Splinger Guard and Measureing

[jstockman]

You will gather that I am new to the FOG. 

I am breaking down melamine.  I found that if I measure out a certain distance and make my cut it is off by the saw thickness.  I added a 1/16th to my measurement.  Does that sound correct or is there a better way?

Thanking you guys in advance for any help.

Jim

 

[peter halle]

Jim,

It sounds like you are having the good piece to the right of the rubber strip.  If the good piece is under and to the left of the rubber strip, then if you line up the rubber with the measurement, you will be good when you cut.  In other words, measure from the left.

Hope you enjoy your saw!

Peter

 

[Corwin]

You can readily make a board the width of your guide rail to assist in the alignment process.  Start with a board that is bigger than the width of the rail, align the board to be flush with the back edge of the rail (the edge opposite of the splinter guard) and cut the board.  This then yields a board that is sized the same as the distance between the back of the rail and the left side of the cut.

You can also do the same thing if you are keeping the piece on the right side of the cut.  Do the same as above, but instead of cutting the whole board, make a plunge cut into the board that will only cut the forward edge of the board and leaves the rear portion uncut.  This then yields a board similar to what I described above, but the kerf, rather than the cut edge, represents the distance from the backside of the rail to either the left or right side of the cut line.

Another variation to the above setup jigs is to start with a board that is a little wider, such that you can mount a cleat to the top of the left-most side.  This allows you to use this cleat to align the board against the back edge of the guide rail and then cut as described above.

I hope my description is clear enough to follow.

 

[jstockman]

I found another problem related to this.  I measured my rails (I have two 55 inchers)  from the back edge to the edge of the splinter guard.  It is 1/16th narrower at one end on each of them.  When I cut the splinter guard it did not cut square to the rail where they were joined.  This is my fault.  I followed someones post that had pictures on how to cut the splinter guard.  It told me to cut them while they were joined together.  Although I checked before I cut the thing, I must not have had the rails joined correctly.  I should have just cut the guard in accordance with the directions that came with the saw. LOL  Should I order a couple new guards?

This is one reason my cuts were about a 1/16th to 1/8 off square.  Now I just have to figure out how to install the cabinets so they work even though the will probably be a little out of square.  Any suggestions?

Jim

 

[jstockman]

Jim,

It sounds like you are having the good piece to the right of the rubber strip.  If the good piece is under and to the left of the rubber strip, then if you line up the rubber with the measurement, you will be good when you cut.  In other words, measure from the left.

Hope you enjoy your saw!

Peter

Peter,

I don't get it.  What does the saw care what piece is good and what piece is bad.  I bot Cutlist and it laysout my cuts.  Sometimes both sides are good.  Thank-you for your post.  However, I am going to have to ponder this to fiture it out?

Thx for your post

Jim

I figured it out about the good and bad piece.  I'll watch this in the future.

Thx,

Jim

 

[jstockman]

You can readily make a board the width of your guide rail to assist in the alignment process.  Start with a board that is bigger than the width of the rail, align the board to be flush with the back edge of the rail (the edge opposite of the splinter guard) and cut the board.  This then yields a board that is sized the same as the distance between the back of the rail and the left side of the cut.

You can also do the same thing if you are keeping the piece on the right side of the cut.  Do the same as above, but instead of cutting the whole board, make a plunge cut into the board that will only cut the forward edge of the board and leaves the rear portion uncut.  This then yields a board similar to what I described above, but the kerf, rather than the cut edge, represents the distance from the backside of the rail to either the left or right side of the cut line.

Another variation to the above setup jigs is to start with a board that is a little wider, such that you can mount a cleat to the top of the left-most side.  This allows you to use this cleat to align the board against the back edge of the guide rail and then cut as described above.

I hope my description is clear enough to follow.

Corwin,

Very clear.  Thank-you

Jim

 

[Corwin]

I found another problem related to this.  I measured my rails (I have two 55 inchers)  from the back edge to the edge of the splinter guard.  It is 1/16th narrower at one end on each of them.  When I cut the splinter guard it did not cut square to the rail where they were joined.  This is my fault.  I followed someones post that had pictures on how to cut the splinter guard.  It told me to cut them while they were joined together.  Although I checked before I cut the thing, I must not have had the rails joined correctly.  I should have just cut the guard in accordance with the directions that came with the saw. LOL  Should I order a couple new guards?

This is one reason my cuts were about a 1/16th to 1/8 off square.  Now I just have to figure out how to install the cabinets so they work even though the will probably be a little out of square.  Any suggestions?

Jim

Hey Jim,

The Festool guide rails have a raised portion towards the center of the rail that runs the length of the rail.  Festool calls this the hat.  When you place your saw on the guide rail, the base of the saw fits onto this hat area.  On the top left side of the base of your saw there are two green thumb screw things, one near the front of the saw and another near the rear.  These are your saw's gibs that are to be tightened while the saw is on the rail to remove any excess play between the saw's base and the guide rail's hat.  Too tight and it will be hard to move the saw down the rail.  Too loose and the saw will not not track down the rail evenly and you could get some kickback.  So, make sure that these gibs are adjusted before operating the saw.

When you operate your saw on the guide rail, these gibs need to remain on the rail -- don't start the cut with the base of the saw hanging off the beginning of the rail so far that the rear gib is also off the rail, and don't proceed down the rail so far the the front gib goes beyond the end of the rail. 

On a new guide rail, the splinter guard will need to be trimmed.  Following the instructions will leave this splinter guide with a short length at each end untrimmed.  This is because you have properly kept the saw on the track without going beyond the limits that the gibs demand -- as per my prior paragraph.  if you want to trim these untrimmed areas, you can join rails together such that you can trim these without running off the rail.  You will likely want to do this at either end of your rail.  Doing this leaves your splinter guard trimmed the full length.  Obviously, if you leave these areas untrimmed and then position your rail using this untrimmed portion to line with, you will be off.  And if you trim only one end completely, you will have one end off.

Does this address your problem?

And sorry if my wording is not too great -- it's late.

 

[Corwin]

Jim,

It sounds like you are having the good piece to the right of the rubber strip.  If the good piece is under and to the left of the rubber strip, then if you line up the rubber with the measurement, you will be good when you cut.  In other words, measure from the left.

Hope you enjoy your saw!

Peter

Peter,

I don't get it.  What does the saw care what piece is good and what piece is bad.  I bot Cutlist and it laysout my cuts.  Sometimes both sides are good.  Thank-you for your post.  However, I am going to have to ponder this to fiture it out?

Thx for your post

Jim

Jim,

Peter's post is regarding the saw kerf -- the wood that the blade removes.  If you align your rail with edge of the splinter guard on your line, the blade will remove material to the right of your line.  So, if you wanted the piece to the right of the cut, it would be off by the width of the blade, while if you wanted the piece to the left, it would be correct.  Your opening post here stated, "I found that if I measure out a certain distance and make my cut it is off by the saw thickness.  I added a 1/16th to my measurement."   So, Peter figured that you marked your material and placed your rail to the line -- only you wanted the piece on the right side of the cut and found that the resulting piece was off by the width of the bade.

No matter how you cut it, the blade has to remove some material.  So, you need to account for this.  You simply cannot cut a 36" wide piece of material and end up with two pieces that are 18" wide.  You can, however, make your mark at half the kerf less than 18" and get two pieces the same size -- each half the kerf less than 18".  

Again, it is late and I hope I have stated this correctly.  And I hope that it answers your question.  If not, ask again in another way that someone can figure what you mean.  Good luck!

 

[jstockman]

I found another problem related to this.  I measured my rails (I have two 55 inchers)  from the back edge to the edge of the splinter guard.  It is 1/16th narrower at one end on each of them.  When I cut the splinter guard it did not cut square to the rail where they were joined.  This is my fault.  I followed someones post that had pictures on how to cut the splinter guard.  It told me to cut them while they were joined together.  Although I checked before I cut the thing, I must not have had the rails joined correctly.  I should have just cut the guard in accordance with the directions that came with the saw. LOL  Should I order a couple new guards?

This is one reason my cuts were about a 1/16th to 1/8 off square.  Now I just have to figure out how to install the cabinets so they work even though the will probably be a little out of square.  Any suggestions?

Jim

Hey Jim,

The Festool guide rails have a raised portion towards the center of the rail that runs the length of the rail.  Festool calls this the hat.  When you place your saw on the guide rail, the base of the saw fits onto this hat area.  On the top left side of the base of your saw there are two green thumb screw things, one near the front of the saw and another near the rear.  These are your saw's gibs that are to be tightened while the saw is on the rail to remove any excess play between the saw's base and the guide rail's hat.  Too tight and it will be hard to move the saw down the rail.  Too loose and the saw will not not track down the rail evenly and you could get some kickback.  So, make sure that these gibs are adjusted before operating the saw.

When you operate your saw on the guide rail, these gibs need to remain on the rail -- don't start the cut with the base of the saw hanging off the beginning of the rail so far that the rear gib is also off the rail, and don't proceed down the rail so far the the front gib goes beyond the end of the rail. 

On a new guide rail, the splinter guard will need to be trimmed.  Following the instructions will leave this splinter guide with a short length at each end untrimmed.  This is because you have properly kept the saw on the track without going beyond the limits that the gibs demand -- as per my prior paragraph.  if you want to trim these untrimmed areas, you can join rails together such that you can trim these without running off the rail.  You will likely want to do this at either end of your rail.  Doing this leaves your splinter guard trimmed the full length.  Obviously, if you leave these areas untrimmed and then position your rail using this untrimmed portion to line with, you will be off.  And if you trim only one end completely, you will have one end off.

Does this address your problem?

And sorry if my wording is not too great -- it's late.

The instructions on this web site told me to reverse the rails to avoid some of the splinter guard for not being trimmed.  I did this. 

Here is what I did.

1.  I put the extention rails in the upper and lower track without tightening and joined the rails
2.  I put the track saw on the guide rail stratteling the intercetion and  snugged up the green gibs to take the play out of it.
3.  I snugged up the top screws on the top extension
4    With the rail supported I extended my rail enough to be able to get under it with the saw still strattleing the intercetion and tighted the underneath screws.            e.
5.  I took the saw of the interction and and placed it in the center of one of the guide rails.
6.  I trimmed from the center of one guide rail to the center of the other guide rail.
7.  I took everything apart and reversed the sections and did steps 1-6 again for the untrimmed portion.

Result.  The Splinter guard is not trimmed evenely.  At each end of the guide rails it narrows a bit by about a 1/16th of an inch.

Do I need to buy new splinter guards and do it again?
Will I have the same problems on the new set?
How can I prevent this problem on the new set?  Maybe I should not have joined the rails with the extension.  Maybe I should have trimmed each separately??

Jim

 

[Michael Kellough]

I'm not sure what happened to the ends of your splinter guards but it isn't a big deal since the saw doesn't normally cut that close to the ends anyway. You might loose a little bit of splinter resistance in that area when the rails are joined but it probably won't be a problem in practice.

To me the main problem with an over-cut splinterguard is that you can't accurately use the splinter guard to determine where the saw will cut. You can re-position the bad sections of the guard or you can just "map out" those bad sections and ignore them. Clamp the guide rail to a piece of ply or whatever and make a fresh cut as long as you can go without letting the gibs run off the end of the "hat". Remove the saw but don't move the guide rail. Carefully inspect the relationship of the splinter guard and the fresh kerf (the side close to the splinter guard). The kerf and guard should be so close together that they actually form a single plane, this is what makes the guide rail so useful, you can make a cut as precisely as you can mark a position. Now take note of any places where the rubber does not reach the kerf and mark on the guide rail with pencil to indicate that you should not use that area for registering the guide rail to your layout marks. You may have to make the layout mark a little farther inboard from the edge of the panel instead.

 

[jstockman]

I'm not sure what happened to the ends of your splinter guards but it isn't a big deal since the saw doesn't normally cut that close to the ends anyway. You might loose a little bit of splinter resistance in that area when the rails are joined but it probably won't be a problem in practice.

To me the main problem with an over-cut splinterguard is that you can't accurately use the splinter guard to determine where the saw will cut. You can re-position the bad sections of the guard or you can just "map out" those bad sections and ignore them. Clamp the guide rail to a piece of ply or whatever and make a fresh cut as long as you can go without letting the gibs run off the end of the "hat". Remove the saw but don't move the guide rail. Carefully inspect the relationship of the splinter guard and the fresh kerf (the side close to the splinter guard). The kerf and guard should be so close together that they actually form a single plane, this is what makes the guide rail so useful, you can make a cut as precisely as you can mark a position. Now take note of any places where the rubber does not reach the kerf and mark on the guide rail with pencil to indicate that you should not use that area for registering the guide rail to your layout marks. You may have to make the layout mark a little farther inboard from the edge of the panel instead.

Michael,

Thank-you for the help.

Can I move the splinter guard over a little away from the underside rib and recut it?

 

[Michael Kellough]

You can move the splinter guard out and re-cut. Use a heat gun (a hair dryer will work but takes longer) to warm up the splinter guard enough to make the adhesive agreeable to allowing you to lift the splinter guard off without disturbing the adhesive. Put the rubber strip back down a little out from the original position then rub it down hard with a roller and/or clamp a piece of wood to the guide rail for a while.

Eventually the entire splinter guard while become eroded and you can use the same technique to move the whole thing over a bit at a time. That is, warm up the middle section and lift enough with enough slack that you can re-position it a half mm or so farther out and then re-warm and lift the section (a foot or so) next to the first and work your way towards the ends. Be sure to burnish the strip down (and/or clamp) as hard as you can because the splinter guard won't stick as tightly as it originally did, but it'll stick good enough.

 

[jstockman]

You can move the splinter guard out and re-cut. Use a heat gun (a hair dryer will work but takes longer) to warm up the splinter guard enough to make the adhesive agreeable to allowing you to lift the splinter guard off without disturbing the adhesive. Put the rubber strip back down a little out from the original position then rub it down hard with a roller and/or clamp a piece of wood to the guide rail for a while.

Eventually the entire splinter guard while become eroded and you can use the same technique to move the whole thing over a bit at a time. That is, warm up the middle section and lift enough with enough slack that you can re-position it a half mm or so farther out and then re-warm and lift the section (a foot or so) next to the first and work your way towards the ends. Be sure to burnish the strip down (and/or clamp) as hard as you can because the splinter guard won't stick as tightly as it originally did, but it'll stick good enough.

Michael,

Thank-you for the tips.

Jim

 

[jstockman]

Michael,

I did as you said.  However I noticed something.  The splinter guard on the other rail, the one I have not moved yet, is about an 1/8 to and 1/4 in from each edge.  (It is not flush with the end of the guide rail)  My other splinter guard which I have not worked on yet (factory installed) is flush with the end of the rail at one end and sticks out a little on the other edge.  Why would this be different and how is it suppose to be?

Also,  what is the best way to cut the splinter guard once I move it out a bit from the rail.  I need to get this right this time.   I followed this LInk.  Obviously I was not successful with it.  I have two 55 inch guide rails.

Thx,

Jim

 

[mikeneron]

Give this thread a look:
http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-tools-accessories/how-to-correctly-cut-in-a-new-splinterguard-on-the-rail

 

[Brice Burrell]

Jim, you're over thinking this. Forget that the ends are flush on one of the rails, it isn't important.

I cut the splinter guards without joining rails. I believe this is where you went wrong. I see no reason to be concerned about the uncut sections on the rail. The first time you join rails you'll cut through them. I've used different methods on my rails with success. In fact it's sort hard to see how one can screw up this simple process, unless you're over thinking it.

At this point you've seem to be spinning your wheels. I'd recommend you check out Rick C's site and read the TS55 manual. Waterfront Woods, Festool manuals. Spent some searching this forum and read about joining guide rails, getting square cuts and so on. There is a wealth of information already on this, use it to your advantage.   

 

[jstockman]

Brice,

I am overthinking.  Thanks for the reminder. 

Jim

 

[KorDes]

I'd like to recommend you visit your nearest Festool Dealer and ask for a run down on setting up the guide rails and TS55. They should be able to answer all your questions.

It's alot easier to understand hands on, than trying to imagine someones instructions on the internet.

Good luck.