5/8 Russian Birch Plywood - Best Joinery Method?

[Bugsysiegals]

I'm making some drawer boxes for some shop cabinets which will be made of Russian Birch with 5/8" sides and 3/8" bottoms along with KV8450FM soft close sidemount slides.

That said, I'm wondering whether I should use pocket hole screws on the front/rear (front to be covered with an applied front), rabbit, buy a drawer lock router bit, etc.  Any reason to use one over the other?

Also, for the bottom, any recommendations on how far up I should make the dado and how deep?  Since these are shop cabinets and may have moderately heavy items, I was considering to make a more shallow dado for extra strength but not entirely sure about the physics behind all of this???

 

[Sparktrician]

I think I'd prefer to use a lock miter joint, even though they're a PITA to set up right.  As for the bottom, I'd make the dado 1/2 the thickness of the drawer sides and the same dimension up from the bottom.  YMMV...  [smile]

 

[Bugsysiegals]

I like the look of that drawer lock miter but had read there's terrible blowout using it with BB/RB plywood ... is this not your experience?  And also figured might not be the best choice for the reason you said since the slide has very tight width tolerances.

 

[Stan Tillinghast]

Not an answer to your question, but I plan to use 3/4 inch ply for shop cabinets, which will allow me to use domino. Additional cost is minimal I believe in return for less worry about ability to take the load of tools and hardware.

 

[Imemiter]

Pocket screws would be fine for shop cabinets. I did a lock miter for my 5/8" sides but only for the practice at setup. I also used 1/2" for the bottoms. I made two passes over my 1/4" dado setting them up 1/2" from the bottom of the sides.

In retrospect I should've used pocket screws because I have boxes and boxes of them I need to use up!

 

[Roseland]

If you want to use a lock mitre bit, you will need to use an MDF zero-clearance fence; then you shouldn't have any problem.  I learnt this from bitter experience.

Andrew

 

[kevinculle]

I have made many drawers using 1/2" prefinished plywood with the front and back of the drawers joined to the sides with biscuit joints and the plywood bottom let into a groove and glued.  It is straightforward construction and the boxes have held up without problems.  I do use a false front.

 

[Sparktrician]

If you want to use a lock mitre bit, you will need to use an MDF zero-clearance fence; then you shouldn't have any problem.  I learnt this from bitter experience.

Andrew

Hear, hear!!! 

 

[Sparktrician]

I like the look of that drawer lock miter but had read there's terrible blowout using it with BB/RB plywood ... is this not your experience?  And also figured might not be the best choice for the reason you said since the slide has very tight width tolerances.

If you don't use the zero-clearance fence, you'll get blow-out.  Also be sure that you feed the stock in gently, without rushing the job. 

 

[Bugsysiegals]

Thanks everybody!

 

[mkasdin]

You can try a lock rabbet joint if you want to go through the extra fuss
Stumpy nubs has a video “have you used these four clever router table rabbet joints”
Gary Katz has a video “quarter quarter quarter draw system.”

Minimum amount of clearance for the draw bottom? Is the Russian Baltic Birch b/bb or bb/bbb? If your putting weight on the draws I would err on a little extra. You might want to glue the draw bottoms in? I would do a test box(es) with you test joints and subject them to a load.

I had kitchen cabinets built by a cabinet shop when I renovated my house 22 years ago and I used all Baltic Birch b/b euro style frameless 18mm cabinets. The Baltic birch draws are 5/8” front and back and the sides are 1/2” the corners are butted and nailed three per side with a 21gauge finish nailer.  The top edges are rounded over and sit proud of the sides. I don’t really care for them but they are still holding up. He probably used Titebond 3 since I can see where the glue squeezed out. I measured from the bottom of the draw to the bottom of the side dado cut and it measured 7mm. I would probably go 8mm if your dropping heavy items into the draws?

21 gauge is considered headless pin nails, but they hold better than 23 gauge I know he used 21 gauge because he filled in the holes... he might have used an 18 gauge and filed down the striker, but I doubt it? I also inspected some trim pieces installed and they are too small to be 18gauge and too large to be 23 gauge

 

[afish]

Do you own a DF500?

 

[Bugsysiegals]

You can try a lock rabbet joint if you want to go through the extra fuss
Stumpy nubs has a video “have you used these four clever router table rabbet joints”
Gary Katz has a video “quarter quarter quarter draw system.”

Minimum amount of clearance for the draw bottom? Is the Russian Baltic Birch b/bb or bb/bbb? If your putting weight on the draws I would err on a little extra. You might want to glue the draw bottoms in? I would do a test box(es) with you test joints and subject them to a load.

I had kitchen cabinets built by a cabinet shop when I renovated my house 22 years ago and I used all Baltic Birch b/b euro style frameless 18mm cabinets. The Baltic birch draws are 5/8” front and back and the sides are 1/2” the corners are butted and nailed three per side with a 21gauge finish nailer.  The top edges are rounded over and sit proud of the sides. I don’t really care for them but they are still holding up. He probably used Titebond 3 since I can see where the glue squeezed out. I measured from the bottom of the draw to the bottom of the side dado cut and it measured 7mm. I would probably go 8mm if your dropping heavy items into the draws?

21 gauge is considered headless pin nails, but they hold better than 23 gauge I know he used 21 gauge because he filled in the holes... he might have used an 18 gauge and filed down the striker, but I doubt it? I also inspected some trim pieces installed and they are too small to be 18gauge and too large to be 23 gauge

I ended up buying s Freud 2" Drawer Lock bit.  I hope to be able to test it out in the coming weeks ... getting things wrapped up before Winter arrives.  This is actually not Russian but Baltic Birch ... sales guy told me it was Russian then when I called to get more they said it's definitely regular Baltic Birch.  I'm not sure what grade it is but it's 5/8 all around and 3/8 for the bottoms.

 

[Bugsysiegals]

Do you own a DF500?

I'm looking to buy one at the moment.  I'm wondering whether it makes sense to buy new ($1,060), buy used, or wait to see if one will arrive on FestoolRecon before Christmas.  I read FestoolRecon is hardly worth it because of taxes which brings the price close enough to new that you might as well spend extra and get the 3 year warranty ... no idea what these go for reconditioned?  I'm also interested in a Kapex and wondering if there'd be any newer REB's showing up...

 

[mkasdin]

If you can do one paying gig/job, then it DF-500 pays for itself.... after that it’s free. Almost....

 

[afish]

Somebody told me I should post more photos so here is a photo of my standard Domdrawer.  Russian birch with standard beech domino

 

[Bugsysiegals]

I love the contrast, my shop cabinets are Maple with Walnut edge banding.  Those colored Domino's aren't cheap and you really went to town with them ... do you have a good cheap source for those or you didn't care the cost?

 

[afish]

those are the standard dominos NOT the sipos. bought off amazon

 

[afish]

I love the look of them.  I actually dont like the look of just nothing to me that looks cheap.  The domino gives it that contrast and since most people (non woodworkers) dont know what a domino is they think it looks unique and people love it.  Plus even though I have never tested it I bet they are just as if not stronger than dovetails and way easier.  I wont make a drawer any other way. Im actually ordering a Mafell dowler and would sell the domino if it wasnt for the drawer making.  A round dowel just isnt as sexy as that domino. So I keep the Domino just for drawers and will mafell just about everything else.   

 

[Bugsysiegals]

I'd never seen the Dowler ... interesting ... why do you want it over the Domino for construction ... is it because dowels are cheaper than domino's?  What about that Lamello Zeta ... they look cool but they can't be as strong as the Domino (tenon or tightened ones) and dowel??