Rotex for polishing your car?
- Thread starter gkeas
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I have used my trusty RO 150 and it works fine. The trick is not in the Ro 150, it is in knowing what to do and when to stop. You can burn thru paint finishes real fast. McGuires is a good system but can really be confusing with all their product line. Most of their compounds are too gritty for machine use. If your paint is really faded, use the compunds by hand per their instructions. Use the RO 150 with a soft lambswool pad for rubbing off a hand applied cleaner or polisher. If you are3 doing this to shine a car that has good paint, don't. You will remove the clearcoat and kight end up with a shiney car but it willl need repolishing frequently. For polishing clearcoats, do it by hand with a McGuires that says that is the purpose.
In the Auto Detailing world, there are generally two types of polishers - rotary and random orbital (RO). The Rotex 150 is unique. It can act as an RO polisher and as a "hybrid" between rotary and RO in Rotex mode.
Rotary polishers are best used by professionals only. A double-edged benefit of rotary polishers is that they can generate heat. This is great for removing deeper scratches and more serious defects from auto paint. BUT... They have to be used carefully because they can burn through the paint quickly. I won't use one.
RO-only polishers are used by amateur detailers. The standard is the Porter Cable 7424 (hearafter referred to as "PC"). I have a similar one that's the same except for a larger counter weight suited for for larger polishing pads (sponges).
While it's possible to burn paint with an RO polisher, it's VERY difficult unless you are really trying. With a good quality, more agressive polish, a more intense pad (sponge), and some work, they can remove most fairly serious paint defects. The downside is that you have to change to the more aggressive pads and polish, spend more time at it, and they won't remove defects that a rotary will nail pretty easily. But again, they are safe!
And that brings us to the RO150 Rotex. The RO mode can be used just like the PC - safe, easy, and useful. When you encounter a more serious defect, switching to Rotex mode can resolve many defects quickly without changing pads or polishes. Or, you can change out the backing plate (pad in Fest.ool terms) and pad (sponge) quickly and easily for the bad defect, and then switch back to finish the job. Changing the speeds up and down, with or without changing pads modes and/or backing plates/pads gives you a broad range of options.
That brings us the issue of burning paint. Yes, you could burn the paint more easily in Rotex mode. But you'd have to try pretty hard. Use Rotex mode, high speed, a yellow (agressive) pad, and a heavy cut rubbing compound on a door edge and you go through the paint pretty quickly. Then again, you can do that with a PC polisher too. It would just take a little longer. OTOH...
Use Rotex mode, speed set at 3.5 to 4.5, a normal polishing pad, a standard polish (like Menzerna Intensive Polish or Final Polish II, or Zaino PC) on a flat panel and your chance of burning paint is minimal. The key technique is to always use the least aggressive mode, speed, pad, and polish combo to get the job done in a reasonable time. And always be careful of edges (like door edges).
Turning to polishes, I'm not a fan of McGuires products. I think that they are better now, but in the past most auto detailing enthusiasts would not touch them. I've used Menzerna, 3M, and (more recently) Zaino PC polishes successfully. If there is a knock against Menzerna polishes, it's that they take longer to break down (work). Rotex mode helps with this.
Regarding lambswool bonnets, I have only one piece of advice - NEVER use them on car paint. They are incredibly aggressive. Stick with foam - either Festool or other brand (I use Lake Country pads).
Regards,
Dan.
p.s. the only time I would use a lambs wool bonnet on car paint would be to rub out a freshly painted car. Of course, if you've just painted your car, then you know far more about this than I do. You certainly don't need my advice. ;D
Rotary polishers are best used by professionals only. A double-edged benefit of rotary polishers is that they can generate heat. This is great for removing deeper scratches and more serious defects from auto paint. BUT... They have to be used carefully because they can burn through the paint quickly. I won't use one.
RO-only polishers are used by amateur detailers. The standard is the Porter Cable 7424 (hearafter referred to as "PC"). I have a similar one that's the same except for a larger counter weight suited for for larger polishing pads (sponges).
While it's possible to burn paint with an RO polisher, it's VERY difficult unless you are really trying. With a good quality, more agressive polish, a more intense pad (sponge), and some work, they can remove most fairly serious paint defects. The downside is that you have to change to the more aggressive pads and polish, spend more time at it, and they won't remove defects that a rotary will nail pretty easily. But again, they are safe!
And that brings us to the RO150 Rotex. The RO mode can be used just like the PC - safe, easy, and useful. When you encounter a more serious defect, switching to Rotex mode can resolve many defects quickly without changing pads or polishes. Or, you can change out the backing plate (pad in Fest.ool terms) and pad (sponge) quickly and easily for the bad defect, and then switch back to finish the job. Changing the speeds up and down, with or without changing pads modes and/or backing plates/pads gives you a broad range of options.
That brings us the issue of burning paint. Yes, you could burn the paint more easily in Rotex mode. But you'd have to try pretty hard. Use Rotex mode, high speed, a yellow (agressive) pad, and a heavy cut rubbing compound on a door edge and you go through the paint pretty quickly. Then again, you can do that with a PC polisher too. It would just take a little longer. OTOH...
Use Rotex mode, speed set at 3.5 to 4.5, a normal polishing pad, a standard polish (like Menzerna Intensive Polish or Final Polish II, or Zaino PC) on a flat panel and your chance of burning paint is minimal. The key technique is to always use the least aggressive mode, speed, pad, and polish combo to get the job done in a reasonable time. And always be careful of edges (like door edges).
Turning to polishes, I'm not a fan of McGuires products. I think that they are better now, but in the past most auto detailing enthusiasts would not touch them. I've used Menzerna, 3M, and (more recently) Zaino PC polishes successfully. If there is a knock against Menzerna polishes, it's that they take longer to break down (work). Rotex mode helps with this.
Regarding lambswool bonnets, I have only one piece of advice - NEVER use them on car paint. They are incredibly aggressive. Stick with foam - either Festool or other brand (I use Lake Country pads).
Regards,
Dan.
p.s. the only time I would use a lambs wool bonnet on car paint would be to rub out a freshly painted car. Of course, if you've just painted your car, then you know far more about this than I do. You certainly don't need my advice. ;D
Thanks for the responses. I am also a fan of the Zaino line of products. My reference to McGuires was tounge in cheek as to the size of the pad. I have a spankin new Toyota Tundra, and the paint is fine. My wife's suburban is a little older, and could use some love. I only asked about the auto polishing because I need to find as many uses as I can to justify the expense of the Rotex. I don't NEED any of this stuff, but I sure do like it.
Garry,
Try this test... First wash and dry your car. Get it as clean as possible. Then get a very thin sandwich bag and put it over your hand like a glove. Lightly rub your bag-enclosed hand over your paint. Still think it's clean?
Try a little Z-18 claybar, followed by Z-PC or Menzerna FPII on mild polishing pad, and then followed by Z5-Pro (dark cars) or Z2-Pro (light cars). I'll bet you notice a huge difference.
My Audi A4 is six years old. I haven't had time to do anything other than wash it in over a year. My paint still looks better than a brand new Audi A4. ;D
Dan.
Try this test... First wash and dry your car. Get it as clean as possible. Then get a very thin sandwich bag and put it over your hand like a glove. Lightly rub your bag-enclosed hand over your paint. Still think it's clean?
Try a little Z-18 claybar, followed by Z-PC or Menzerna FPII on mild polishing pad, and then followed by Z5-Pro (dark cars) or Z2-Pro (light cars). I'll bet you notice a huge difference.
My Audi A4 is six years old. I haven't had time to do anything other than wash it in over a year. My paint still looks better than a brand new Audi A4. ;D
Dan.
Lynn,
Hi. The answer is yes and no. The hook and loop works fine. However that are a couple of issues.
First, the Festool backing plates ("pad" in Festool terms) has very aggressive hooks. These are the best I've seen. They hold the loops on the Festool pads ("sponges" in Festool terms) VERY well. The downside of this is that they are difficult to remove. Not a killer issue, but be careful removing the pad from the backing plate.
Second, the size of the Festool backing plates is somewhat bigger issue and a bit more complex. The Festool "6 inch" polishing backing plates are actually 5 inches in diameter. The purpose is to fit the 6 inch Festool sponges and allow a little overlap. This protects the paint finish. A little confusing perhaps, but all is well when using Festool sponges.
When using Lake Country pads (sponges), things get very confusing. Lake Country makes pads in multiple sizes and configurations - current sizes available at www.properautocare.com from 4", 6.5", and 7.5". The new pads use something called "CCS technology" and are decidedly different from the old style pads that I have. The old ones came in 4", 6", and 7.5" sizes. Although the sizes are similar, the shape, configuration, pad top, and backing are different.
Regarding Festool backing plates and the new Lake Country pads... It appears that both the Festool 5" and 6" backing plates will fit the Lake Country 6.5" CCS pad. The 6" sanding backing plate appears to fit the 7.5" CCS pad. I'd suggest NOT using the 5" polishing backing plate with the 7.5" The key issue to watch for with the 6.5" pads is centering - carefully center the little guys.
One more point of interest. Proper Auto Care is one of the largest online vendors of pads. Some of the pads are made specifically for them by Lake Country. But this is normal because Lake Country OEMs pads for multiple vendors. The shapes, sizes, colors, materials, and configurations can very from vendor to vendor. So 7.5" pads in white may be exactly the same from two vendors. Or different. Or the green from one vendor can be the same as the white from another. Confusing? Yep. Now throw in a different coloring scheme from a different manufacturer and and it gets very confusing!
I buy only Lake Country pads and only from Proper Auto Care. I like Lake Country pads. And Proper Auto Care gives me great service and I get one-stop shopping for all my detailing needs (except for Zaino, of course). A much bigger benefit is that it's simpler for me. If you like a specific vendor, I'd suggest sticking with them to make life simpler. 8)
Regards,
Dan.
p.s. I'm switching terminology intentionally - using Festool terms (pads and sponges) when referring to Festool only and industry standard terms when referring to Lake Country pads.
Hi. The answer is yes and no. The hook and loop works fine. However that are a couple of issues.
First, the Festool backing plates ("pad" in Festool terms) has very aggressive hooks. These are the best I've seen. They hold the loops on the Festool pads ("sponges" in Festool terms) VERY well. The downside of this is that they are difficult to remove. Not a killer issue, but be careful removing the pad from the backing plate.
Second, the size of the Festool backing plates is somewhat bigger issue and a bit more complex. The Festool "6 inch" polishing backing plates are actually 5 inches in diameter. The purpose is to fit the 6 inch Festool sponges and allow a little overlap. This protects the paint finish. A little confusing perhaps, but all is well when using Festool sponges.
When using Lake Country pads (sponges), things get very confusing. Lake Country makes pads in multiple sizes and configurations - current sizes available at www.properautocare.com from 4", 6.5", and 7.5". The new pads use something called "CCS technology" and are decidedly different from the old style pads that I have. The old ones came in 4", 6", and 7.5" sizes. Although the sizes are similar, the shape, configuration, pad top, and backing are different.
Regarding Festool backing plates and the new Lake Country pads... It appears that both the Festool 5" and 6" backing plates will fit the Lake Country 6.5" CCS pad. The 6" sanding backing plate appears to fit the 7.5" CCS pad. I'd suggest NOT using the 5" polishing backing plate with the 7.5" The key issue to watch for with the 6.5" pads is centering - carefully center the little guys.
One more point of interest. Proper Auto Care is one of the largest online vendors of pads. Some of the pads are made specifically for them by Lake Country. But this is normal because Lake Country OEMs pads for multiple vendors. The shapes, sizes, colors, materials, and configurations can very from vendor to vendor. So 7.5" pads in white may be exactly the same from two vendors. Or different. Or the green from one vendor can be the same as the white from another. Confusing? Yep. Now throw in a different coloring scheme from a different manufacturer and and it gets very confusing!
I buy only Lake Country pads and only from Proper Auto Care. I like Lake Country pads. And Proper Auto Care gives me great service and I get one-stop shopping for all my detailing needs (except for Zaino, of course). A much bigger benefit is that it's simpler for me. If you like a specific vendor, I'd suggest sticking with them to make life simpler. 8)
Regards,
Dan.
p.s. I'm switching terminology intentionally - using Festool terms (pads and sponges) when referring to Festool only and industry standard terms when referring to Lake Country pads.
- Joined
- Jan 30, 2007
- Messages
- 127
It's so weird for me to read this because I almost started this exact thread last week after coming across these two links:
http://autopia.org/forum/car-detail...vs-vs-festool-ro-150-feq-pictures-thread.html
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/show-n-shine/9263-clk-mercedes-menzerna-106-nxt.html
Here's my $0.02 on using a clay bar. If your car hasn't been detailed in years, you will either be very pleased or very disappointed with the results of taking a clay bar to it. In some cases, a tough to wash away layer of dirt actually helps to hide paint imperfections. Take a car that's been used for highway driving but not detailed in years and that clay bar may reveal a paint job you'd like to hide again. 18-wheelers are notorious for throwing up things on passing cars (like brake dust and axle grease) that can really destroy a paint job over time. I used to own a very well-maintained 2000 Ford Explorer that people routinely said "looked like new" but I knew every imperfection in its hood and let me tell you, hoods take a beating from both the elements and the heat of the engine. My big fear with any automobile is maintaining the paint so as to avoid even the most remote chance of delamination. I get shivers up my spine whenever I see a car go by that is in any phase of losing its paint.
There's really no substitute for constant detailing of an automobile. Find a reliable care place and pay the $20 or $30 to get a good hand-washing and wax every few weeks and you'll never have the horrible afternoon experience of finding out that not only can a 'spot' not be removed with a clay bar but actually looks worse when the surrounding area is cleaner. Also, if you're going to use a clay bar, make sure you have the time to apply a good amount of wax to that vehicle right after. Clay really cleans a car but also leaves it vulnerable as well, especially older rides with various degrees of clear coat protection.
This is my new love affair and I wouldn't let her go more than 2 weeks without a good hand-washing and waxing:
http://autopia.org/forum/car-detail...vs-vs-festool-ro-150-feq-pictures-thread.html
http://www.autogeekonline.net/forum/show-n-shine/9263-clk-mercedes-menzerna-106-nxt.html
Here's my $0.02 on using a clay bar. If your car hasn't been detailed in years, you will either be very pleased or very disappointed with the results of taking a clay bar to it. In some cases, a tough to wash away layer of dirt actually helps to hide paint imperfections. Take a car that's been used for highway driving but not detailed in years and that clay bar may reveal a paint job you'd like to hide again. 18-wheelers are notorious for throwing up things on passing cars (like brake dust and axle grease) that can really destroy a paint job over time. I used to own a very well-maintained 2000 Ford Explorer that people routinely said "looked like new" but I knew every imperfection in its hood and let me tell you, hoods take a beating from both the elements and the heat of the engine. My big fear with any automobile is maintaining the paint so as to avoid even the most remote chance of delamination. I get shivers up my spine whenever I see a car go by that is in any phase of losing its paint.
There's really no substitute for constant detailing of an automobile. Find a reliable care place and pay the $20 or $30 to get a good hand-washing and wax every few weeks and you'll never have the horrible afternoon experience of finding out that not only can a 'spot' not be removed with a clay bar but actually looks worse when the surrounding area is cleaner. Also, if you're going to use a clay bar, make sure you have the time to apply a good amount of wax to that vehicle right after. Clay really cleans a car but also leaves it vulnerable as well, especially older rides with various degrees of clear coat protection.
This is my new love affair and I wouldn't let her go more than 2 weeks without a good hand-washing and waxing:
Forrest Anderson
Member
- Joined
- Jan 23, 2007
- Messages
- 1,072
I have just added a new item to the Consolidated List of Festool Links. It is a two-page article from Miniworld magazine about polishing a Mini (specifically a 1996 Rover Cooper 35LE) with the Rotex RO150, along with Festool MPA8000, 10000 and 11000 polishes.
Forrest
Forrest
robtonya
Member
- Joined
- Nov 2, 2007
- Messages
- 722
Thanks for the responses. I am also a fan of the Zaino line of products. My reference to McGuires was tounge in cheek as to the size of the pad. I have a spankin new Toyota Tundra, and the paint is fine. My wife's suburban is a little older, and could use some love. I only asked about the auto polishing because I need to find as many uses as I can to justify the expense of the Rotex. I don't NEED any of this stuff, but I sure do like it.
Hey Gary, I hope you do like your Toyota Tundra paint (That is what I do for a living, paint Tundras and Sequoias) , any way, do you know if your truck was made in Texas or Indiana?
Hey Gary, I hope you do like your Toyota Tundra paint (That is what I do for a living, paint Tundras and Sequoias) , any way, do you know if your truck was made in Texas or Indiana?
Corwin
Member
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- Jan 22, 2007
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- 2,624
robtonya said:
For those Zaino products, you really don't need (or IMHO want) to use the RO 150. Actually, a pile of nice clean towels does very well. The Zaino is easy to remove and should not need buffing to cure the product -- you'll want that to cure before you remove it, and then you do not want the act of removing that residue to scratch your prior work, thus the clean towel that can be turned as often as possible. Some of the newer Zaino products may be buffed -- but they can also be worked by hand easily and without worry of the oops factor that you might otherwise encounter using a machine.
But hey, apply that Zaino how ever you wish. Like others here, I too am a huge fan of their products. I applied Zaino products on my black truck 7 years ago when it was new -- gave her another coat two years later. She was all clean one day the summer of '06 (just over 5 years old then) when a gentleman approached and asked what year my truck was. Upon my reply he exclaimed, "well, you sure take good care of it!" I said, "Just two words... Zaino Brothers." While it did still look nice, there were areas where people had brushed along side, so a day or two later I stripped her down
, and started with the clay bar and so forth. Been almost another two years now, and, well, when she's clean, even the guy leaving the dealership in his brand spanking new truck has to look as I motor by.So, 'till we can no longer afford gasoline, Happy motoring in your shinny vehicle!
Garry said:
That was one Reason for me to buy one. I never had Problems to put on the Polishing Wax and also no Problems to remove it. Just lower the Refs to minimum and use the Gear Function (as shown in the manual). You'll be much more faster then doing it by Hand. For Polishing I used the original Polishing Pads from Festool.
The Rotex is probably not as fast as a Professional Polishing Machine, but don't forget, it's a sander and it delivers best polishing results.
Markus
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