CMS-GE with CMS-OF and OF2200

[Rob-GB]

This is in part a review and in part, a how to!
My recent Festool purchase was posted under Festool, Fixy & Fate! So further to this and prompted by Chris Meggersee, so here we go.
As part of the Festool System way of thinking the CMS set up brings a lot to the party. It is adaptable, robust and good looking. ( Suzy says that describes Clint Eastwood, [eek] well, at least he's got 'wood' in his name [laughing])
Anyway we want pic's so here is the base unit that lets possibilities and imagination run free.
The base unit CMS_GE in its folded position.

End view showing the NVR switch, this one is for the UK site requirements and has plugs/sockets for 110v power.

Cable storage, lazily illustrated.

With legs extended/unfolded it matches the height of the MFT/3. Bottom right of the picture shows the adjustable foot to counteract against uneven floors.

The router table top, laid in place, this is a stunning 7mm thick of high grade aluminium. I even double checked my micrometre, to be sure.

The slotted screws in the above pic relate to the cams (2no). These lock the table down to the CMS base unit.
This router table top, is apparently a new version (it is what I was informed), it now accepts the OF1010, OF1400 and OF2200. So a different table is not required for each model.
How's it done?
Supplied as standard, going clockwise from the left, we get the dark grey centring ring (473810) for the OF1010, the light grey centring ring (473809) for the OF1400
and the Festool green one for the OF2200.

 

[Rob-GB]

From here on we will deal with the OF2200, because that's the one I have.
First, with the table upside down, insert the green centring ring in the table then remove the base plate that is on the router.

Now we need the Protective Cover, I believe this is designed to stop dust getting into the router through the bottom vents. There has been some mention of this as a problem in some threads. Like all the parts it has its part number moulded into it. (473449).

Insert this with the part number readable from this view, and the oval indent over the square 'bolt'.

Rotate clockwise to this point, there is a ratcheting sound and firm stop.

Plunge the router to it's lowest point. Place the router over the centring ring, there is no play in the fit, with the guide post opposite the fine height adjuster side under the cutting depth adjuster. Then install the 'Journal' as it is described. This prevents the router rotating around the centring ring. This Pic shows the position with the journal and small knob.

Journal in position, the 6mm tab into the table for this router.

Tightened up.

Install and tighten the three clamps.

 

[Rob-GB]

Release the router plunge lock, make sure the raise and fall mechanism is engaged.

The operating handle for the mechanism fits above and below the table for ease of use.

Flip the table over, ease the router and rise and fall mechanism into the opening, then connect the far edge( with the cup and round hinging edge) first. When installed give the slotted screws a half turn to lock into place. Looks neat.

Festool supply a range of bushings to cater for a variety of bit radii.

The router table fence, would not be lost on some high end shaper/spindle moulders!

This is a serious bit of kit, it may be ali' but it is weighty ali'.
To aid with adjustment there are metric scales and the table is etched with reference lines either side (at the 41mm mark here).

Also included are the clear plastic 'Shaw Guard' and the dark plastic hold down, both easily adjustable, and lift back out of the way for cutter adjustment/ installation.

The infeed part of the fence has a large indexed knob to allow for a planing action type of cut.

 

[Rob-GB]

The rise and fall handle in the table face position. It takes 14 full turns to go from the lowest to highest setting. The action is smooth and easier than I imagined.

Also included is the guard for use with guided cutters with curved workpieces.

Oh! For those of you who are wondering where to put the handwheel for the rise and fall, any of the rounded or squared keyhole location points will do nicely, the handle stem has been machined to suit.

Thanks for looking in, hope it is of interest or help.
Rob.

P.S. Photo's taken with A Sony Alpha 350, using a 3.5-5.6/18-70 Sony lens and a Cosina 1:3.5-4.5/19-35 Wide angle lens. For those who wish to know.

 

[ajones]

I like the adjustable infeed fence.... can you get infeed/outfeed extension tables for longer work pieces?

 

[Rob-GB]

Yes. and a sliding table with fence. It is a cool bit of kit.

 

[ajones]

Yes. and a sliding table with fence. It is a cool bit of kit.

Rob it does look like a very nice bit of kit. I have the trend prt and t11 what I like about that is the router attaches is seconds tool free with no loose parts to lose. but it is not as sofisticated as the festool...

 

[peter halle]

You can also use the MFT/3 as an infeed or outfeed table.

 

[jonny round boy]

And, since it has the 'V' groove, and is the same height as the MFT (and therefore the same height as the Kapex on either the MFT Kapex or the new stand) you can use the new KA-UG Kapex extensions as infeed/outfeed tables, too.

Dontcha just love a system? [big grin]

 

[WarnerConstCo.]

Man I want one of those.

 

[nickao]

When I want a router table I want it set up and not have to take the router out when I need to route by hand.

When I want a table saw I want the table saw  ready to go while still having my circular saw ready to go.

In short I do not think these integrated systems are so great.  I want everything separate ready to go and be used within seconds of each other. I do not want to mess around changing configurations.

The CMS set I don't ever see being such a big item in the US. Personally I want a table saw that weighs something, even if it is a portable saw. I want a better, heavier, smoother, flatter  top than this system offers and as I said I would rather have all separates to make the work flow go smoother. Moving MFT's around is not what I want to do either. Once we set up our job site for a month long job its like a little shop and we set up stations and don't want to mess around changing configurations every-time we need a different tool. I do not cross cut much on a small table saw of the CMS size, but the sliding option does look neat on it the though.

In short I do not think there is a great rush for Festool to get these over here in the USA because most people I know(90% which are in the trades as there primary income) and the general public are not going to buy these. Now on this forum maybe the fans will, but the general public in the US I personally do not think so. Festool seems smart and this may be the most important reason they are not selling them here, they just don't think  they will make enough profit to warrant it. It's a business. If they thought it would make them multi-millions of dollars they would get UL approval in a matter of months or weeks and would be selling them here. Now in this economy even guys that want them may not be able to afford them so most likely we will not see them for a long time, if ever.

 

[harry_]

Man I want one of those.

Just one?

 

[image132]

When I want a router table I want it set up and not have to take the router out when I need to route by hand.

When I want a table saw I want the table saw  ready to go while still having my circular saw ready to go.

In short I do not think these integrated systems are so great.  I want everything separate ready to go and be used within seconds of each other. I do not want to mess around changing configurations.

The CMS set I don't ever see being such a big item in the US. Personally I want a table saw that weighs something, even if it is a portable saw. I want a better, heavier, smoother, flatter  top than this system offers and as I said I would rather have all separates to make the work flow go smoother. Moving MFT's around is not what I want to do either. Once we set up our job site for a month long job its like a little shop and we set up stations and don't want to mess around changing configurations every-time we need a different tool. I do not cross cut much on a small table saw of the CMS size, but the sliding option does look neat on it the though.

In short I do not think there is a great rush for Festool to get these over here in the USA because most people I know(90% which are in the trades as there primary income) and the general public are not going to buy these. Now on this forum maybe the fans will, but the general public in the US I personally do not think so. Festool seems smart and this may be the most important reason they are not selling them here, they just don't think  they will make enough profit to warrant it. It's a business. If they thought it would make them multi-millions of dollars they would get UL approval in a matter of months or weeks and would be selling them here. Now in this economy even guys that want them may not be able to afford them so most likely we will not see them for a long time, if ever.

I stand to be corrected here but to my knowledge the Preciso CS isn't in the US either and that would suit your needs perfectly wouldn't it? So then the next question would be "Why aren't they rushing to push the Preciso through to the US?" Most likely it is being held up for the same reason as the CMS.

Also to my knowledge the CMS system (is that not what the "S" stands for in CMS?) is not designed to be a permanent saw or router table. I can see where you are coming from though. I know I would much rather buy the Preciso CS over the CMS and table saw attachment. However the latter would save me about R10 000 and allow me to save space in my shop as I could potentially throw away my table saw and router table. Understand where I am coming from?

To Rob,

Thanks for the review. It is much appreciated. Once you get comfortable with it please let us know what it is like and how you feel about it. Eg Is it very simple to use, is extraction clean and good, are there things you would like to see changed or added?

 

[Corwin]

I think that the CMS system would be a hit here in North American markets if enough of the tool inserts were to also come our way.  I can see how the TS saw and maybe even the jigsaw modules might be a problem getting UL approval here.  Hope this is not the case, but it could go that way, and that may make this CMS fail here as I don't see this being successful if only the router module is available. 

To Rob,

Thanks for the review. It is much appreciated. Once you get comfortable with it please let us know what it is like and how you feel about it. Eg Is it very simple to use, is extraction clean and good, are there things you would like to see changed or added?

Yeah, what Chris said!  [big grin]

 

[nickao]

I just do not buy the UL approval thing at all. If it were that they would change the tools in question  and get it done in a month if they really wanted to. This has been talked about at least 4 years and nothing takes 4 years to get through. So to me it is a business decision. Festool engineers are more than smart enough to make a few quick changes to get UL approval if they wanted to.

I just do not think the American woodworkers in general would be receptive to the idea. And the Preciso CS is exactly the type tool I am talking  about that Americans don't like. It is a light weight system and even advertised as that. Not a heavy sturdy machine like we are used to in the States. It may take a bit longer for Americans to warm up to the lighter weight tools.

We are biased here on Festool forum as we know and love Festool. Still to this day I have never ever been on a job site here in the US where anyone had a Festool and most still never even heard of Festool except me. And the Festools have been here and out quite a while. Most carpenters and woodworkers that I know in the US want bigger heavier machines even if they have to make the laborers lug them around.

I had some carpenters over here last week and showed them some of my shop and they were not impressed by the Festools at all, especially when they asked about cost.

Festool probably knows what they are doing and they may not believe certain tools will make them money here or they would be here. I think once they believe the tools can be profitable for them the tools will get here.

The tools may be a hit here on the Festool forums and for people that already have and/or know Festool. I am not so sure it would be such a hit with carpenters and woodworkers here in the states in general.

IMHO at this point I believe it just has to be about profit, not UL approval.

 

[EcoFurniture]

I just do not buy the UL approval thing at all. If it were that they would change the tools in question  and get it done in a month if they really wanted to. This has been talked about at least 4 years and nothing takes 4 years to get through. So to me it is a business decision. Festool engineers are more than smart enough to make a few quick changes to get UL approval if they wanted to.

I just do not think the American woodworkers in general would be receptive to the idea. And the Preciso CS is exactly the type tool I am talking  about that Americans don't like. It is a light weight system and even advertised as that. Not a heavy sturdy machine like we are used to in the States. It may take a bit longer for Americans to warm up to the lighter weight tools.

We are biased here on Festool forum as we know and love Festool. Still to this day I have never ever been on a job site here in the US where anyone had a Festool and most still never even heard of Festool except me. And the Festools have been here and out quite a while. Most carpenters and woodworkers that I know in the US want bigger heavier machines even if they have to make the laborers lug them around.

I had some carpenters over here last week and showed them some of my shop and they were not impressed by the Festools at all, especially when they asked about cost.

Festool probably knows what they are doing and they may not believe certain tools will make them money here or they would be here. I think once they believe the tools can be profitable for them the tools will get here.

The tools may be a hit here on the Festool forums and for people that already have and/or know Festool. I am not so sure it would be such a hit with carpenters and woodworkers here in the states in general.

IMHO at this point I believe it just has to be about profit, not UL approval.

Well said! I noticed the same when on site....People ask about it, but as soon as you go into some details, they start laughing and call you stupid for spending sooo much money... At my workplace, I have even been told not to use my Festools in the shop anymore.... Go figure. 

 

[Corwin]

...
I just do not think the American woodworkers in general would be receptive to the idea. And the Preciso CS is exactly the type tool I am talking  about that Americans don't like. It is a light weight system and even advertised as that. Not a heavy sturdy machine like we are used to in the States. It may take a bit longer for Americans to warm up to the lighter weight tools.

We are biased here on Festool forum as we know and love Festool. Still to this day I have never ever been on a job site here in the US where anyone had a Festool and most still never even heard of Festool except me. And the Festools have been here and out quite a while. Most carpenters and woodworkers that I know in the US want bigger heavier machines even if they have to make the laborers lug them around.

I had some carpenters over here last week and showed them some of my shop and they were not impressed by the Festools at all, especially when they asked about cost.
...

In this little corner of the country, none of the above holds true.  Several companies in my little town have nice assortments of Festools.  And I am certain that this CMS would be a hit here -- and the Preciso CS too.

 

[nickao]

Wait a second, I did not say you can't buy them and many stores sell them. I said on real working job sites I have never seen them, that's the difference. If you are in the trades and see them at most jobs then that is surly a minority as most everyone I have talked to on the forums and read about have the same experience I do on actual on sites.

Mostly the guys here are the guys that have Festools on site and that's about it. If the job sites in your area have workers that actually use Festools on site I would be very very surprised. Chicago and the extended suburbs are a pretty big area and I have jobs I see through 5 counties and the city itself, still no Festools on any job sites I have ever seen to date, union and non union.

Who would these be a big hit with on actual job site in the US? The CMS stuff is lightweight and flimsy and I would never bring that to a union job site , it would get ruined for sure. I think maybe the one man show would use the CMS not a crew of guys running around working their asses off, sharing tools, at least not here yet.

The job sites need tough tools that take a beating where guys can share, I just do not see Festool breaking that market in the US for years to come. In Shops maybe, but its big construction that can sell a lot of tools, not the small amount of people here on the forum.

In this economy there is no way a Carpenter is spending anymore money they can with worrying if they are even working tomorrow. I think Festool is smart waiting it out for now.

 

[PeterK]

I just don't understand the UL thing. How is it that Harbor Freight can have a store section full of crappy electrically operated tools selling for cheap? They seem to have no problem getting UL licensing. How is it that Home Depot can sell hundreds of cheap light fixtures that always seem to be changing versions and they have UL stamp? Are the Chinese the only ones who know how to go through the UL approval system? Dremel constantly changes their power tools, Milwaukee seems to be constantly introducing new tools. Guess you just have to manufacture in China now. Sears is always coming out with revised household vacuums and carpet cleaners with UL stamps. Appliances change frequently requiring updating of their UL stamp. Curious.

 

[Rob-GB]

And, since it has the 'V' groove, and is the same height as the MFT (and therefore the same height as the Kapex on either the MFT Kapex or the new stand) you can use the new KA-UG Kapex extensions as infeed/outfeed tables, too.

Dontcha just love a system? [big grin]

Yeah! [big grin]

My decision, for getting the router table, was influenced by several factors. Firstly, I wanted a router that was better than the Dewalt version of my old Elu 177E. I have both and the Dewalt one is a pain to use. The Festool OF2200 ticked all the right boxes.
Having been plunged ( [wink] ) back into a lot of on site joinery work, due to the economic downturn, I got fed up with making MDF router tables to get out of a fix.
No longer did I have a workshop full of seriously big kit to rely on, what I needed was a workshop that could go with me in my little van. The CMS modular system was an obvious choice, due to it's flexibility in usage options. The advantage of buying one at the same time as the router was fiscal, there is a cost saving when buying a complete set.  ;D
I want to get the TS75 later and a table insert, the TS55 is great but not man enough for tablesaw applications (in my view). (The TS55 is available with a CMS package but not the TS75!) [huh]
Weight, was another factor. I currently live in an apartment, have no garage or workshop space, so all my kit has to be carried upstairs to our spare room when not required on site. Add in to this mix my back injury woes... well,  weight really is a 'weighty' issue.  [sad]

Chris, I will certainly report further as and when I get a chance to put both router and table through an on site workload. This review is thanks to both you and to the Festool kit I used saturday morning, TS55 and Parallel Guides that got a days work done in half the time, so I had time to do this.

Regards Rob

P.S. Any questions, will be answered to the best of my knowledge.