Advice sought on cup hinge boring methods

[butzla]

I've always drilled my holes for cup hinges on doors with drill press and fence.  My thinking is there has to be a better method.  It's clumsy and not always accurate.  Since I've converted to OF1400 router,  was wondering what sort of guide would I need.  (part #'s helpful).  I'm also looking at Sommerfeld's Easy Bore system, but that drills for posts rather than #6 screws like I use.  Your experiences, tips and suggestions are welcome.

 

[nickao]

The Easy bore system is nice I have used it many times. It is a copy of another manufactures design, I can not remember whose offhand(It may be CMT). If you have a lot to cut a dedicated unit like that is the way to go rather than setting up a router for it.

nickao

 

[nickao]

Check Blum " Eco drill " that may be the one I am thinking allows for screws I am not quite sure. I remember it being expensive!

 

[butzla]

I suppose I could just use it to drill out the 35 mm hole then drill the pilots the old fashioned way, with the hinges installed and a steel straight edge pushed against the hinges.  It'd be nice if the easy bore was set up that way.  Or I could convert to post-style hinges.  But damn, the easy bore is a new trick for an old dog enough.  Thanks Nick

 

[butzla]

Yipes!  The Eco Drill is $284 on Amazon!

 

[stvrowe]

Before I purchased anything I would check with your supplier for cabinet hinges in your area.  This doesn't mean the hardware stores, it means the suppliers that cater to cabinet shops in your area.  I did this about 10 years ago and found that these suppliers wanted to sell hinges and not machinery.  They carried hinge boring machines as a service to their customers and basically sold them at cost.  Bottom line - this Austrian made Gannomat Red Barron sits in my shop:

It can be configured to bore for a number of other Euro hardware pieces.
It also has the hinge press built in.  This shows a hinge in the press:

All the supplier asked me was to purchase hinges from him and his hinge prices were very good.  He sold Salice hinges.  He also told me that it uses the Blum boring pattern so that would keep his hinge pricing honest.
All this was purchased for a jaw dropping $379 plus tax (including a 35mm and two 8mm carbide tipped boring bits).  This was 10 years ago and I am sure pricing has gone up but, this is a far superior solution than any overpriced hinge boring jig I have seen and for not much more $$.  Of course the path you take should be based on the number of hinges you expect to install.
Steve

 

[tbellemare]

The Festool LR 32 Hole Drilling System for the OF 1400 and OF 1010 combines the shelf holes and hinge holes in one system.

Here's a good Tutorial on the LR 32 by Brice Burrell.

 

[nickao]

Steve I bet that's over 1500.00 now. Of course if you do the quantity get a production machine. The Sommerfeld jig is not really overpriced and does have benefits over your machine. Plus it is a well made jig.

It works great and is much simpler to bring on site, its lighter, smaller and is a different animal in what you are comparing it to. In my opinion it is also much better then the Festool setup if you want speed and simplicity on a job site. The Festool requires a setup and lots of parts and alignment and experience as opposed to just slapping on the the jig drilling and done. Heck I can give that Sommerfeld jig to a  laborer and after five minutes he could jump on the doors. I would not let my laborer touch my Festool routers unless I trained him for many days.

Your machine sure looks nice Steve!

 

[Overtime]

Blum hinge brochure (note 11 mb download) see page 80.

Concealed Hinges Brochure

These are made for the 8mm bores.
They look like this plastic dowels

Another source for Blum dowels

Use the easy bore and then press these into the 8mm holes. Then use your screws. That's what they are made for.

But hey if you can squeeze a free bore machine out of your local cabinet hardware supplier go for it.  ;D

Otherwise for $159.00 the Summerfield is darn hard to beat. Cept for the LR 32 (set up time) or back to the drill press.

edited to add - just get you some Blum Inserta hinges and forget about all the screws and dowels. After you try some of the Inserta hinges you will be glad you did. 

 

[butzla]

Steve,  That looks like an awesome machine.  Thanks for taking the time to post pictures.  It's a little too much for my needs being just a hobbyist. 

Overtime,  Thanks,  I didn't realize those post inserts were available.  I think I'm going to go with the Sommerfeld system based on Nick and Overtime's suggestions.  This particular project is  for 4 5' doors, 16 holes total.  And I like the idea of not having to wield a 35mm forstner bit in a hand held drill like some other low end systems use.  I'm going to order a bunch of those plastic posts too

 

[honeydoman]

I use the sommerfeld jig, which is the same as the blum.  you can either drill just the center hole only.  which is what I used to do.  now I buy the hindges that have the screws installed with the little rubber dealy that you just tap in the holes and it is straight and much easier to do.

when I did the other types where I screwed them in. they would be sometimes a little crooked, imagine that.  but the above ones are much easier,  I get the better hidges that adjust 3 ways with a  1/2" overlay the cheep hindges suck and for a few bucks more, if that, they are much better.

 

[festoolfan1000]

Don't waste your money on that. A drill press IS the way its done. If your following a system you need only set your one stop (in our case 78.5mm from the edge.) Flip drill flip drill. Screws holes are drilled with a vix bit kit and a straight edge... We tried those silly jigs what a waste of time.

M

 

[nickao]

The original poster already said "I've always drilled my holes for cup hinges on doors with drill press and fence." That is how he does it now and does not want to use the Drill Press any longer and wants to try something else.

Steve Rowes machine is far better than using a drill press. Its faster and made for a specific task, drilling for different types of cup hinges. The built in hinge press is sweet!

I never had trouble with the jig I used.

Nick

 

[Brice Burrell]

Don't waste your money on that. A drill press IS the way its done. If your following a system you need only set your one stop (in our case 78.5mm from the edge.) Flip drill flip drill. Screws holes are drilled with a vix bit kit and a straight edge... We tried those silly jigs what a waste of time.

M

stoolman's doors are 5' with 4 hinge cups per door, that's a little harder to do on a drill press. I like the Festool LR32 for drilling shelf pin holes, I decided to save money and use it to also drill hinge cups. It's not as fast as a dedicated jig but I'm not making cabinets everyday so it's a fair trade off. If you're like me and don't need a production setup the LR32 is a good value.

 

[festoolfan1000]

I understand Nick, with the exception of the dedicated hinge drilling and insertion machine (obviously) a drill press is an order of magnitude faster and better then any jig type device. I know they work I've used most of them. They're just not the best way if your looking for speed and quality.

I know I appreciate hearing from people, who have been there and done that. If I had participated in these types of forums years ago it would have saved me much money and aggravation. In my experience as a cabinet maker, who bores a lot of holes. I would recommend a larger auxiliary table a fence and a stop system for your drill press. Ours is based on the following design, we added t-track to the fence to allow us to use stops. The table is 3 feet wide and easily accommodates full height pantry doors:

http://www.woodstore.net/drilprestab.html

I honestly believe it is a much better option, that for less then the cost of a boring jig, will also provide much greater versatility in the shop.

Michael

 

[stvrowe]

Given the intended non-production use, it sounds like the issue is primarily ease of use and cost.  Given this, I would probably opt for the Euro-eze II available from Woodworkers Supply. 

Euro-eze II