Basic vanity with a question

Jasonj888

Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2013
Messages
126
I teach graphic design at a local two-year college and I always tell my students that customers aren't going to just knock on your door. This time I was wrong.

A neighbor a few houses away knocked on my door a month ago and asked if I build furniture. I told him I did and invited him in. I had seen his trailer with a granite counter top logo on it several times in front of his house, so I was fairly sure he was a contractor. He had noticed my garage door open last summer and recognized good quality tools. We visited for awhile and I showed him around my house pointing out things I have built and a bathroom I remodeled on the tour.

He asked if I was willing to build a 32" vanity for a remodel he was going to be doing. I agreed with a loose price of $175 for the cabinet with drawer boxes and glides installed, but no doors or drawer fronts, that was his idea. I was willing to build the entire piece from the beginning, but he was planning to buy doors and drawer fronts from a  local supplier. I got the cabinet done a little over a week ago and he asked me to make the drawer fronts and doors too, but we didn't discuss a price.

The project was fairly easy, and I tried to do my best work as I always do including sanding it to 220 grit on his request using my RO125 (I don't know how stain is ever going to penetrate it, it's like glass).

My question is what is this job worth? I paid for all of the materials red oak plywood and solids, but I have no idea what to charge. The box is cabinet-grade red oak plywood with red oak solids for the face frame, doors and drawer fronts. The drawer boxes are Baltic birch 1/2" plywood.

I have a strong feeling based on a few comments he's made that he's pretty tight with a buck. He's waved the carrot of doing future jobs, but to be honest, I'm not starving to death (wife earns a good income, not me) so I don't want to build cabinets for him unless I'm making a little money at it to pay for my Festool/Mustang/Nikon habits.

Thanks for the input and I will post the final price when he picks it up.

 

Attachments

  • photo-1.jpg
    photo-1.jpg
    65.5 KB · Views: 426
  • photo-2.jpg
    photo-2.jpg
    67.8 KB · Views: 385
  • photo-3.jpg
    photo-3.jpg
    42.5 KB · Views: 389
  • photo-4.jpg
    photo-4.jpg
    46.5 KB · Views: 377
When in doubt, Time and Materials.

Photocopy your receipts or call the lumberyard to print a new one, and add $25/hour for however long you spent.

I've learned the hard way that you NEVER cut margins to impress. Impress with quality and the work will come.

If you don't value your work, this guy will run all over you, probably what he did to the other shop who were supposed to build the doors and fronts.

Looks great by the way, and quite a bargain for the box @ the price you posted.
 
The $175 price you quoted him is in the range of what he would pay for a particle board POS at a big box store. However that is not what you built. What you built is more along the lines of what you would find in a kitchen and bath designer showroom. For that you are looking more in the $600-$800 range for that size. Obviously you aren't a store and don't have that mark up etc. Nonetheless I suggest you price according to what you are offering. Anything less than $400 and you are giving it away.
As mentioned figure up your T&M and go from there as well. No point in undercharging for quality. If he's tight then let him go to big orange and buy particle board crap
 
Good advice, so far.
Add in the cost of going to get the wood...Time, gas, tolls, wear and tear on vehicle
$25 /hour might be OK if you were using HIS tools, not your's. Your electricity, sand paper, router bits, saw blades, dust collection bags, dominos, wear and tear on tools, etc.
They all tell you money is tight. Figure out what you need to make it worth it, and don't go any lower.
 
Thanks for the comments, I really appreciate the input. I was guessing somewhere in the mid $300 range, but of course $400 would be better! I will hopefully get it to him tonight or tomorrow.
 
Tell him it's worth at least $600, but this time you'll settle for $500 and future QUALITY projects!  [smile]
 
Considering your material costs and the fact that you built a custom made high quality cabinet $700 is a fair price and anything lower will lock you into less than minimum wage fabrication.  Your neighbor is looking to profit from your skills with his "slick business skills".  Charge him the going rate for custom work and if he doesn't come back you'll be better off.

Jack
 
You have to charge him more than $300. If he bucks then tell him to price an equivalent vanity...not a crap box store one. He will gladly pay your price.
 
Keep in mind that it is a vanity with solid wood components, it will be continually exposed to high levels of moisture. Before you deliver it/take any money, you need to make it clear that it needs to be sealed/finished properly and that it will be affected by moisture to some degree. I have seen panels like that expand to the point of splitting the frame.

You are liable for your own work and product and need to charge accordingly.
 
h.gil said:
Keep in mind that it is a vanity with solid wood components, it will be continually exposed to high levels of moisture. Before you deliver it/take any money, you need to make it clear that it needs to be sealed/finished properly and that it will be affected by moisture to some degree. I have seen panels like that expand to the point of splitting the frame.

You are liable for your own work and product and need to charge accordingly.

Good point. I hate doing staining and finishing, but I prefer to do it myself to make sure it's done right.

I really appreciate the encouragement everyone has offered. I called him today and told him the vanity is done, I'm hoping he picks it up soon so I can get started on some of my other projects. I have a giant moon to build for a friend to use as a photo prop for wet plate photography. Totally bizarre, but more fun than bathroom cabinets!
 
I would recommend on the next one you guys agree on a price upfront. 175.00 for building just the box including drawers and hardware seems pretty cheap to me.Think about what the big box stores sell a vanity for. You can buy a vanity from 200.00 to 500.00 and there not custom.They are usually made out of press board.
 
First tip is to never give a price off the top of your head. Always take some time to think about it.

Anytime I am doing a project for a bid price, I charge time & materials for add ons.

It looks to me like you are stuck with getting something close to the $175 for the cabinet box & drawers, because that is the amount you agreed on. Unless your word means nothing.

Charge time materials on the doors & drawer fronts & use this as a learning experience.

 
 
I have figured that I need to charge some $250 per linear foot, which is approximately three times the cost of materials. For a 32 inch vanity, that comes to about $600 using 3/4" ply for the box, drawer fronts and doors. If I feel there is more work coming from that, then I would consider a discount.
 
pugilato said:
I have figured that I need to charge some $250 per linear foot, which is approximately three times the cost of materials. For a 32 inch vanity, that comes to about $600 using 3/4" ply for the box, drawer fronts and doors. If I feel there is more work coming from that, then I would consider a discount.
Thanks a lot for the info, I've thought of that as well - trying to put together something per linear foot. Getting your number is very helpful. Since this contractor's bread and butter is doing granite work, I think he has ideas for projects we could do. I'm all for that as long as he's not the only one making money!
 
BTW, that excludes the countertop.

I am in Puerto Rico, so your costs may be different. I came to my number by keeping close track of my time and materials expenses for a typical kitchen project. I quoted the guy $6500, but let him have the project on a time and materials basis. The final cost of the project on that basis was $5000. So this helped me be more realistic on my quotes, and the $250 per linear foot is just an estimate, but you should adjust your quotes to reflect items that can bring your costs up.

Let's see, labor was at $30 per hour, the doors and drawer fronts were all 3/4 veneered ply with edgebanding. The exposed edges of the carcass were edgebanded as well. I figure that cabinets are charged the same as bases. Drawers are all 1/2".

I hope this is useful.
 
pugilato said:
BTW, that excludes the countertop.

I am in Puerto Rico, so your costs may be different. I came to my number by keeping close track of my time and materials expenses for a typical kitchen project. I quoted the guy $6500, but let him have the project on a time and materials basis. The final cost of the project on that basis was $5000. So this helped me be more realistic on my quotes, and the $250 per linear foot is just an estimate, but you should adjust your quotes to reflect items that can bring your costs up.

Let's see, labor was at $30 per hour, the doors and drawer fronts were all 3/4 veneered ply with edgebanding. The exposed edges of the carcass were edgebanded as well. I figure that cabinets are charged the same as bases. Drawers are all 1/2".

I hope this is useful.

Very helpful, thanks. As time goes on I seem to be finding a lot more paying customers, but I'm terrible at the business part. For some reason I always have a hard time convincing myself of the value of my labor.

BTW, I talked to the contractor tonight, he's supposed to be over this weekend. He wanted to come tonight or tomorrow, but I'm busy.
 
Davis-Bacon wages for carpenters on government-funded projects in the USA is $38/hr last time I looked.
 
That's $30 split with another guy, who did the sanding and stuff I did not want to do. He got $10 an hour and was happy to do it. Wage scales are different here...
 
Jason

>>I have a strong feeling based on a few comments he's made that he's pretty tight with a buck. He's waved the carrot of doing future jobs, but to be honest, I'm not starving to death (wife earns a good income, not me) so I don't want to build cabinets for him unless I'm making a little money at it to pay for my Festool/Mustang/Nikon habits.
 
I would bet the contractor isn't marking your cabinet up 10-20% to the customer; he's probably charging them more than $205.  I'll bet it's more like $500-800 for a quality, custom cabinet.
 
Back
Top