30 hours working on a hickory bow -then CRACK -UPDATE

[Frank Pellow]

Yesterday afternoon, I was in the final stages of completing a hickory bow. The stage that I was at is called tillering.  Tillering is an iterative activity where stretches the bow using a tiller board, then removes the bow and removes a bit of material off the front surface with a cabinet scraper, then stretches the bow again, then removes some more material, etc. etc.

Here is a photo of my bow being tillered:

[attachimg=#1]

Here it is being scraped:

[attachimg=#2]

About 15 minutes after that photo was taken and a couple of iterations later, as I was pulling the string down into another notch on the tiller board, there was a dreaded CRACK sound then silence. A spot on the back surface of the bow had come apart:

[attachimg=#3]  

The cracked material is on the surface and not all the way through but that has destroyed the integrity of the growth rings that dictate the shape of the bow and the bow is useless. It cannot be repaired. I am unhappy and my grandson Ethan, who helped me work on the bow in some of the earlier stages, is going to be even more unhappy when I tell him after I pick him up at school this afternoon.

 

[mattfc]

About 15 minutes after that photo was taken and a couple of iterations later, as I was pulling the string down into another notch on the tiller board, there was a dreaded CRACK sound then silence. A spot on the back surface of the bow had come apart:

[attachimg=#3]  

The cracked material is on the surface and not all the way through but that has destroyed the integrity of the growth rings that dictate the shape of the bow and the bow is useless. It cannot be repaired. I am unhappy and my grandson Ethan, who helped me work on the bow in some of the earlier stages, is going to be even more unhappy when I tell him after I pick him up at school this afternoon.

What a shame, looks like a great project. I have seen others where the bow is built up with laminations. Not sure if thats harder or easyier but probably give more granular control on the wood grain as you can select the right pieces more easily?

 

[windmill man]

Frank ,

I feel your pain, loss and frustration.

Many years ago I made a yew self long bow. For years I had been acquiring yew staves looking for the right one, letting them stand to season and to see many of them shake during the process. Eventually left with two candidates. I went through the long and carefull process of the bowyer and finally the tilering. One stave cracked during trial shooting and the other came through unscathed. i put horn knock on it and wrapped and braided the grip , it was a thing of beauty. About 70ib at 28" so weighing in at a little over 100lb at my draw length. Then I crafted arrows of Ash with Elm forends beautifully fish tail spliced together, then barreled the shafts to match the bow, Then Fletched with white Goose feathers secured with animal glue and spiral bound with linen thread. I was so proud of this thing. Half way round a competition field shoot it gave of its last at full draw. I was devastated.

Dont know who will be more fed up , you or your grandson. Dont give up. After this devastation I changed tack and made some laminated one piece bows out of various wood the best being Osage orange. I did eventually years later make a yew self long bow that i shot for a season, I retired it after that and still have it, Dont think I would even try to brace it now just in case.

Best John

 

[tiralie]

Dont know who will be more fed up , you or your grandson. Dont give up. After this devastation I changed tack and made some laminated one piece bows out of various wood the best being Osage orange. I did eventually years later make a yew self long bow that i shot for a season, I retired it after that and still have it, Dont think I would even try to brace it now just in case.

Best John

Very cool.
When I was younger I dreamed of making a good bow like those I saw in the Robin Hood movies and TV programs. Try as I might with pathetic willow sticks nothing came of it.

I am unhappy and my grandson Ethan, who helped me work on the bow in some of the earlier stages, is going to be even more unhappy when I tell him after I pick him up at school this afternoon.

Frank:
It is so great you can do this with your grandson, and I bet he has already learned from other projects that things don't always go as planned and that persistence and patience are part of being successful. It has been my experience (albeit limited) that while you can tell your children to be patient and persist if they want to be successful, they don't get it till the rubber hits the road as it were.
Bravo to you sir for taking the time to do this with your grandson.
Tim

 

[mouppe]

I feel really bad for you Frank. What a shame.

 

[jmbfestool]

I always thought a bow was made of two types of materials.  External part being made of a material which has good stretching abilities and the internal to have good compression properties.    Having one material to do both aint the best way.    Laminating two different types of wood would be best way no?!?!  I would like to make one my self some time looks like fun

JMB

 

[windmill man]

Evening Brett,

The type of bow you are referring to (made out of two or three materials) is called a composite bow. Composite bows have been around for a long time Genghis Khan`s Mongel hoards had Re curved composite bows made from horn sinew and wood.

The traditional English Long bow is  a "Self" bow made out of one material usually Yew. Yew was used because of its unique properties namely that the heart wood is very resistant to compression and the sap wood resistant to stretching. So combining the exact properties required to made a bow. The staves for the bows normally are found in the limbs of the trees and in some parts of the trunk. It is a very skilled and fascinating process to see and learn.

John

 

[Frank Pellow]

I thank you all for your commiserations and encouragement to try it all again.  I have another hickory stave and will do so -but probably not until next winter. 

I am attaching a picture of the stave taken beside the bow that we were working on.

[attachimg=#1]

 

[GhostFist]

A shame this bow didn't work out but I think there's an important lesson in perseverance you can teach your grandson. Maybe it takes 20 attempts to get it right but when it all works out it'll be so worth it. It would be cool starting the project again to see what he retains, and an interesting problem you two can overcome together, that is if you can encourage him to keep interested. Good luck on your second attempt!

 

[RONWEN]

We truly feel the pain Frank.  It's a shame there isn't a way to better predict a good piece of stock before all of that work is invested in it.

 

[windmill man]

Hi Frank,

Thats a nice looking Stave , I wish you better fortune with it next year.

John

 

[monstrol]

That just sux!  I once heard that to increase one's success rate, one must double the failure rate....
Hope that helps even though I am sure it won't.
Matt

 

[GhostFist]

I might add that I always wanted to make a bow, even though I don't shoot. Love to learn both though

 

[spikfot]

Iv'e had great luck with Black Locust- beautiful, strong wood. Failure is part of the learning process, and no one makes a keeper the first time.
I must admit I've gone to the dark side:
Browning Compound.

 

[Frank Pellow]

I might be able to repair the damage.  [smile]

Paul Downes on the Family Woodworking forum suggested that I should try to repair the damage with special glue and then wrap the area with sinew.

I have repaired the cracks (I think) with Loctite 420 glue. The gluing on the rounded surface was kind of tricky and I did it in several steps with a small portion of the surface at a time trying various clamps and clamping methods. Here are two of them:

[attachthumb=#1]  [attachthumb=#2]

After that, I sanded the surface by hand with 120-220-320-400 grits of paper. The result is encouraging:

[attachthumb=#3]  [attachthumb=#4] 

I am waiting until Paul sends me the sinew and I apply it to the back of the bow before I continue the tillering.

I am quite hopeful that this will work.

 

[Frank Pellow]

I don't have the sinew yet, but I went ahead and after removeing some more material from the flat side of the bow and, in particular, from the flat side near the middle, I took the risk and put it back onto a tiller board.  so far, I haven't bent the bow it far, but it has been bent further than when it cracked.

[attachimg=#]

I don't really know what I am doing, so I have to be very careful.

 

[Tinker]

Frank, Your GS had helped you in the beginning. I am sure he was disappointed with the breakdown. Impossible for him not to be.
I heartilly recommend you allow him to join you with the repairs.  even if not for hands-on, but observation and go-fer type observations.You can teach him so much, more than skills, about patience and how to think thru a problem.  Don't ask me what makes me think so, but you have so much to give the boy at this stage.
Tinker

 

[Frank Pellow]

Frank, Your GS had helped you in the beginning. I am sure he was disappointed with the breakdown. Impossible for him not to be.
I heartilly recommend you allow him to join you with the repairs.  even if not for hands-on, but observation and go-fer type observations.You can teach him so much, more than skills, about patience and how to think thru a problem.  Don't ask me what makes me think so, but you have so much to give the boy at this stage.
Tinker

Thanks Tinker.  Indeed, Ethan is helping me with the repairs:

[attachimg=#1]

 

[Tinker]

Great Frank.
When he job is done, he will be 7 feet tall
Tinker