Any format saw owners, still using a TS in shop?

Timtool

Timtool

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Mar 13, 2011
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I had to buy at TS55R this week to finish a project, was making some pressure threated wood panels, and some tops had to be trimmed at a slope. I thought my carvex would handle this with no problems on the rail, but i stumbled upon a major shortcoming of the PS400! It is terrible at doing that, as great as it has been so far, for this particular task it is useless as the blade refused to stay in the guide and kept on wandering. It would have worked without the rail, but the finish wouldn't have been good enough.
So to make a long story short, i rushed out and bought my first plunge saw.
I never thought i needed one, since i have a sliding format saw. And my previous experience with a circular saw was relatively frustrating and traumatizing, a cheap out of alignment bosch saw that i would rename as a tool to burn wood in a zig zag pattern.

The thing is that i am so impressed and almost euphoric about this TS5R that i want to use it more, and even though i thought i wouldn't need it i have taken it out a few times since. By example for trimming doors that i made 5mm too tall, getting them on the format saw would have been back breaking.
So i was wondering if any other format saw owners actually have uses in the their workshop for a TS? how good is it with laminates? my table saw has a scoring blade, but still i don't get perfect enough results with an occasional chip.
 
I think you answered that one yourself, taking the material to the tool can be a pain but taking a TS to the work is a joy !  Love mine.

A Format 4 saw eh, must be some workshop, any pics ?
 
It's not an actual format4, it's a 5hp robland NXTZ with a 2500mm slider.

[attachimg=#]

It's great for cutting down sheet goods and solid wood, but this is a lighter model. I even put a wheel under the arm so it doesn't flex down. Right now mine has the stability of a high end €15000 panel saw. but i don't get the results i want with laminates, as i have no experience with plunge saws in shops i was wondering what others in my situation use the for.
 
Recently I experienced a problem with my Carvex blade wandering when cutting thick solid timber. I purchased a set of longer blades (105mm from memory) and this solved the problem.  I am not sure if this would have made a difference to your project...
 
Michael1960 said:
Recently I experienced a problem with my Carvex blade wandering when cutting thick solid timber. I purchased a set of longer blades (105mm from memory) and this solved the problem.  I am not sure if this would have made a difference to your project...
Click to expand...

I heard about that trick, but in this case it was just 24mm thick pine wood, the blade only wandered because it wanted to follow the tong and groove joints between the boards, while i was trying to cut diagonally with the rail. Without the rail it didn't wander because i could steer the saw and compensate. this was a very particular situation and i don't think any jigsaw would have worked really.
 
Tim,

If by format saw you mean table saw , I use it last. My TS is the first saw I go for

As far as using the TS for door setting, check out Gary Katz's videos on door hanging

Itsa wesome ans he uses  all festools for the hang new doors in old Jamb videos

He is a very very good instructor.

Here is a couple of examples

note: these are not on the door hanging DVDs, I found these on U Tube

Installing a Multi-point Lock: Part 1

Festool Kapex Demo: Mastering Finish Carpentry, Part 1

Installing a Multi-point Lock: Part 2

here is a link to his website, good info there too

http://www.garymkatz.com/

(I hope this isn't a hijack of your post. if it is sorry)
 
Format 4 is one of several line of professional woodworking machines made by Felder. I bought a Format 4 Kappa 550 e-motion for my shop in 2010. This has a scoring unit, a 7.5 KVA (10.0hp) variable speed main motor and 3700mm cutting length. If a cabinet shop only had one big fixed saw this would be the ideal.

At the same time I was buying the Kappa 550, I also bought a Holzma pressure beam saw. Like the Kappa e-motion, the beam saw is CNC, but even more efficient making ultra accurate right angle cuts. It also has a scoring unit. A major difference between a sliding table saw, like the Kappa 550, and a beam saw, like the Holzma, is that the beam saw automatically move the sheet material into position for a cut using an air-lift table so there is no chance of scratching the bottom side of the sheet. The main blade and the scoring unit move through the sheet very rapidly to make the cut while the work is held by the four beams under controlled pressure to minimize tear-out and chipping. Beam saws do a fabulous job cutting expensive plywood. But without them it would not be practical to make products from Melamine and similar materials on a large scale.

Fortunately I have gave up using my Festool plunge saws and guide rails. It turns out that we need over 6 hours a day on the Kappa 550 to make enough solid hardwood parts for our frame, door and drawer department. We save so much time using the beam saw for over 90% of our cabinet parts that we can afford to make the miter/bevel parts with the guide rails and TS55. All of my TS55 are carefully adjusted so that they make the kerf in exactly the same place relative to the splinter guard of all my guide rails. So, if we do need to make miter/bevel parts from Melamine, I set one TS55 to make shallow scoring cuts using a Festool Laminate blade. Then I finish that cut with another TS55 using a fine tooth blade set to conventional depth. The beam saw cannot make miter/bevel cuts. Sure, the big slider saw can make such cuts, but if the part is large it is best to have 2 operators handling the sheet. We find the results are as good using the Festool TS55 and when each miter/bevel part is custom it is faster to use the guide rails. Of course if we need to make many identical miter/bevel parts we do use the Kappa 550. I just need to be making enough idential parts to justify the set up of the Kappa 550.

I belive success in a custom shop is a function of using the most appropriate available tool for each task. Sometimes that appropriate tool is not the one costing the most or taking up the most space.
 
thx I didnt know a format was a actual type of saw. Kewl I learned something today. [big grin]
 
sancho57 said:
thx I didnt know a format was a actual type of saw. Kewl I learned something today. [big grin]
Click to expand...

Actually, Felder makes several different lines of woodworking machines. Format 4 is the line primarily intended for factories and larger than average shops. Besides the sophisticated sliding table saws, the Format 4 line includes shapers, jointers and thickness planers. I own one each of those.
 
A format saw is what typically denotes a sliding panel saw capable of sizing sheet goods.  Felder makes a line of saws denoted by the Format 4 brand name.  It is Felder's upper line saw.

Scot
 
about the ps400.. i think you should send it back for repair.. I send mine in already for 4 [eek] [eek] times with the same complaints..
The blade just wanders all over the place, especially when i use it on an angle..  For me, that's unacceptable for a € 400 jigsaw.. also the base
has a lot of movement in it.. clamp it in a vise, and see if your's has any play on it.. it's a mayor letdown for me..

I tried a Mafell p1cc a couple of weeks ago.. That's a whole different league compared to the carvex.. that's a really really really awesome jigsaw..
i'f never seen a jigsaw that accurate.. [eek] [eek] I love my Festools, but man, its just a mayor difference.. 

gr Rick
 
Theyre not kidding when they say the p1cc is the best jigsaw in the world. I traded my carvex for one. the carvex is a joke, and expensive one at that.
 
jonathan-m said:
Theyre not kidding when they say the p1cc is the best jigsaw in the world. I traded my carvex for one. the carvex is a joke, and expensive one at that.
Click to expand...

Hear that? That's the sound of millions of North Americans who've been waiting for the Carvex's heart breaking.....
 
greg mann said:
It seems 'Mafell' also roughly translates into 'NAINA'. [sad]
Click to expand...

You can order Mafell from a couple of sources in the US -- one in Maine and another in the NY area, if I am not mistaken.  Just search for Mafell on the web and you can find them.

Scot
 
greg mann said:
It seems 'Mafell' also roughly translates into 'NAINA'. [sad]
Click to expand...

No, that's a bad translation.  My German a little rusty but I believe "Mafell" translates directly in English as "expensive". [scared] [tongue]
 
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