1962 Corvair

P

Packard

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My first generation Corvair (1962 or 63, can’t remember) did not come with seatbelts, air bags, rollover protection, emissions reduction tech, crush zones, anti-lock brakes, stability control or a padded dash (all stamped steel dash), but it was cheap.

New cars are expensive, largely because of all the safety features and emissions controls. Politicians want to make cars more affordable again by eliminating regulations that require the safety and emissions devices. (Do you want a car that won’t anchor a child seat?)

www.commerce.senate.gov

US Automakers to Appear Before Senate Commerce Committee

U.S. Senator Ted Cruz (R-Texas), Chairman of the Senate Committee on Commerce, Science, and Transportation, will convene a full committee hearing titled “Pedal to the Policy: The Views of the American Auto Industry on the Upcoming Surface Transportation Reauthorization” on Wednesday, January 14...
www.commerce.senate.gov

I’m a big believer in the make-the-car-safer-even-if-the-driver-is-an-idiot technology.

The Wall Street Journal has an article on this, but it is hidden behind a paywall. So I just linked the Government’s commerce committee’s agenda.
 
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Child car seats were used in vehicles long before the vehicle came with anchors for them. I have 50 year old, 45 year old and a 40 year old children, they made it to these ages without car seat anchors.

Tom
 
tjbnwi said:
Child car seats were used in vehicles long before the vehicle came with anchors for them. I have 50 year old, 45 year old and a 40 year old children, they made it to these ages without car seat anchors.

Tom
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Yeah, me too. The seatbelt was dad's arm swinging across, but there were a whole lot fewer cars back then too.
"Theoretically" those safety features are supposed to cut down on insurance payouts, but it just doesn't work out like that. It does cut down on the medical aspect, but the repair cost went up dramatically.
The initial shoulder harness upgrade was beneficial, but anti-lock brakes started the spiral. Airbags and their replacement cost, have total led a whole lot of cars. That is bad enough, but screens are the real downfall. The upfront cost is bad enough, the repair/replacement make it worse, the fact that they cause so many distractions tops the list.

Maybe the Corvair was not the best choice/example, since they inspired the book "Unsafe at any speed"

Other than "speed", being the downfall of the world, in so many ways. The whole concept of "dumbing-down" everything, is nearly as bad. People treat things badly, because they are just so casual about everything.
Automobiles used to be respected as a machine, that needed maintenance and care. They did it themselves.
School has gone from educating children about the way to interact with society and "how" to learn, to this mess of "teaching to the test". Then they simplify the test, when the kids don't perform to the standard. They spend more money, and nothing changes. So, obviously that means more money.
 
Crazyraceguy said:
School has gone from educating children about the way to interact with society and "how" to learn, to this mess of "teaching to the test".
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A while back I was changing over a door and my daughters boyfriend was amazed and baffled by it all, especially the lock jigs and track saw. You'd think I was performing brain surgery!

It was almost like "so mere mortals can do that sort of thing?". I remember thinking this one's definitely not a keeper. All my nieces reckon this is pretty common though.

So different to when I grew up, the first time I had an engine issue with my Monaro, I went and bought the service manual and learnt how to change the head gaskets.
 
Ahh, the much maligned Corvair...may I wax rhapsodic about its virtues while, at the same time, point out that the item/person that was "Unsafe at any speed" was indeed Ralph Nader himself. I also believe that he never had a drivers license so you can take any of Ralph's comments with whatever amount of importance you desire...

I owned a 1962 Corvair as a winter beater when I was going to college and I loved it except that the o'rings on the pushrod tubes leaked oil so that at all times when you turned on the manifold heater, there was a continuous waft of white/grey/blue oil smoke that made its entry into the vehicle. The only way to purge the stench and the oil vapor was to roll down all of the windows and drive like nothing was wrong despite it being under 10º.

However, that initial punishment wasn't enough as several years later I purchased a 1964 Corvair Monza Spyder convertible that came from California. The Monza Spyder was a turbocharged model that produced 180 HP from a flat six at the time. It was absolutely immaculate and I drove it in local road rallies. It was really a fun piece of transportation and then...dadadada...I jerked the engine and put it into a Meyers Manx.
Hmmm...I no longer own the Meyers Manx and obviously no longer own the Monza Spyder...I'll be the first to admit I've made some foolish decisions in my lifetime. 😵‍💫
 
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Mine was bought used and was an absolute stripper. No A.C., 3-speed manual transmission, no optional padded dash, no windshield washer or rear window defroster. If it was an extra cost option, it was not on the car.

But back to my point:

Several years ago, my mom was 2nd in line at a red light on a 2 lane (in each direction) road. She was driving 1990 circa Toyota Avalon, which was basically a stretched version of the Camry, but with luxury stuff tacked on.

A car ran the red light forcing a garbage truck to make an evasive maneuver which he was not able to fully execute. He side-swiped the three cars in my Mom’s lane pushing them all over a full lane. The result was that all 6 cars were totaled, and the car running the red light got away. I got this information from a cop doing traffic enforcement at that corner. The cop could not give chase because he had a number of injured to attend to.

My mom called me at work telling me she was in an accident and would I pick her up at the accident site. By the time I got there she had already been taken to the hospital for examination. I arranged for the car to be towed and drove to the hospital. They were keeping her for observation so I went to the tow yard to get her belongings.

I could see distinctly the side intrusion rails outlined by the deformed metal on the two driver-side doors. Amazingly, I could see the same thing on both passenger side doors.

Even more amazing was the fact that all four doors opened and closed just as they had when the car was new. Even the door latches worked properly. All the side glass was gon from all 4 doors. But amazingly the interior was essentially shaken up but intact. The structure of that car saved my mother. I have my doubts that a car built 20 years earlier would have done the same.

Mom came out without a scratch. She was on some heavy duty anti-inflammatory meds for her arthritis, so she never even got any whiplash. The following day she felt fine.

I have had a great deal of respect for how Toyota builds its cars ever since. (If they were not so boring, I would definitely buy one.) Toyota did not voluntarily make the car so structurally sound, the regulations required it. The current administration wants to back away from these requirements to make cars more affordable. So what would you eliminate?

Anti-lock brakes?
Side intrusion rails?
Stability control?
Disc brakes?
Etc., Etc., Etc.


This from the NHTSA.gov


The average vehicle on the road in 2012 would have an estimated 56% lower fatality risk for its occupants than the average vehicle on the road in the late 1950s. NHTSA estimates that vehicle safety developments helped raise the annual number of lives saved from 115 in 1960 to 27,621 in 2012. Cumulatively, these improved safety technologies saved over 600,000 lives between 1960 and 2012.
 
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Packard, I liked my old Toyota Sienna minivan more than my new Chrysler Pacifica minivan, but the back seats had were removed and stored elsewhere for years. When I had to bring them back the thing became too inconvenient and that’s when I switched to the Pacifica with the fold into the floor rear seats.

I didn’t want to bring this up here but the seat relevance is so strong. I’m rapidly recovering from triple by-pass surgery (yesterday the surgeon revised my recovery speed from the top .1% to the top .01%) and when my wife brought the minivan to the curb at the hospital to take me home the nurse who accompanied me insisted I get in the back seat (risk from air bags) and luckily I’d left one of them upright. My wife probably could have lifted it herself but she’s never tried would have been pretty flustered by the effort. If we still had the Sienna with no rear seats installed the nurse probably would have let me go home anyway but with a large dose of scolding. She’s Russian.
 
Cheese said:
Ahh, the much maligned Corvair...may I wax rhapsodic about its virtues while, at the same time, point out that the item/person that was "Unsafe at any speed" was indeed Ralph Nader himself. I also believe that he never had a drivers license so you can take any of Ralph's comments with whatever amount of importance you desire...

I owned a 1962 Corvair as a winter beater when I was going to college and I loved it except that the o'rings on the pushrod tubes leaked oil so that at all times when you turned on the manifold heater, there was a continuous waft of white/grey/blue oil smoke that made its entry into the vehicle. The only way to purge the stench and the oil vapor was to roll down all of the windows and drive like nothing was wrong despite it being under 10º.

However, that initial punishment wasn't enough as several years later I purchased a 1964 Corvair Monza Spyder convertible that came from California. The Monza Spyder was a turbocharged model that produced 250 HP from a flat six at the time. It was absolutely immaculate and I drove it in local road rallies. It was really a fun piece of transportation and then...dadadada...I jerked the engine and put it into a Meyers Manx.
Hmmm...I no longer own the Meyers Manx and obviously no longer own the Monza Spyder...I'll be the first to admit I've made some foolish decisions in my lifetime. 😵‍💫
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Even with the engine in the rear the smoke came forward?
 
Michael

The Corvair heated the passenger compartment by pulling air across the exhaust manifolds into a distribution box which then had a fan that pushed it through the ducts to provide heat and defrost. The controls allowed cool air to be mixed with the heated air to adjust the temperature and divert the heat to the compartment or the windshield defroster. Since you were essentially you were pulling air off the engine if you had any oil leaks which they usually did you would get oily smoke. If you had a cracked or leaking manifold you actually got CO into the passenger compartment.

Ron
 
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Crash pads (dash soft covering) were not a thing in the early ‘60’s. Never found any of it scary, it just was.

Tom
 
Packard said:
Maybe all my dad’s cars were special. They all seemed to have padded dashes.

Of course my friend’s 1951 MG TD had a wood dash that was likely not much safer.

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Crash pads started to become more prevalent in the mid ‘60’s. There are some regulations the crash pad falls under but there is not mandate requiring them.

I owned 3 late ‘50’s early ‘60’s vechicle that did not have crash pads. The first vechicle I owned with a crash pad was a ‘68 Impala SS with an L72 (solid lifter) 427 in it.

Tom
 
tjbnwi said:
The first vehicle I owned with a crash pad was a ‘68 Impala SS with an L72 (solid lifter) 427 in it.
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Sweet...what we all wouldn't give to have one of those original solid lifter engined cars still tucked away in our personal garage. My brother-in-law has a 1961 Chevy Bel Air bubble top with a factory solid lifter 409 with dual AFB's..,.to die for. :cool:

As far as the manifold heater goes...Ron nailed it. :)

The flat 4 and flat 6 engines have a geometry that's similar to a motorcycle engine. A central engine crankcase that's connected to a cylinder and that's then connected to a cylinder head. The pushrods need to extend from the crankcase to the cylinder head. They need to be lubricated and carry lubrication and thus need to be enclosed in 1" diameter tubes that are sealed at each end with o'rings. The o'rings are the problem because as they get closer to the head, they are subjected to more heat which cracks the o'rings. Unfortunately, the heads are directly above the exhaust manifolds so that any leak from the o'ring, will eventually find its way to the exhaust manifold.

A friend also owned a Volkswagen of similar vintage and he also had "Manifold Heater" issues. The VW, because it was only 4 cylinders, only had 8 potential leak points, while the Corvair having 6 cylinders, had 12 potential leak points. When my friend with the VW picked me up and as we drove around, I would remark from time to time, "Jim, I need a breather...turn off the manifold heater."
,
 
Michael Kellough said:
Even with the engine in the rear the smoke came forward?
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The Corvair engine is air cooled, not water cooled. The heating system picks up warm air from around the exhaust manifolds or has an optional gasoline powered heater to warm the passenger compartment through ductwork.

Tom
 
If your Corvair was a 1963, it would have included the first automotive emissions control system required by regulation, positive crankcase ventilation or PCV. It was the first and a very cost-effective emissions control system, rerouting crankcase blowby gases to the intake manifold to be combusted, rather than venting them out of the draft tube to the atmosphere. Like in almost any technical pursuit of improvement, as progress is made the incremental cost of additional improvements generally increases.
 
luvmytoolz said:
Who cares about safety when you can look that stylish! ;-)
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We (my friend Bryce and I) replaced all the wood parts of the car with new wood. We did not have any power tools (not even an electric drill and we did not have our drivers’ licenses yet either. So all we could do was work on the car.

Amazing to me today, was that we were able to go to the lumber yard and buy a piece of oak wide enough for a one-piece dash. We used an egg-beater manual drill to the pilot holes, and a coping saw to cut the openings. Then we used a rasp to get the openings to fit the gauges. We took turns with the coping saw because our hands would cramp. We used brush on lacquer, and the finished result looked better than factory. We probably had 20 to 30 hours invested.

And yeah, a pretty cool car. I learned to drive on it. It had no turn signals, so all hand signals. To this day, if the weather is nice and I have the driver’s window open, I instinctively hand-signal instead of using the blinkers. Probably a bad habit as no one looks for hand signals anymore.
 
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