A Hammer A3-31 jointer/planer has arrived

[Frank Pellow]

I have an A3-31 on order at the moment, but with the new silent power spiral cutter head so will let you know how that goes.. plus a Hammer K3 saw.. now its just the long wait!

Congratulations Matt!

I'm very happy with the results produced by my regular blades and can't imagine that the spiral cuts would be better.  But, maybe, they are.

Which model of the K3 table saw are you getting?  I am very happy with my General 650 and would never replace it with a Hammer K3.  But, there is a remote chance that I sometime in the future might get a good enough deal on a Hammer B3 Basic Saw-Shaper that I might replace my table saw and router table.  The main reason for doing so would be space saving.

 

[mattfc]

I have an A3-31 on order at the moment, but with the new silent power spiral cutter head so will let you know how that goes.. plus a Hammer K3 saw.. now its just the long wait!

Congratulations Matt!

I'm very happy with the results produced by my regular blades and can't imagine that the spiral cuts would be better.  But, maybe, they are.

Which model of the K3 table saw are you getting?  I am very happy with my General 650 and would never replace it with a Hammer K3.  But, there is a remote chance that I sometime in the future might get a good enough deal on a Hammer B3 Basic Saw-Shaper that I might replace my table saw and router table.  The main reason for doing so would be space saving.

The main reason I am getting the spiral head is noise.. I have heard it and its much much quiter (50%), and with my workshop/garage adjoining the house this was a real consideration. Also what is quite handy are the 72 individual cutters, which you can rotate by 90 degrees to get a new edge, so if you get a nick, its just on cutter to change. Its new and the same head as in the Felders.. here is some info http://www.ukfelder.co.uk/gb-en/video.html

re the K3, the K3 winnder, as I don't have space for the full size sliding rigs, so this one has a 1250mm slider (which has a slot in it so for longer things could always make a carriage) put plan to use my TS55 to break down sheets. I have also gone for the scoring blade. I though hard about getting the combined saw/spindle moulder, but have a good router table powered by the OF2200 and don't do much heavy joinery

 

[upscale]

Also what is quite handy are the 72 individual cutters, which you can rotate by 90 degrees to get a new edge, so if you get a nick, its just on cutter to change. Its new and the same head as in the Felders..

That sounds interesting. I guess the only concern after that is the price difference between the spiral cutters and the straight cutters. Don't know if there's any difference between difficulty installing them.

 

[Frank Pellow]

Also what is quite handy are the 72 individual cutters, which you can rotate by 90 degrees to get a new edge, so if you get a nick, its just on cutter to change. Its new and the same head as in the Felders..

That sounds interesting. I guess the only concern after that is the price difference between the spiral cutters and the straight cutters. Don't know if there's any difference between difficulty installing them.

I can tell you that there is no difficulty at all in installing the straight cutters.  I tried mine to check and it was fast,  dead easy, and almost foolproof.

 

[jmbfestool]

Also what is quite handy are the 72 individual cutters, which you can rotate by 90 degrees to get a new edge, so if you get a nick, its just on cutter to change. Its new and the same head as in the Felders..

That sounds interesting. I guess the only concern after that is the price difference between the spiral cutters and the straight cutters. Don't know if there's any difference between difficulty installing them.

Dead easy. Just screw the little cutters in position and done.    Like Matt said if you damage your cutter you can rotate just the one damaged cutter and you can do this to all  of them 4times  

One side of the cutters has a longer cutting life than a normal cutter and you have 4 sides  so personally I think your silly not going for a spiral cutter the noise reduction to me is jut a bonus.

Jmb

 

[WarnerConstCo.]

They are not technically spiral knives/cutters. 

They are individual cutters that are arranged in a spiral pattern.  AKA shelix/byrd style.

True spiral or helical knives are only found on a few machines. 

 

[junk731]

They are not technically spiral knives/cutters. 

They are individual cutters that are arranged in a spiral pattern.  AKA shelix/byrd style.

True spiral or helical knives are only found on a few machines. 

Darcy, I agree with your point, Felder is one of the few companies that offers true spiral knives but only on the higher end equipment. From what I've been told by Felder reps is they designed the new cutterhead to more closely match the true spiral knife. The inserts for the Hammer/Felder machines are not the standard insert cutter, they were specially designed and the four sides are actually number. The one problem that is not often discussed in the discussions on insert cutters versus straight blades, is that of damaged and wear to the inserts. The damage to an insert cutter is most likely to occur on the more fragile corner which when damaged or worn turns the 4 sided into a 2 sided cutter with only one rotation to maintain a good cut. The other thing not discussed in regards to any spiral cutterhead is the actual cost of the replacement cutters and the time its going to take to remove the cutters, completely clean them and the there mounting seat. Neither system is actually better than the other with both having there good and bad points.

Frank, glad to see your finally going to be able to play with your machine. Just a hint but go for the cobalt knives that available for your machine.

John

John

 

[Frank Pellow]

...

Frank, glad to see your finally going to be able to play with your machine. Just a hint but go for the cobalt knives that available for your machine.

John

John

I will consider your recommendation when I need to replace the blades.  Just why do you recommend them?  I assume that they last a lot longer but how much longer and is the cut any better?

 

[junk731]

Frank

"Double-sided ground disposable reversible blades, HS planer knife with high proportion of cobalt (M42) increases durability by up to 75 %." This is a quote from Felder.

"An exotic hard grade of high speed steel with more Cobalt and Vanadium for 35% longer life than the HSS grade. M42 is great for surfacing most hardwoods. " This is a quote from Tersa blades.

The quality of cut is the same, but in my experience, when I had my A3-31 they lasted at least 3+ times longer than the Carbon steel blades that came with my machine. That is also somewhat dependent on the type of wood and how well you clean it before planing.

John

 

[upscale]

I will consider your recommendation when I need to replace the blades.  Just why do you recommend them?  I assume that they last a lot longer but how much longer and is the cut any better?

No one has yet stated the price difference between all these cutters. If there's a large difference, that would necessarily have a significant effect on purchase choice.

 

[MrToolJunkie]

...

Frank, glad to see your finally going to be able to play with your machine. Just a hint but go for the cobalt knives that available for your machine.

John

John

I will consider your recommendation when I need to replace the blades.  Just why do you recommend them?  I assume that they last a lot longer but how much longer and is the cut any better?

The cobalt knives are much better thant the standard knives -- they do cost more, but last longer.  Cut quality is about the same when new, but the standard knives will dull faster and then of coarse cut quality goes down.  I typically buy several sets at the end of the year during the holiday sale when you can usually save 10% - 20% and that lasts me for the year.

Enjoy your new machine -- the Hammer does a great job and I have been happy with mine for the 5+ years I have had it in service.

Scot 

 

[mattfc]

No one has yet stated the price difference between all these cutters. If there's a large difference, that would necessarily have a significant effect on purchase choice.

for the A3-31 the spiral head (with mutiple cutters rather than one long shear blade) adds about £450 to the cost in the UK. Then the blades are about £35 for a pack of 10 (the small square blades), and the A3-31 has 72 in total, so you are looking at £250 for a new set, but they have 4 sides. Like someone else mentioned through, if you ding a corner, you mess 2 sides up potentially.

I think this is a competitive price, maybe slightly cheaper than the Byrd Shelix

 

[upscale]

Like someone else mentioned through, if you ding a corner, you mess 2 sides up potentially.

I don't own a planer yet, so don't have any experience with the dinging of a corner. How much is this dinging of a corner likely to happen?

 

[Frank Pellow]

Like someone else mentioned through, if you ding a corner, you mess 2 sides up potentially.

I don't own a planer yet, so don't have any experience with the dinging of a corner. How much is this dinging of a corner likely to happen?

I have never used a planer with the spiral cutterheads but I have, now, owned three planers with regular blades.  My experience with these regular blades over the last 20 years is tht, on average, I ding a blade about once every two years.  In a two year period, I probably average about 30 hours use of a my planer.

 

[WarnerConstCo.]

I will stick to a straight knife machine.  New Knives for my 24" planer are 135 bucks.  Having a knife grinder on the planer makes life good.

My planer has ran for about 25 hours this week and will see more next week.  I could buy a new insert head for it, but I really don't think it is worth 3500 bucks.

 

[Frank Pellow]

I will stick to a straight knife machine.  New Knives for my 24" planer are 135 bucks.  Having a knife grinder on the planer makes life good.

My planer has ran for about 25 hours this week and will see more next week.  I could buy a new insert head for it, but I really don't think it is worth 3500 bucks.

25 hours in one week; whereas I average 15 hours a year.  It is very obvious who the amateur is here.

 

[junk731]

Like someone else mentioned through, if you ding a corner, you mess 2 sides up potentially.

I don't own a planer yet, so don't have any experience with the dinging of a corner. How much is this dinging of a corner likely to happen?

Sorry Upscale, but that's sort of like asking how much does a hen weigh. Frank said, he uses his planer about 15 hrs a year and Darcy used his 25 hrs last week. You could miss a nail or a small stone embedded in your wood and wipe out a couple of cutters or nick your blades at any time. Knives you can usually move sideways to offset the nick, insert cutters you can rotate if not too badly damaged. The weakest part of an insert cutter is the point on the corner which when damaged makes 2 sides damaged. Neither system is absolutely perfect, both have pros / cons.

John

 

[upscale]

Sorry Upscale, but that's sort of like asking how much does a hen weigh. Frank said, he uses his planer about 15 hrs a year and Darcy used his 25 hrs last week. You could miss a nail or a small stone embedded in your wood and wipe out a couple of cutters or nick your blades at any time.

Guess that's a good reason to go over previously enjoyed wood very carefully. But, by the replies I've seen, it appears proportionately a relatively rare occurrence. Still, it is something I'll keep in mind should I ever buy myself a planer. I tend to buy many of the accessories that come with the tools I purchase and helical planer blades are something that would fall into that category. Considering the initial cost of them, I'd be extra careful with my 'old' wood examination before planing.

 

[Frank Pellow]

All Paid For

I had an objective of selling sufficient tools that have had little or no use over the last two or three years to make up the difference between what I sold my old Delta jointer and planer for and what I had to pay for the Hammer combo.  I am happy to report that, with the sale of one of my two Festool multi-function tables yesterday, that objective has now been realized.   [smile]

By the way, I don't mean that the sale of the MFT made up the difference but, rather, that it was the final item that I sold to close the gap.