Bandsaw and planer joiner purchase suggestions

[Gnovice17]

I am a beginning hobbyist woodworker but I have caught the bug badly.  I have most of the festool products and have used them successfully to build my shop cabinets, work tables and several furniture projects.  These have been projects primarily with plywood and stock lumber sizes. I am looking to expand into more complex projects and into other woods and sizes.  Consequently I have been looking for a bandsaw and a planer-jointer combo machine.  I have almost settled on the hammer 4400 band saw and the hammer A26 or A31.

I am looking for anyone's input , pro or con, on these machines, their accessories and their service.  I would also be interested in alternative equipment if there is something you could suggest that would be as good. 

 

[TomGadwa1]

I can say that the HAMMER A31 is a great machine that is built like a tank! I have one and am very happy with it. Look on Youtube for my reviews and demos on the machine. Regarding the bandsaw they make I would assume it is also going to be a well built machine. I have a Laguna 14SUV myself which is a fantastic bandsaw! If you order HAMMER products understand that they build them for the individual that has ordered them. This means depending on their production pipeline a wait of two to three months is not uncommon. But you can rest assured that the machine you ordered from them is YOUR machine!

 

[Loren Woirhaye]

One drawback of buying new equipment is depreciation.  Most people with the space prefer separates, but combos are ok and considering the pricey insert  cutterheads available these days they save more money than they used to in the days of straight knives.

Certainly newer European equipment delivers very good performance with modern safety features and not enormous weight.  You can get great results from old industrial machinery too but of course it tends to be quite heavy.  The main advantage with vintage industrial  is getting a lot of machine for the money.

 

[cliffp]

Within the past couple of months I have bought an A-26 and N4400 and love them both. I have absolutely no regrets - they have both exceeded my expectations.

I recommend the digital handwheel for the A3-26 - this allows you to repeatedly set accurate thicknessing values to a tolerance of 1/10 mm. I bought the mobility kit for both machines - you only need one handle as this can be used on both machines. I haven't yet bought any extension tables but would like to get at least one 400mm one and two brackets for the A3-26 and the bracket set for the N4400. I am waiting for the Xmas promotion which in the UK apparently usually includes the extensions. Many people think the mitre gauge (n4400) is poor quality and not worth bothering with. The mitre slot is non standard which makes it difficult to use third party products though you can adapt these.

With the N4400 I made the mistake of not setting the guides properly and wrecked the free 6mm blade that came with the machine. I recommend you google the technique for setting these as it is a fairly standard procedure.

With the A3-26 I would try to avoid planing knots - I didn't check my board and inadvertently put a couple of nicks in the blades with my first tryout.

 

[Gnovice17]

I am in no big rush so I don't mind the delivery time.  I am happy to hear that you give the A26 and A31 good reviews. I will look on YouTube at your video.  I have looked at the Laguna bandsaw also. Thanks for the input

 

[shed9]

I'm an A31 and N4400 owner, (not the latest generation) and can't fault them. As pointed out by cliffp, the digital hand wheel for the thicknesser / planer and mobility kit for both makes sense.

Do haggle with the price as they will come down in price although don't accept an offer of additional blades in lieu of this. Try and get some other functional kit thrown in.

Only advice I can give is to keep the bed on the A26/31 well lubricated with wax, Boeshield or something similar. Other than that they are faultless in my opinion.

 

[altiplano]

You got it right in my opinion. Covet those hammer machines myself.

Re:band saw I would certainly look at the Laguna's too - 14suv or even the 14twelve will save you some bucks and be a great saw for a hobbiest, good build quality, adequate power, good resaw capacity. But if you get the J/P & bandsaw together from Hammer I bet you can lean on them for a price to narrow the gap.

 

[grbmds]

I am a beginning hobbyist woodworker but I have caught the bug badly.  I have most of the festool products and have used them successfully to build my shop cabinets, work tables and several furniture projects.  These have been projects primarily with plywood and stock lumber sizes. I am looking to expand into more complex projects and into other woods and sizes.  Consequently I have been looking for a bandsaw and a planer-jointer combo machine.  I have almost settled on the hammer 4400 band saw and the hammer A26 or A31.I am looking for anyone's input , pro or con, on these machines, their accessories and their service.  I would also be interested in alternative equipment if there is something you could suggest that would be as good.

If your a hobbyist, have a large workshop, and a lot of money, then go as wide on the jointer as you can. There are some nice combo planer/jointers out there. Depends on what you can afford and if you can get some these beasts into your workshop (into a basement shop would be tough). I have a Jet 8" jointer with helical cutters. It was one of the best purchases I ever made. Rarely will you have the need to face joint wood wider than 8" unless you are trying to re-surface glued up tops. The machines you mentioned are great machines though, but Jet also has a 12" planer/jointer. If you could get that with helical heads, it most likely would be a lot less expensive. There are great table top planers out there also (Dewalt 735). As for band saws, a lot to choose from, especially recently. I have a Rikon 14" which more than serves my needs. It will resaw up to 11" board, but I 've never even gotten close to that. The big thing about bandsaws is that, as long as the guides are set properly, the tension OK, the blade tracking properly, most bandsaws will handle resawing easily. The bigger the motor the faster the resawing rate, but you can do quite a bit with a 1 1/2HP motor. Since you are a hobbyist, you most likely won't test the limits of any good quality bandsaw, jointer, or planer.

 

[WarnerConstCo.]

I am no fan of combo machines.  I like 36" cast iron bandsaws, I have moved up to a 30" jointer and planer as well.  I am not a fan of welded steel machines either. 

 

[TomGadwa1]

I agree about the digital hand wheel seems to be accurate. The mobility kit offered by HAMMER I personally find to be lacking. The way the lifting bar fits into the bracket  on the front of the machine is not designed well. Trying to lift the weight of the machine and at the same time turn it is tricky and hard on the back as well. After moving my machine and experiencing back pain for days afterwards I said the heck with HAMMER' S crappy mobility setup. Inspired by SAWSTOP I designed my own HYDRAULIC lifting system. I pump the lever on a bottle jack three times and it pushes some casters into the floor which lifts the machine up for movement. With this system I can turn the machine around within its own length!! Try that with the HAMMER system!! Other than my hatred for the HAMMER mobility design I think it IS a great machine. Save your ears and get the SILENT cutter head also. Be prepared to do something regarding wiring the machine to your 220 power too.

 

[grbmds]

I am no fan of combo machines.  I like 36" cast iron bandsaws, I have moved up to a 30" jointer and planer as well.  I am not a fan of welded steel machines either.

Yeah, but this guy says he's a hobbyist. Overkill I'd say. I'm a hobbyist (for many years) and I have yet to have a need for a 36" band saw or a 30" jointer. I don't like combo machines either, but space is always a consideration and there are some excellent machines out there. Even the Jet 12" combo isn't the best on the market but, for a hobbyist, it would be a godsend, given it's 12" jointer capabilities. Like I said before, I bought an 8" jointer and that serves 99.9999999% of my needs for face and edge jointing. a 13" planer, while not ideal, also serves almost all of my needs. The rest I find another source for. I assume you are in the business and have shown a propensity to acquire old machines to restore. I commend you but, for a hobbyist, we really don't need that kind of equipment.

 

[grbmds]

I am a beginning hobbyist woodworker but I have caught the bug badly.  I have most of the festool products and have used them successfully to build my shop cabinets, work tables and several furniture projects.  These have been projects primarily with plywood and stock lumber sizes. I am looking to expand into more complex projects and into other woods and sizes.  Consequently I have been looking for a bandsaw and a planer-jointer combo machine.  I have almost settled on the hammer 4400 band saw and the hammer A26 or A31.

I am looking for anyone's input , pro or con, on these machines, their accessories and their service.  I would also be interested in alternative equipment if there is something you could suggest that would be as good.

I haven't priced any of your possibles, but just be aware there are a lot of other quality choices out there that will give you great results at probably much lower prices. Shop around, do some research online, go to stores that might sell less costly machines (if possible), and, most of all, think about what you actually need to do work. I know from a long history of buying what I thought would cover my future needs, I wasn't successful at that. If I had it to do over again, I'd buy for my current needs and then replace when I get to the point I exceed those needs. For example, even now, I'm completely happy with an 8" jointer with helical heads and a 13" planer with replaceable steel blades. Are there better options out there. Sure. However, the cost of the planer and jointer together was about $2,000 when I bought them and on sale. They are great performers for me. I also have a 14" bandsaw I bought on sale for about $750. It also serves 100% of my needs and, when tuned, will perform as well as others at a much higher price. Good luck. It is exciting to buy new tools!

 

[WarnerConstCo.]

I am no fan of combo machines.  I like 36" cast iron bandsaws, I have moved up to a 30" jointer and planer as well.  I am not a fan of welded steel machines either.

Yeah, but this guy says he's a hobbyist. Overkill I'd say. I'm a hobbyist (for many years) and I have yet to have a need for a 36" band saw or a 30" jointer. I don't like combo machines either, but space is always a consideration and there are some excellent machines out there. Even the Jet 12" combo isn't the best on the market but, for a hobbyist, it would be a godsend, given it's 12" jointer capabilities. Like I said before, I bought an 8" jointer and that serves 99.9999999% of my needs for face and edge jointing. a 13" planer, while not ideal, also serves almost all of my needs. The rest I find another source for. I assume you are in the business and have shown a propensity to acquire old machines to restore. I commend you but, for a hobbyist, we really don't need that kind of equipment.

A 36" BS does not take up much more room then a smaller machine.  They are much more enjoyable to use as well. 

30" jointer is nice for panel clean ups and for bent lamination clean ups, plus it is just an awesome piece of machinery to run.

I know a bunch of hobbyists that have as large, if not larger machinery then I do. 

 

[Gnovice17]

I keep looking for high quality used equipment but as of yet everything I find isn't worth looking at. The hammer equipment I have looked at has promotional pricing so it compares somewhat favorably to other U S made equipment. Still looking and comparing!  I appreciate everyone's input

 

[Lbob131]

I picked up a C3 31  and a N4400  second  hand. But in new condition  for less than half the price new.

 

[g1_lo]

I picked up a C3 31  and a N4400  second  hand. But in new condition  for less than half the price new.
[/quotS

Sorry to hijack this thread, but I am also looking to buy these two machines for my shop (N4440, and A31). I was curious where you acquired these machines from? Or was it a case of right place right time.

I am often tempted to look at the cheaper variants from Jet and the like, such as Peter Parffit has reviewed, however I like the option for the interchangeable support rails which would fit both machines and the optional sanding mech for the 4400. Much like Festool it seems to be a system rather than just a tool for a job.

Also with other contributors stating that the older versions have proved stead fast over numerous years also holds up well when thinking about investing in machinery.

 

[Lbob131]

I'm in Ireland  and  picked  up  both  machines  up on Donedeal.
Yes it was probably a case of right  place , right time.

 

[Lbob131]

Anyone interested....

http://www.donedeal.co.uk/tools-for-sale/hammer-panal-saw/8252398

[big grin]

I think that saw  has  the  2.4  slider capacity.

A new K3 winner comfort with 2m slider is  £4449.00.  [eek]

 

[Runhard]

I have been studying bandsaws and J/P for 3 years now and I finally decided on the Hammer N4400. I just ordered it with the new X-Life ceramic blade guards, 2 extension tables and mounting hardware. I did not get anything free, but the BS was on sale, all of the accessories were 10% off and shipping was reasonable (I wonder if I could have gotten a better deal?). If I didn't have a small basement shop I would have bought a Felder bandsaw. I couldn't figure out a way to get the A3-41 (or even the A3-31) down in my basement. I was able to pick up a Delta DJ20 8" Jointer that is about 20yrs old, but was only used for a few months. I still need to get this in my basement and decide if I want to add the Byrd Shelix cuter head. The Delta is under 400lbs compaired to 638lbs for the A3-31 and  800lbs for the A3-41. Later on, when I have a new shop, I could add a second larger Felder bandsaw and seperate jointer and planer, probably Felder or Hammer.

Oh, don't forget about good dust collection, that is if you don't already have something for that.

Daniel

 

[andvari]

I've been looking at these machines for a while for my garage shop. I really like the Hammer A3-31. Lots of capability per square foot. The Hammer N-4400 - well as Warner said you can go bigger without really changing the footprint. Looking at the designs of machines like the MM-16 and MM-20 I'd consider them instead of the the Hammer. Unfortunately I start bumping into my ceiling with 24" saws.