Dining table

[roy c]

New to the domino, and this group(hello to all). Finally made the purchase, a DF500. First project(after some practice) will be a dining table. Will the 500 with the 60mm domino be enough to attach the stretchers to the legs. Initially planning on using 1”X4” for stretchers. The legs are Turned with 5”X5” at the top. Will the 60mm out of the 500 be enough, and if so how many dominos would you use per joint? Or would I be better sticking to a tradition M&T joint? Thanks in advance.

 

[martin felder]

Just my 002.  I have the 500 and the 700XL.  With that, I never think if I want more than the 500 provides, I need mortise and tenon.  I just use the 700, and that tends to be with things like tables and doors and wood over 1 inch thick. I actually like the 700 more than the 500 as for many things I would do with the 500 I can do with biscuits or Mafell dowels, but the 700 has no rival, at least in my thinking. 

 

[CeeJay]

I have the same challenge, using the DF500 for a 2m x 1m patio table.

I’ll be using 10mm x 50mm hardwood dominoes.

Legs will be 45mm square. Rails will be 25mm x 85mm.

One idea I was toying with was alternating the plunge of the domino for the rail/leg mortises.

What I mean is with3 dominoes per joint (3 x 1) rather than doing 25mm/25mm plunges, do a 30mm plunge next to a 20mm plunge, and mirror them, so each joint in total has 60mm of tenon length even though the individual dominoes are only 50mm. Does that make sense? Has anyone tried this?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Stone Message]

Hi [member=74156]roy c[/member]

I think that the DF500 may not provide the length that you require. You could try and squeeze in some extra 10 mm dominos but it may be better to borrow a DF700 if you can.

Here is the table that I made last year:


Peter

 

[nvalinski]

For knock down assembly, I've done this exact method with two 10x50 mm dominoes glued into the stretchers and then either a bed bolt positioned in the middle of the two or a corner block with threaded inserts to pull things tight. Dominoes are still useful for providing the shear strength against the joint moving, but you don't necessarily need the length of the XL unless you were to use those specific knock down connectors.

 

[ChuckM]

Don't know your exact design. If it allows it, use double/twin dominoes. I build tables with the DF500 only as I don't have the XL which is too big and too heavy for my regular uses.

If you have only one or two projects that require tenons longer than those that a DF500 can handle, consider making a drilling jig  (like a dowel jig) to make the mortises (milled by the DF50) longer. Of course, you need to make your own dominoes or buy the ones for the XL. PM me if you do need to use very long tenons.

 

[Mike Goetzke]

This is a great discussion. I'm not a pro but build many things. 10 years ago I built a wood entrance door with sidelights. Came out perfect! I had a pro on another forum work me through it. Per his suggestion I used long dowels for the rail/stile joints. Door is still good as new!

Anyway, I was thinking what length of dowel or tenon is adequate? I know that these end grain to face grain glue joints are not super strong and need reinforcement but how much. I know there is shear load and pulling load. I would think for a table stretcher shear load would be king so maybe dowels/tenons may not need to be unreasonably long? Is there test data to determine what is required for various applications?

Mike 

 

[nclemmons]

Here's a dining table I made with the Domino 500. 

https://www.festoolownersgroup.com/member-projects/walnut-dining-table/msg429056/#msg429056

The leg stretchers on the ends used Dominoes.  They were about 1" x 4" on the ends tapering down to maybe 1" x 2.5"  I believe I used 3 dominoes across the 4" height of the stretcher. 

The long sides accommodated an expandable mechanism I made for leaves.  There I used KD fasteners for easy disassembly for moving it.

I think you'll be fine with your plan.

 

[ChuckM]

Here's a dining table I made with the Domino 500. 
Snip.

Nakashima would have approved of your match!

 

[roy c]

Here is the leg I’ll be working with, 5”X5”. Normally I would cut a mortise about a 2” deep mortise. Using a stretcher that’s 1”X4” would 4 or maybe 6 of the 60mm dominos be enough?

 

[mkasdin]

Don't know your exact design. If it allows it, use double/twin dominoes. I build tables with the DF500 only as I don't have the XL which is too big and too heavy for my regular uses.

If you have only one or two projects that require tenons longer than those that a DF500 can handle, consider making a drilling jig  (like a dowel jig) to make the mortises (milled by the DF50) longer. Of course, you need to make your own dominoes or buy the ones for the XL. PM me if you do need to use very long tenons.

along the same lines you could use the setting for the most lateral slack which should give you a 27mm wide tenon x 10mm.  I contemplated taking a pattern bit to hollow out the extra depth instead of a jig. Probably only need extra depth on the mortise end.
I’m wondering if you could combine that with a dowel joint or cross dowel the tenon for extra strength. Once you get into lumber over sheet goods then the 700xl makes more sense.
If your just doing a few joints do a standard mortise and tenon with a sharp chisel. Try an experimental joint to see what’s necessary and best case practice? Lee valley sells a cross dowel bolt for work benches, that would make your legs removable. I’m not sure of the aesthetics your after. I’m not sure if a half lap joint would work either?

 

[roy c]

No need for table to break down, just wondering if the 500 with the biggest tenon would work. I will likely go the route of traditional M&T to attach stretchers to legs.

 

[JimD]

I got the 700 to make deeper mortises for things like table stretchers.  I don't think 1 inch is deep enough but it might work. 

I have not purchased any domino tenons yet (I've had the XL less than a year but have built several things with it).  I make my own.  One of the reasons is I like to use what I call "normal" tenons.  In a 4 inch wide stretcher, I would have at least a 2 1/2 inch wide and probably a 3 inch wide tenon in it.  That is easily done with a domino machine with repeated plunges.  I made some significantly wider for a crib.  The mortises look good when you are done.  You just have to make the tenons.  I use my little lunchbox planner to get the material to the right thickness, rip to width on the table saw and round over the edges on my router table.  Then I cut the tenon stock to length.  Doesn't take long, much easier than cutting traditional tenons and then having to trim the shoulders with a shoulder plane and still sometimes not getting great fit. 

So if you try it, I would make your own wide tenons so you can maximize your chance of having a strong enough joint.  You will lose long grain to long grain gluing surface with lots of little tenons.