Cabinet Lifts

[Bikeboy80]

Not sure why it requires two people or any kind of lifting device to fit a kitchen,  yes might make life easier but I have fitted plenty of kitchens on my own.  Where I actually struggle is the worktops as they can be very heavy and awkward to lift on your own.

Jmb

Exactly right, it isn't necessary. But I find it much easier to fit a line of cabinets together on the floor an hang as one unit rather then hang each one individually and struggle to hold it up and place while lining up and connecting it( though one of the 3rd hand or Tjak would improve that). Also I am looking toward my future, I see what my dad is struggling with now and I don't want to be in the same place in 30yrs so if I can purchase a piece of equipment that will save my body it is well worth it!

99.9% of the work tops that are installed in our kitchens are granite or solid surface, both of which are installed by subcontractors. I wouldn't even want to try that on my own!

 

[Distinctive Interiors]

I also work on my own as a full time kitchen fitter. It is rare that I need an extra pair of hands, but as the years go by, it has got tougher.

Incidently, I always fit the base units first. The biggest individual wall units that I have come across are 1200mm wide X 1050mm high. Although these are fairly heavy, one man can pick them up OK. I,m not sure how you guys over the pond fix wall units to the wall. Over here, our wall cabinets have an adjustable hanging system that just lifts up and hangs on a bracket that has been fixed to the wall prior to lifting and dropping the wall unit onto it. Once its up there, its just a matter of tweaking the front/ back adjuster, and the up/down adjuster. Perfect every time!!!!!!!!

If you are pre-bolting cabinets together on the floor or a bench, prior to hanging them on the wall, then no wonder you need some sort of system to help you lift them up [eek], I cannot see any logic in that at all, I'm sorry.........!!!!!!!

Tim.

 

[Bikeboy80]

I also work on my own as a full time kitchen fitter. It is rare that I need an extra pair of hands, but as the years go by, it has got tougher.

Incidently, I always fit the base units first. The biggest individual wall units that I have come across are 1200mm wide X 1050mm high. Although these are fairly heavy, one man can pick them up OK. I,m not sure how you guys over the pond fix wall units to the wall. Over here, our wall cabinets have an adjustable hanging system that just lifts up and hangs on a bracket that has been fixed to the wall prior to lifting and dropping the wall unit onto it. Once its up there, its just a matter of tweaking the front/ back adjuster, and the up/down adjuster. Perfect every time!!!!!!!!

Tim.

The cabinets we install are screwed directly into studs when in their final position, there is little or no adjustment once they are in place.

 

[Distinctive Interiors]

I also work on my own as a full time kitchen fitter. It is rare that I need an extra pair of hands, but as the years go by, it has got tougher.

Incidently, I always fit the base units first. The biggest individual wall units that I have come across are 1200mm wide X 1050mm high. Although these are fairly heavy, one man can pick them up OK. I,m not sure how you guys over the pond fix wall units to the wall. Over here, our wall cabinets have an adjustable hanging system that just lifts up and hangs on a bracket that has been fixed to the wall prior to lifting and dropping the wall unit onto it. Once its up there, its just a matter of tweaking the front/ back adjuster, and the up/down adjuster. Perfect every time!!!!!!!!

Tim.

The cabinets we install are screwed directly into studs when in their final position, there is little or no adjustment once they are in place.

Well, the question has to be asked..........WHY???????

The adjustable system that I'm talking about has been available for over 30years. Is this type of thing just not available in the States????

 

[Michael Kellough]

I use the T-Jak and it's fine for cabinets that I can lift over my head anyway but it is no match for the cabinet jacks that hoist a whole bank up.

Tim, can you post a link to the kind of hanging systems you use?

 

[Distinctive Interiors]

Sure, here is a common type that is readily available and similar to the majority of cabinets that are out there.

http://www.hafele.co.uk/hafele35a1/Templates/Hafele/Products.asp?param=9788&ig_id=68656

Tim.

 

[Distinctive Interiors]

Sure, here is a common type that is readily available and similar to the majority of cabinets that are out there.

http://www.hafele.co.uk/hafele35a1/Templates/Hafele/Products.asp?param=9788&ig_id=68656

Here is the matching hanger that fixes inside the cabinet. As you can see in the picture, the adjuster screws are clearly visible
http://www.hafele.co.uk/hafele35a1/Templates/Hafele/Products.asp?param=9784&ig_id=74324
Tim.

 

[vwdave]

I fit a lot of kitchens also. I usually have a helper with me. He will open all the boxes, sort out the material and pull the doors, drawers and shelves out. I couldn't imagine not having a helper on site with me, the crown and riser board is one area I find it necessary for 2 people.  I also set base cabinets first. This way I can scribe them to the floor if needed and almost always there are fridge panels or a tall panty that will set the heights of the uppers. I want my fridge panels to sit on the floor so sometimes I'm cutting the bottoms of the base cabinets.

Back in the 90's most of the kitchens where just walls and bases, no fancy panels for the fridge. So I learned by setting uppers first but that all changed with these complex installs of today. Now I need Festool to hurry up with the cordless carvex so I can use it in my kitchen fittings.

Dave

 

[Distinctive Interiors]

Actually, my apologies  [embarassed] In this picture http://www.hafele.co.uk/hafele35a1/Templates/Hafele/Products.asp?param=9784&ig_id=74324
the adjuster screws are covered by a little flap that conceals them once the adjustments have been made.

Tim.

 

[mastercabman]

I also work on my own as a full time kitchen fitter. It is rare that I need an extra pair of hands, but as the years go by, it has got tougher.

Incidently, I always fit the base units first. The biggest individual wall units that I have come across are 1200mm wide X 1050mm high. Although these are fairly heavy, one man can pick them up OK. I,m not sure how you guys over the pond fix wall units to the wall. Over here, our wall cabinets have an adjustable hanging system that just lifts up and hangs on a bracket that has been fixed to the wall prior to lifting and dropping the wall unit onto it. Once its up there, its just a matter of tweaking the front/ back adjuster, and the up/down adjuster. Perfect every time!!!!!!!!

Tim.

The cabinets we install are screwed directly into studs when in their final position, there is little or no adjustment once they are in place.

Well, the question has to be asked..........WHY???????

The adjustable system that I'm talking about has been available for over 30years. Is this type of thing just not available in the States????

I am familiar with the hanging strip
But most cabinet here are made the way it has been for years.
I wish NA would adapt that idea but they just like to do thing the old fashion way I guess
Also keep in mind that most people here don't like frameless(European box) The hanging strip is mostly used with frameless cabinets.
I also don't know why some people like to screw their cabinets together first and then hang them.It makes them very heavy and no matter what hanging device that you have,you still need help getting it up.
There are no advantage to screw cabinets together first.I have done it before many times and it just not worth it.
I put 1 cabinet on the wall,drive 1 screw,then bring the second on my T-jack,clamp it to the 1st cabinet,screw them together and so on.
The T-jack is about $80 and easy to carry.By far the best helper you can get.

 

[Distinctive Interiors]

We also have Front Frame kitchen cabinets here. In my experience, they are not as popular here as they still are in NA.

The wall unit hanging bracket system that I showed, works just as well on Front framed units as it does on our "European Box".... [big grin].

There are quite a few different variations of it, but the principle is exactly the same. The system that my German kitchen supplier uses is all metal and is completely hidden behind the back panel of the cabinet and the adjuster screws are accessed through 2 x 15mm holes, which in turn are concealed by the use of colour coordinated caps, once the adjustment has been made.

Tim.

 

[Deansocial]

More like this tim

http://www.hafele.co.uk/hafele35a1/Templates/Hafele/Products.asp?param=9785&ig_id=78243&title=Libra+H2+concealed+wall+hanging+bracket

These are the type I prefer as they have th locking screw to stop cabs being lifted off

 

[Jonhilgen]

I also work on my own as a full time kitchen fitter. It is rare that I need an extra pair of hands, but as the years go by, it has got tougher.

Incidently, I always fit the base units first. The biggest individual wall units that I have come across are 1200mm wide X 1050mm high. Although these are fairly heavy, one man can pick them up OK. I,m not sure how you guys over the pond fix wall units to the wall. Over here, our wall cabinets have an adjustable hanging system that just lifts up and hangs on a bracket that has been fixed to the wall prior to lifting and dropping the wall unit onto it. Once its up there, its just a matter of tweaking the front/ back adjuster, and the up/down adjuster. Perfect every time!!!!!!!!

Tim.

The cabinets we install are screwed directly into studs when in their final position, there is little or no adjustment once they are in place.

Well, the question has to be asked..........WHY???????

The adjustable system that I'm talking about has been available for over 30years. Is this type of thing just not available in the States????

I am familiar with the hanging strip
But most cabinet here are made the way it has been for years.
I wish NA would adapt that idea but they just like to do thing the old fashion way I guess
Also keep in mind that most people here don't like frameless(European box) The hanging strip is mostly used with frameless cabinets.
I also don't know why some people like to screw their cabinets together first and then hang them.It makes them very heavy and no matter what hanging device that you have,you still need help getting it up.
There are no advantage to screw cabinets together first.I have done it before many times and it just not worth it.
I put 1 cabinet on the wall,drive 1 screw,then bring the second on my T-jack,clamp it to the 1st cabinet,screw them together and so on.
The T-jack is about $80 and easy to carry.By far the best helper you can get.

Truer words have never been spoken.  Screwing boxes together is for guys with strong backs and weak minds

I don't use a cabinet jack, but I do screw a block to a cabinet that will rest on the already installed cabinet, then clamp them together, then screw.

Jon

 

[Michael Kellough]

I don't use a cabinet jack, but I do screw a block to a cabinet that will rest on the already installed cabinet, then clamp them together, then screw.

Jon

Do you put the block on top of the new cabinet? Never heard of that, it's clever but requires a lot of space above...

 

[Jonhilgen]

Yes, on top of the cabinet.  Typically the cabinets I install do not go up to the ceilings, and if they do, there's usually 6" of crown that goes above.  You only need a 3/4" block to make it work.

Had an old foreman that used to say "You can't fight gravity, so might as well use it."

Jon

 

[Michael Kellough]

More like this tim

http://www.hafele.co.uk/hafele35a1/Templates/Hafele/Products.asp?param=9785&ig_id=78243&title=Libra+H2+concealed+wall+hanging+bracket

These are the type I prefer as they have th locking screw to stop cabs being lifted off

That is a pretty cool bit of hardware! This is the unhanded version. The ears on the side fit into system holes and the bottom serrated ear grabs tight when the lock lever is cranked.

The pdf. .

 

[Michael Kellough]

Yes, on top of the cabinet.  Typically the cabinets I install do not go up to the ceilings, and if they do, there's usually 6" of crown that goes above.  You only need a 3/4" block to make it work.

Had an old foreman that used to say "You can't fight gravity, so might as well use it."

Jon

And there is no need to remove the block after installation.
That is what gave me pause before, if the box is close to the ceiling it would be hard to remove the block. Doh...

 

[Distinctive Interiors]

More like this tim

http://www.hafele.co.uk/hafele35a1/Templates/Hafele/Products.asp?param=9785&ig_id=78243&title=Libra+H2+concealed+wall+hanging+bracket

These are the type I prefer as they have th locking screw to stop cabs being lifted off

That is a pretty cool bit of hardware! This is the unhanded version. The ears on the side fit into system holes and the bottom serrated ear grabs tight when the lock lever is cranked.

The pdf. .

That's the one....!!!!!!

Just in case anyone is interested, it is designed to be used with the 32mm system............!!!!!!!! Check out the measurements on the PDF file.

Tim.

 

[Michael Kellough]

I've only used the hanging rail when installing some Ikea cabinets. I thought it was a pretty good system even with the non-adjustable brackets. The Hafele hardware is much better.

Checked into using hanging rails in NA and there are lots of the usual reasons not to bother but here is a good explanation why it is good.

"
If you use a recessed back, you gain the advantage of being able to use a hanging rail system for fastening the cabinets to the wall. I have been using the Camar system for 6 years or so with no problems – just solutions. The hanging rail is so easy, so exact that I’m surprised it hasn’t come up in this discussion.

The concept is this:
1. Install a hanging bracket in the top right and left corners of the box. I do the boring for this with a simple jig when the cabinet sides are flat on the bench.

2. Install the hanging rail at desired height. 1 5/8” from top of cabinet works best for me. Fasten to studs, and use toggle bolts between studs. I cut the hanging rails in the shop and mark cabinet locations on them (a story pole for the installation).

3. Once rails are secure, lift the boxes onto them, slide into position and level using the adjusting screws on the hanger brackets. Once I have the cabinets close, I fasten them together, double check everything, then tighten the whole run of cabinets to the wall.

I realize that this adds another setup to your cabinets. One more thing to do. Why? How many times have you put a screw into a cabinet that missed the stud, or had a cabinet that ended up with only one screw supporting its weight? How many times have you sent two guys to the install so one can hold the cabinet while the other is screwing? Or how about those times that the cabinets move just a bit as you tighten them up, and you have to try and adjust, but don’t want that extra screw showing inside?

This is something that can take place in the shop with simple jigs. Once on site, I can hang an entire run of uppers by myself. I can get every cabinet dead level, plumb and square with a screwdriver once they are on the wall. Cabinets can be taken down easily to scribe, then put back in place and adjusted to perfection – taken back off and put up again – no changes to adjustments. And it’s strong! I’m over 230 lbs, and I hang off of every run as a final check.

With that in mind, we use 1/4” cabinet backs and dado into the side to leave 1/2” of space behind the back to the wall. This accommodates the hanging system. We rip our tops 3/4” smaller that the bottoms and sides (11 7/8” sides and bottoms, 11 1/8” tops). This allows for inserting the cabinet back into the finished box, and also allows for the hanging rail to be continuous along the cabinet run."

- See more at: http://www.woodweb.com/knowledge_base/Recessed_or_flush_cabinet_backs.html#sthash.v0ms5dVX.dpuf"

 

[upscale]

I always installed the wall cabinets first.
What is the advantage of installing the bases first & then the walls?

I'd suggest that you could install the bases first and then use some support mechanism, blocking, boxes, shimming or whatever to support the upper shelving to the proper height.

Not that it would be applicable for most, but I use a wheelchair and used the above method when I built my mother's kitchen. As I added boxes and shimming where appropriate, on my own I was able to get the upper cabinets to the appropriate height, all ready for someone to come along and screw them into the wall studs. In my case, using the lift method discussed in this thread is fraught with the danger of something collapsing or falling over. Installing the base cabinets first eliminates much of that danger ~ although admittedly it's not as fast or as efficient.