Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.

[Jim Becker]

My issues are few and far between. The only lingering stitch in my side is the inability to get square drive bits from Festool for the Centrotec system...I have to make them using Tom's method and they are certainly not the same quality as they would be from Festool. Visibility with the jigsaw is what it is and I've learned to compensate for it. Outside of that, I'm a happy camper and would consider Festool strongly for any future tool need where they have an entry.

 

[Michael Kellough]

I understand Nick's reasons for starting these threads but I think we (prospective and current owners of Festools) would be better served by threads for individual tools titled something like "Getting the most from you XY 123".

Under such a heading both shortcomings and workarounds would present a truer picture of what you get with a Festool and what you can do with it, and be easier to peruse when researching a tool.

For example Mirko and Eiji discovered that heir TS 75's placed the kerf of a 45 bevel below the lower corner of the guide rail rubber splinter guard. One of them discovered that a shim about the thickness of a credit card would bring the kerf back up to a tolerable proximity of where it should be and then moved on making money with the saws. Mirko said, "I'm man enough to admit I had to learn how to use the tools".

Information like this should be gathered in a place devoted to that tool, not a broad ranging disconnected mish-mash of complaints and random fixes.

 

[Frank Pellow]

Michael, I agree with you and that is why I have (with one exception  :-[) not posted to these two threads. 

 

[JayStPeter]

I've come and gone from this group over the years for the same reasons as Nick.  There's enough good info here to keep my interest.  But, I have had some bad vibes come my way when I have made comments about shortcomings of certain tools and accessories.

 

[greg mann]

Jay, I understand the feeling. It does seem, though, that certain types of threads will draw contentious responses no matter what the norm is for any given forum. SMC has 'em. WoodCentral has'em.....etc. It sometimes takes a lot of discipline to not comment when one sees a post that is really aimed at soliciting overly passionate response, whether it is outright trolling or just someone's axe being ground. We all tend to think we can make the definitive post, the one that will clarify all and be the last word. It just never happens, probably because none of us are Mark Twain or Winston Churchill.  :

For the most part, we do pretty well here, and sometimes, very, very well. Keep checking in. Sometimes members come and go for their own reasons. It seems the ambiance changes, up or down, with these comings and goings so the nature of things today will be different in a month. I feel it usually flows back to the good in reasonable time. For the record, it may sound like I am singling out Nickao but I do not intend that. These are general observations.

 

[colinw]

      I used to think this forum was a friendly place, since this thread was posted my opinion has changed, It should not matter how much a member posts or what he posts people should respect his opinion ( as long as he is being polite and not trying to offend anybody ) I'm not saying you must agree with him but a least have the common courtesy to either make constructive comments to the writer or ignore the topic, no one deserves to be " attacked " for voicing their opinion. Nick even tried to restart the thread with an explanation of his idea and even asked for just input on tools still someone had to jump in and flame the writer again.
        Nick had good ideas and his work speaks for its self I personally am ashamed at some of the comments made to him. well i guess you won't have to deal with him anymore as after this "bashing" he took he has left (this is according to Matthew so I don't think its a rumor) Shame a great guy who would help you out and play devils advocate every now and then, which helped balance things out ........ A sad day for this forum.............. you guys proud of your selves ?

I unlike Nickao WILL NOT be drawn into an argument about this ........ This is  a comment not a question ........and if this generates the same reaction as nicks post oh well

I still see FOG as a great place for Festool information and for guides but can not shake the bitter taste this whole thing has left in my mouth

Colin.

 

[tallgrass]

i am sorry that nick has left. :'(

 

[JayStPeter]

Jay, I understand the feeling. It does seem, though, that certain types of threads will draw contentious responses no matter what the norm is for any given forum. SMC has 'em. WoodCentral has'em.....etc.

Ya know, one of the topics I avoid on other forums is Festool.  So, I understand why some feel the need to defend their Festool infatuation.

While no Mark Twain, you have done a reasonable job of describing the ebb and flow of a forum  ;D.

 

[Frank Pellow]

Nick, if you happen to read this, I hope that you reconsider your decision and come back.

 

[josephgewing]

Sad day for us all.  I hope we collectively and individually do better the next time around.

Joe

 

[Matthew Schenker]

Good Afternoon,
Just so everyone knows the story, I never asked Nick to leave the forum.  In fact, it was a surprise to me when I checked into the forum this morning to see that he had put in a request to have his account deleted.  I've written to Nick, essentially pleading with him to reconsider his decision.

With that said, I don't believe it is anyone's fault that Nick left the forum.  The responses he received to his recent posts were somewhat harsh at times, but looking back over them I don't think they were anything that should necessarily lead to him deleting his account.

On a technical note, Nick's account is not officially deleted until I approve the request, which I have not done.  If Nick changes his mind, it would be very easy for me to reverse the request and we could leave this episode behind us.

Matthew

 

[Matthew Schenker]

..... Its like a cheerleading team for Festool. .....

The FOG Blog  reminds me of the Easy Blog on SMC.  They'll try to convince you the product is so good it will do the work for you and clean up after itself. 

Not that there isn't good information on either site, but they can go over the top at times in their professed love and defence of the product.

An earlier poster said that threads like this were ignored by manufacturers and I have to disagree.  Threads like this can be a gold mine for real infomation on product issues. 

After all, it's hard to get good, constructive criticism from the choir.

The ez forum is nothing like the FOG.

I agree with d.epstein, and I'm a bit surprised Steveo made this comparison!  The vast majority of people in this forum have always welcomed criticism.

On a more technical note, this is not a blog.  It's a forum.  That might account for some of the difference.  A blog is generally the thoughts and opinions of one person.  A forum represents wider views of a community of people.

Matthew

 

[sw1211]

More importantly, almost every time, there is a solution provided for criticisms/design "problems"

There's a heck of a lot more creativity provided here than "cheerleading," IMO.

 

[Steveo48]

Oy vey, boys, read the quote.  

I'm not comparing the WHOLE forum/blog/board/community, just the over the top flag waving that occasionally happens.  

I understand it's sometimes a hard concept to grasp if you're concentrating on waving the flag in unison with others.  

Steve

..... Its like a cheerleading team for Festool. .....

The FOG Blog  reminds me of the Easy Blog on SMC.  They'll try to convince you the product is so good it will do the work for you and clean up after itself. 

Not that there isn't good information on either site, but they can go over the top at times in their professed love and defence of the product.

An earlier poster said that threads like this were ignored by manufacturers and I have to disagree.  Threads like this can be a gold mine for real infomation on product issues. 

After all, it's hard to get good, constructive criticism from the choir.

The ez forum is nothing like the FOG.

I agree with d.epstein, and I'm a bit surprised Steveo made this comparison!  The vast majority of people in this forum have always welcomed criticism.

On a more technical note, this is not a blog.  It's a forum.  That might account for some of the difference.  A blog is generally the thoughts and opinions of one person.  A forum represents wider views of a community of people.

Matthew

 

[Matthew Schenker]

Oy vey, boys, read the quote. 

I'm not comparing the WHOLE forum/blog/board/community, just the over the top flag waving that occasionally happens. 

I understand it's sometimes a hard concept to grasp if you're concentrating on waving the flag in unison with others. 

Steve

I read the quote, and it doesn't change my earlier points.
I strongly disagree with any comparison, on any level, with the forum you refer to.
And I strongly disagree with your statements about flag waving, choirs, or cheerleaders.
Matthew

 

[Sweet]

Sorry for crashing the thread.

Arguments, heated or not, are part of my daily life on the jobsite. As my old Royal Marines Sergeant Major used to say "we are all Volunteers, that means we can't complain, we VOLUNTEERED for this s**t". We volunteer to be part of the FOG! Let's enjoy it! ;D

Festool's are used by professionals, amatuers and enthusiasts alike. The company has to make money and keep it's customers coming back for more. But don't forget, Festool is designed by humans, manufactured by machines and used by humans. It won't ever be, can't ever be perfect. But in my experience on the whole it sure beats DeWalt, Makita etc.

BTW, I'm gonna go and get a Kapex tomorrow. I sold my Small Makita and I was never really happy with the DW708. Just wish someone made a decent mitre saw stand over here. My Van is full enough already, Just can't see where I could fit the Kapex MFT and all the accessories.  :-\

 

[Steve Jones]

I am deeply saddened by the news that Nick has decided to cancel his membership in this forum..

Nick, if you read this please reconsider your decision I for one enjoy your contributions and will miss your presence here.

Everyone else: I'm not at all surprised at Nick's decision, I took another look at this thread which was started by him in good faith as an attempt to help others;

Here are some quotes from earlier responses:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm sorry, but it's difficult seeing this as being useful.
I generally don't have time to respond to whining threads and I do think this is one
A negative thread like this will surely cause negative responses to the originator.
this thread is also NOT constructive
This sounds like whining to me.  If you have an issue, give the company an opportunity to fix it.
I personally don't see the value of this thread.
how will it help anyone?
we have already talked about these problems.
you want "outsiders" looking in to see a Festool "shit list"
Seeing this post and these attacks makes me wonder about this group and what they have to hide.
I would hate to think what some of our guests think right now.
Whining is rarely useful.
I am not getting involved in this thread
Do you use these tools or do you just  sit around and complain about them.
MaybeI would buy another brand If you have so many problems with them. you are not using them correctly.
I do have some of my own issues with Festool as well, which I will not go into here given where this thread is going.
Unfortunately, this thread has mostly proved that most folks here are not interested seeing the negatives
it is amazing to me the amount of crap that this discussion has generated.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What a bunch of hatefull, spitefull old ladies!

I hope you're all proud of your "contributions"

I check unread posts regularly, lately this forum is declining into a pissing competition with no new or valuable discussions about Festools and their operation.

 

[pmkierst]

If I may humbly suggest, there has been some obvious trolling going on from new-sign-ups, and people seem to be going for it and feeding the trolls.

When a one or two post member fires a big fat insult, it is best to ignore it. Well, actually, when people make obvious pot-shots, it is best to just ignore it.

Just my $0.02.

 

[Matthew Schenker]

I am deeply saddened by the news that Nick has decided to cancel his membership in this forum..

Nick, if you read this please reconsider your decision I for one enjoy your contributions and will miss your presence here.

Everyone else: I'm not at all surprised at Nick's decision, I took another look at this thread which was started by him in good faith as an attempt to help others;

...

I posted this in another place, but because of the circumstances I want to post it here as well...
I never asked Nick to leave the forum.  In fact, it was a surprise to me when I checked into the forum this morning to see that he had put in a request to have his account deleted.  I've written to Nick, essentially pleading with him to reconsider his decision.

With that said, I don't believe it is anyone's fault that Nick left the forum.  The responses he received to his recent posts were somewhat harsh at times, but looking back over them I don't think they were anything that should necessarily lead to him deleting his account.

On a technical note, Nick's account is not officially deleted until I approve the request, which I have not done.  If Nick changes his mind, it would be very easy for me to reverse the request and we could leave this episode behind us.

Matthew

 

[colinw]

Steve Jones,
                  Thanks for being honest and not being afraid to speak up, I posted earlier in the retry of this thread in case you or anyone else missed it its quoted below.Since I posted this I have had a LOT of personal emails from people echoing my thoughts but do not want to post this for fear of receiving a similar bashing that nickao received. People in an open minded community should be able to voice there ideas without fear of being attacked!!!!
                   

Quote

"
I used to think this forum was a friendly place, since this thread was posted my opinion has changed, It should not matter how much a member posts or what he posts people should respect his opinion ( as long as he is being polite and not trying to offend anybody ) I'm not saying you must agree with him but a least have the common courtesy to either make constructive comments to the writer or ignore the topic, no one deserves to be " attacked " for voicing their opinion. Nick even tried to restart the thread with an explanation of his idea and even asked for just input on tools still someone had to jump in and flame the writer again.
        Nick had good ideas and his work speaks for its self I personally am ashamed at some of the comments made to him. well i guess you won't have to deal with him anymore as after this "bashing" he took he has left (this is according to Matthew so I don't think its a rumor) Shame a great guy who would help you out and play devils advocate every now and then, which helped balance things out ........ A sad day for this forum.............. you guys proud of your selves ?

I unlike Nickao WILL NOT be drawn into an argument about this ........ This is  a comment not a question ........and if this generates the same reaction as nicks post oh well

I still see FOG as a great place for Festool information and for guides but can not shake the bitter taste this whole thing has left in my mouth

Colin."