OF2200 router power issue?

[Taylorkitchens]

Hey guys, I'm new to the forum as I have just bought my first festool 'tool' being the of2200 router as I do a lot of kitchen fitting it seemed the best router. I have come across and issue with it and wanted to pick someone's brain about it.

I have had it 2 days, used it for the first time today off a Honda 5.5hp 2.7 kva generator, I also had a hilti vc20 vacuum running of that very same generator. While cutting my first masons mitre with both router and extractor running of the generator at the same time it's bog very slightly but work perfectly well at high speed. But when I got the my second joint, female and male cut and one bolt recess left to do then 2 joints router, it started to make a were'ing sound almost like when a generator starts to run out of petrol on the last bolt recess hole. It had got that far fine.

So I rung the guys where I bought it from and they said they'll send it back as I know the service is second to none when it comes to festool so I tried it off a transformer plugged to Mains fine, so i tried it on the generator this evening and when set to speed 6 it seemed to work fine again, but if I were to adjust that speed dial to 5 down to 1 it would make that were'ing sound and seem powerless.

What I can't work out is why it didn't do it from the word go?!

 

[galwaydude18@gmail.com]

I would use a 5kva transformer for what your doing. I don't think the variable electronics in Festool tool like generators

 

[Taylorkitchens]

so do you think its my generator thats just not powerful enough? its fine on speed 6 but if i were to move the dial or start it on any other speed other than 6 it almost seems to stop start stop start continuously.

also will the 16amp 110v socket make a difference?

 

[festoolviking]

Hi

Your generator is not powerfull enough.

OF2200 = 2200W
VC20= 1100-1200W

Adds up to 3400W (4,25 kva)

[sad]

Festoolviking

 

[Taylorkitchens]

It does that when it was just the router but only if I change the speed. How do you work out the kva on just the router?

 

[festoolviking]

Hi

I used this link:

http://www.rapidtables.com/convert/electric/watt-to-kva.htm

The power factor used is 0,8 so the formula is Wattage divided by 0,8 so the router kva would be 2,75kva just as much as your generator provide. But I think even that's on the limit considering the electronics in the router as mentioned before.
I'm not 100% sure about what power factor to use so if anyone is more in to this, feel free to correct me.

[smile]

Festoolviking

 

[Nick C]

The problem might not be due entirely to the generator power, but to the shape of its AC waveform. AC mains deliver a reasonably clean sinusoidal waveform. Generators often deliver a "modified sine wave" which is OK for certain very simple AC devices, but unsuitable for devices with more complex electronics--which includes tools with variable speed controls. This might be why you can run the router "wide open" without a problem, but when you invoke the electronic speed control you get strange noises. Some generators deliver "pure sine wave" output, but they are quite a bit more expensive than modified sine wave models with similar power output. Unless your generator is a pure sine wave model, you probably should not risk using it to power your OF2200.

 

[Taylorkitchens]

I did have a dewalt 2000w 625ek router and that was perfect. Would using just the router on the generator break it? The router I mean, don't have much care for the generator as its oldish

 

[Distinctive Interiors]

Taylorkitchens,

I often have to use a router and my CT dust extractor with a generator on site.

My generator is rated at 2.2Kva. I have never had the problems you described with my set-up.

I use the DW 625EK and a CT11 Vac. However, mine are 240v. Don't know if this makes a difference.

The only other thing that I do when using a Genny, is plug ALL my 240v tools into an Anti-Surge 6 way adaptor. Whether this "Cleans up" the AC signal in some way, I'm not too sure! The reason I started doing it was, a mate of mine fried his router after prolonged use with a generator. The guy he sent it to, to be repaired suggested it was the generator that was the cause. Also, I believe the PCB's on battery tool chargers are also susceptible to damage in the same way. So far with the use of this anti surge/spike extension plug, no problems!!!!

Here's a link to the type of thing that I use:- http://www.tooled-up.com/product/smj-6-socket-2-metre-anti-surge-extension-lead-13amp-240v/184577/?Referrer=googleproductlisting&gclid=CO_196X1sbcCFbMQtAodU1YAWQ

Tim. (Fellow Kitchen Fitter.....!!!!!!)

 

[Taylorkitchens]

Cheers Tim,

Yeah, you see I had that and no problems at all. I'm wondering if the of 2200 sucks that much more juice. All my gear is 110v, would your way work by plugging the transformer into the 240v plug, or do we think thats a big no no?

I still don't get how it worked with the extractor and the router for one whole joint and 3/4 of the second???

 

[Distinctive Interiors]

Not too sure about plugging your 110v transformer into the 240v outlet of the genny, it seems unusual to need to do that as the genny has a 110v outlet.

Can you get hold of an Anti Surge adaptor to fit your 110v tools and try it? I have to say, I've never seen one!

The worrying thing may be that after cutting 1 1/2 joints of your worktops, that that is when some damage may have occurred to the Electronics on your OF 2200  [eek]

When I first brought my TS 75 and TS 55 saws, I posted on here about using them on a generator. I was concerned about damage to the electronic controls, but was assured by everyone that it would be fine. So far so good, but maybe its a 110v problem as opposed to 240v.

Have you tried running your OF 2200 off the mains via your 110v transformer, just to see if it still works as it should? At least then, if it works correctly, you will know that it is a generator problem rather than a fault with the OF 2200. Just a thought!!!!!

Hope you manage to get it sorted out.

Regards, Tim.

 

[Taylorkitchens]

Hey Tim, yeah works perfectly off a tranny plugged to mains. I wonder if a 3.5kva generator would be better?!

 

[galwaydude18@gmail.com]

I would just buy a 5kva tranny rather than a genny.

 

[Taylorkitchens]

The problem I have with that is a good chunk of my fitting is done with a Jenny. Like 60/40,
So I have to use a Jenny

 

[galwaydude18@gmail.com]

Is there no temporary power even available on the site you work on?

 

[Taylorkitchens]

Not on most of them. The odd one has power which is lovely but most don't. Hate using a Jenny, plus I want to get more Festool tools now specifically kapex ks120

 

[galwaydude18@gmail.com]

I can tell you for sure the kapex won't like a genny. Actually using the ks120 which I have I have to use a 5kva traffo in order to use it with the mini extractor otherwise it completely bogs down and will hardly cut red deal skirting

 

[Taylorkitchens]

Oh joy :/ this sucks!!

 

[galwaydude18@gmail.com]

Can your clients not get the sparky to wire up a tempory electrical supply to the sites? Iv never had any bother getting clients to do that

 

[Rick Christopherson]

Aside from the fact that your current generator isn't big enough to run the loads that you have, you could also look for an electromechanical generator instead of one of these solidstate generators. Small solidstate generators are fairly new, and they can interfere with electronic tools. In the past, all generators were electromechanical, regardless of their size. Today, quite a few of the smaller ones are solidstate.

An electromechanical generator has AC windings, and the output frequency is dependent on the engine rpm. Contrary to the marketing claims of some solidstate generator manufacturers, only an electromechanical generator can produce a true sinusoidal output. A solidstate generator can only "simulate" a true sinusoidal output. This simulation is what interferes with the electronics in the tools.

The drawback to an electromechanical generator is that the engine must remain at a fixed rpm regardless of the load. This will typically be 3600 rpm, but larger commercial units can operate at 1800 rpm. The engine governor will maintain that engine speed regardless whether there is a load on the generator or not. This makes them less fuel efficient when not under load, but more efficient when they are under load.

A solid state generator creates DC power, so the windings don't care about the actual engine rpm's. It is the solidstate electronics that creates the 50 or 60 hertz output power. It does this in a similar fashion that the EC-TEC module in your Festool tool provides varying power to the motor to maintain rpm regardless of the load on the motor. This is why there can be a conflict between the output power from a solidstate generator with an EC-TEC controller on the tool.