEAST $200, that must mean you earn at least $44.44 per hour.  Or $92,444 per year.  Assuming it took you 15 minutes to read this thread and write your reply, you lost/wasted a potential $11.11.  I would guess most/many of the people participating in this forum are hobby woodworkers.  Not paid woodworkers.  So their woodworking time in the shop or participating in forums such as this or shopping for tools is free.  A hobby, diversion from real life.  They do it on the weekends when not at paid work.  So I don't think you can assign an hourly wage to that time.

I make less than $44.44 an hour at my paid job.  If I were to charge for my time independently doing what I do for a living, or using other skill sets that I have, it would likely be at a much higher rate than that (I charged significantly more than that per hour just to DJ weddings 15 years ago).

My son is less than 2 years old.  A 4.5-hour round trip plus shopping time at a woodworking store without him (because, let's be honest, neither he nor his mom are going to just hop up and jump in the car for that long and for that purpose voluntarily and if they did, it's not exactly quality time in the car) is worth a lot more than $200 when it comes to missing out on spending time with him at this point in his life, especially when it's also a weekend.

Reading this forum at night after he's gone to bed is practically free by comparison.

 

[JSmith]

I run the Makita track saw on both Festool and Makita tracks.  Not an exact match to the original question but for anyone interested... I have no issue switching between tracks using a single saw.  I do not combine Festool track with Makita track. 

Since I have both tracks today I too am considering getting the Makita 118" track as a convenience factor AND because the Festool track is more than double the price locally near me.  I can drive to Tool Nut and get the Makita 118" track for $250 + tax.  (April 2023)

The Festool 118" is $545 + Tax.  It's a no brainer for me.  Hope this helps someone else.

 

[mgrobins]

[member=76417]mikev12345[/member] – “Don’t mix track brands”

as critical as guide rails are to track saws performance, I salute you for thinking ahead and asking first before “leaping” into a mix of system components.

Being the worlds undisputed Guide Rail Square innovator helps keep us abreast of all major guide rail brands and a cross section of customer experiences with different brands. Just because you can get your track saw / plunge saw to sit and slide on a guide rail does not translate into an optimized fit and performance. Why complicate your life with the introduction of variables?

Hans

I became lost in that gratuitous self-plug and was wondering what your point was... do you consider the Makita track to be an improper fit for the TS55? If so, would you be kind enough to share with us why, and what steps you consider may overcome the limitations?

Some that come to my mind... Accessories that won't fit due to the extra extrusion that prevents the Makita saw from tipping (does that prevent any of the TSO squares fitting?); I think some have issues with the guide rail cams not being able to lock in on the makita track sufficiently too... that would mean slop and error.

 

[mikev12345]

[member=76417]mikev12345[/member] – “Don’t mix track brands”

as critical as guide rails are to track saws performance, I salute you for thinking ahead and asking first before “leaping” into a mix of system components.

Being the worlds undisputed Guide Rail Square innovator helps keep us abreast of all major guide rail brands and a cross section of customer experiences with different brands. Just because you can get your track saw / plunge saw to sit and slide on a guide rail does not translate into an optimized fit and performance. Why complicate your life with the introduction of variables?

Hans

I became lost in that gratuitous self-plug and was wondering what your point was... do you consider the Makita track to be an improper fit for the TS55? If so, would you be kind enough to share with us why, and what steps you consider may overcome the limitations?

Some that come to my mind... Accessories that won't fit due to the extra extrusion that prevents the Makita saw from tipping (does that prevent any of the TSO squares fitting?); I think some have issues with the guide rail cams not being able to lock in on the makita track sufficiently too... that would mean slop and error.

I believe my concerns and the general broader concerns are with the specifications of each track.  Though the tracks are cross compatible with each saw that doesn't mean the final specifications will be the same.  My Festool saw has been calibrated for my festool track to remove any side to side slop.  Now if you take your festool saw and put it on the makita track which may not have the exact same specifications you would have to modify the calibration to remove the slop from the makita track.  Then this means when going back to the festool track you would have to calibrate it again and it may not be 100% exact and you'll find your zero clear splinter guard is no longer zero clearance anymore.

That being said.  As long as people's experience indicate that there isn't a change in the side to side slop I can probably live with a single 118" makita rail that doesn't fit other festool accessories.