Butt joints and brad nails for glue-up purposes

sebna

Member
Joined
Jul 30, 2025
Messages
17
I am looking to build sealed subwoofer cabinets out of 18 or 22mm Plywood using butt joints.

What would be optimal brad nails length for glueing up purposes?

For all 18mm ply build? - 1) face to edge connection and 2) double skin face (baffle) to single skin edge connection 3) just double skin baffle.

And same questions if it would be all 22mm ply build.

When doing face to edge for butt joints - should I shoot nails at small angle to go across layers of edge of ply or can I go at 90' angle without worrying about splitting edge of 18 / 22mm ply wood?

Thanks
 
I haven't used 18ga brads but I think you can see the heads. You might consider a 23ga pin nailer. These can be had in lengths up to 1 3/8" and the pin nails don't have heads and are pretty much invisible because of the lack of a head and the thinness of the fastener.

And the guns can range from the very affordable $28 Banks from Harbor Freight to models like the Grex 635 or Senco.
 
When I want to add trim and not leave any holes to fill, I drive short (3/4”) wire brads to the unassembled joint using a brad pusher. I then trim the heads off the brads leaving about 1/4” of brad proud of the surface.

I then apply the glue and position the boards. The brads keep things from sliding around. They don’t hold them in position. A bar clamp does the work of driving the joint closed and holding it while the glue dries.

Brad pushers are very old technology, cheap and still available. It is ideal for this application and probably costs less than $10.00. I’ll take a look.

Addendum: Still around $10.00. All mine have been the magnetic variety. Apparently both magnetic and non-magnetic are available. Buy ready made brads. The YouTube videos show cutting apart brad gun nails. Those nails are too soft and will bend too easily. But ready made in the size you need. They will also drive easier because they have a real nail point.

I am going to visit my niece for a few days later this morning. If this post is not clear, I will try to illustrate it with some photos when I get home.

More info: https://www.google.com/search?q=great neck tools brad pusher&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b-1-m
 
Last edited:
Miter joints on 3/4” plywood will be stronger—with 1/2” to 1/2” face grain glue area. Add a 3/4” x 3/4” gusset along the joints and you have a very substantial joint that is ready for finish.

No edge banding required.
 
I'd also suggest that you look at using lock miter joints all around, like a Whiteside 3362 - https://www.amazon.com/Whiteside-Router-Bits-3362-45-Degree/dp/B000K2G56Q. Yes, they're a bit of a pain to get set up just right in your router table, but when you dial it in just right, the joint is strong and stable using only a good glue, like Titebond 3.
You can purchase the Infinity set that comes with magnetic set up jigs, makes quick work of setting the bits up.


75%+ of our builds have a lock miter in it somewhere. We use a Freeborn head on the shaper.

Tom
 

Attachments

  • IMG_1965.jpeg
    IMG_1965.jpeg
    2.1 MB · Views: 10
  • IMG_1966.jpeg
    IMG_1966.jpeg
    1.3 MB · Views: 10
I have a lock miter router bit set. Set up was arduous. I only used it that one time.

I cut regi;ar miters on the table saw, tape the pieces to be joined, glue and fold. It is quick, easy and offers decent glue area for plywood. I learned that B.I. (before Internet) from Fine Woodworking magazine.
 
Last edited:
Miter joints on 3/4” plywood will be stronger—with 1/2” to 1/2” face grain glue area. Add a 3/4” x 3/4” gusset along the joints and you have a very substantial joint that is ready for finish.

No edge banding required.
Would you consider these miter joints stronger than using Dominos to connect the panels?
 
Would you consider these miter joints stronger than using Dominos to connect the panels?
Probably not, I am in a parallel world of dowel construction and I use dowels for cabinet boxes. However with a glued in gusset, the mitered joint on plywood is really quite strong.

I knew a custom speaker builder in the late 1960s and he used MDF and glue only. The speakers were covered with a fabric instead of a finish. So, I suspect mitered joints, glued and folded are up to the task of speaker construction. It certainly simplifies finishing the edges.

In any case, mitered would certainly be stronger than butted joints that were pinned and glued. I’ve had plywood where the top lamination delaminated. So a butted joint like that is only as strong as the top lamination.

I made a rolling coffee table about 25 years ago using this technique and it is still solid. It gets more physical usage than a speaker.

I would note that the speakers builder said that MDF was a superior material for speaker building—something to do with the sound quality of the MDF.
 
Thank you guys for all the replies.

I have to be realistic. It will be my first woodworking project so anything beyond butt joints is too advanced for me to do reliably at this stage I would assume. Especially with my tendencies to be perfectionist.

I read that good quality wood glue creates bond stronger then the wood itself? Would it not make butt joints sufficient from functionality perspective?

Sine I bought compressor few years back on promotion (and did not find much use for it so far) I ordered Makita pneumatic brad nailer with variety of lengths of brad nails.

Brad nails would be only used to hold it together until glue bonds the panels. Especially that it will be one men operation so clamping without brad nails could get messy.

I prefer Ply wood because it is lighter and less toxic.
 
Woodworkers’ 3 (glue) , has a longer open time and allows for less “rush” than regular Woodworkers glue. The full cure time is about the same for all three varieties. In my experience the slower dry time allows the glue to soak further into the surface for a stronger bond. This, especially so for MDF. Otherwise it is similar to the earlier varieties, except that it is listed as waterproof.

Woodworkers’ 1, 2, or 3 will all work fine. The main advantage is the longer open time.

Also, my preferred assembly type is the “miter, tape and fold”. It is clearly shown in this video. Very easy. Not clamps. But he never checks for squareness—and oversight in my opinion.

 
Last edited:
I read that good quality wood glue creates bond stronger then the wood itself? Would it not make butt joints sufficient from functionality perspective?
NO

Glue is stronger than the wood fibers adhere to themselves, but the fibers run with the grain so only joints that have both pieces running with the grain are strong enough. That's basically just gluing up panels.

Butt joints in particular, and especially with MDF or plywood, are weak. Very weak.

Miter joints aren't much better (maybe some with increased glue area and some grain helpfulness, but not enough).

This is why dowels, biscuits, dominos, screws, dovetails, lock miter, lock rabbet, etc. joints were designed and are still used today.

The only thing that could save your butt joints is using a back that is both thick enough and tightly fitted enough to hold the carcase square and strong. And, that could be fitted inside the back of the carcase and glued and nailed in.
 
Thank you guys for all the replies.

I have to be realistic. It will be my first woodworking project so anything beyond butt joints is too advanced for me to do reliably at this stage I would assume. Especially with my tendencies to be perfectionist.

I read that good quality wood glue creates bond stronger then the wood itself? Would it not make butt joints sufficient from functionality perspective?

Sine I bought compressor few years back on promotion (and did not find much use for it so far) I ordered Makita pneumatic brad nailer with variety of lengths of brad nails.

Brad nails would be only used to hold it together until glue bonds the panels. Especially that it will be one men operation so clamping without brad nails could get messy.

I prefer Ply wood because it is lighter and less toxic.
Even if it is your first woodworking project, Smorgasbord's suggestions for dowels, biscuits, or dominos are worth a shot, even if only on some pieces of scrap. All three of these methods can end up with undesirable results when you are learning, at least for me, so starting with some left over pieces would be my recommendation. Anyhow, welcome to the hobby!
 
I've used 1/2" MDF to make pretty large sub enclosures using butt joins that have stood up to terrific abuse exceedingly well. To help give them maximum strength I glued and nailed a timber bead on the internal joints.
 
I've used 1/2" MDF to make pretty large sub enclosures using butt joins that have stood up to terrific abuse exceedingly well. To help give them maximum strength I glued and nailed a timber bead on the internal joints.
I think there are too many cabinet builders here and they are working to cabinet [over-] building standards. The cabinet manufacturers’ Association says that wall cabinets should hold 600 pounds before failure. Speakers have to hold a lot less.

Two points:

First, I’ve watched numerous car modification TV shows where they install custom high-end sound systems. They always use MDF and they always use glue and a brad gun.

Second, in the early 1970s (probably 1972, when I got a new job) I bought a pair of “high-end” speakers. I still have them, and they still sound pretty good. I spent $100.00 when they were on sale, which does not sound like much but is the equivalent of $782.00 in 2025 according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics. The speakers are about 20” tall and 12” wide (I can measure them when I get home). They have a very nice walnut veneer over particle board. No fasteners are visible. According to my neighbors at the time, I played the music “too loud”. I looked at the joints and they are all tight and solid.

So the joinery has lasted 53 years—I don’t use them much anymore, preferring headphones—so I expect another 53 years going forward.

I agree that lock miters, if you can get past the setup, offer superior strength—cabinet makers’ strength—but if the conventional miters or butt joints are not glue-starved, then they should do fine. Acoustically, MDF is the preferred material.

I would note that in the TV car shows, the “finish” was typically a light weight carpet glued to the surface (all the corners had generous round-overs), though occasionally leather or vinyl.

If nailed, and round-overs corners are planned, then placement of the wire brads gets a bit fussy as you don’t want to use a round-over bit over steel nails.

If anyone is interested, I can post photos of those antique speakers along with the sizes (and material thickness).

Addendum: As far as toxicity goes, I wear a cartridge-type mask when cutting MDF or plywood on the table saw or router table. I fail to do so when hand-sanding though. Also note that facial hair dismisses the effectiveness of these maaks. In that case, a positive-atmosphere mask (filtered air blown in) is preferred (but I don’t own one). Any task that causes you to cough, warrants the use of a make of some sort.

Suggestion: If using a cartrdige-style mask with vinyl seals for the face, It is a good idea to wipe the seals with rubbing alcohol between uses. Bacteria on the seals can lead to a resurgence of teen-style acne.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top