Domino DF 500 - Second Post!

[hammy]

Since I received such great advice in my first post:https://www.festoolownersgroup.com/festool-tools-accessories/which-sander-to-buy-first!-first-post-in-the-forum/,  I'm already looking ahead to my next potential purchase, which is the Domino 500.  It really is amazing what this machine can do from watching videos and whatnot but my question is can it totally replace the mortise and tenon (and almost every other hand made) joint?  As a novice weekend warrior who is late to the woodworking game I've been using a lot of pocket screw joinery and have not evolved into actual skilled hand made joinery and if I could just evolve into using the Domino that would be great.  My furniture projects so far turn out great with pocket screws carefully placed but I think I could really up my game with the Domino! 

Look forward to all comments and suggestions, thank you. 

 

[afish]

The Domino and Mafell DDf40 are both great each has there own pluses and minuses but I would classify both as game changing tools.  The Domino was actually the first festool I purchased.  Im sure you will find many uses for one once you own it. 

 

[Crazyraceguy]

Yes, it is a game changing thing. The DF500 was my first Festool purchase too. I got it in '14 and have been very happy with it ever since. I wish I had done it years before.
The TS55 is high on the list too.

 

[CeeJay]

I learned traditional M&T first, and then how to use the DF500. I use both now depending on application.

For instance for this outdoor table top I used 88 10mm x 50mm sapele dominoes to assemble it:

But for the frame I needed large tenons for strength (50mm deep x 45mm high x 12.5mm wide on the long sides), so I did these the traditional way:

Plus I made some 10mm ebony dowels to pin the tenons for additional strength given it will be moved around quite a lot.

I think that even if I had a DF700 I would probably still have done these large tenons the traditional way.

Hope that helps!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Josh2]

The Df500 is a game changer and certainly a great purchase. But I also want to say that it’s easy to overlook the variety and beauty of joints when you get started and think that the DF500 can just do everything. I got serious about woodworking as a hobby maybe a little more than a year ago. Bought a DF500 and thought that I will do everything with it. I still use it a lot but I also learned about all the other joint. I thought I will do our solid white oak kitchen drawers with it but quickly changed to box joint, which looks way better. I thought I will do mid-panel joints for shelf’s but switched to the 32mm system for cabinets. That all might sound silly to the pros but when you get started it’s easy so think about the Df500 as the ultimate solution to everything.

 

[grbmds]

For standard hidden mortise and tenon joints, I'd say the Domino could replace them. However, if you plan to use exposed mortise and tenon joinery, like in Arts and Crafts or Mission furniture, you won't be able to do those with a Domino (unless you make your own dominos to match whatever style of exposed joinery you are into). The Domino is one of the most useful and innovative tools I've ever owned. It allows me easily and quickly create joints that might take much longer to do with other methods. It allows me to design things that I wouldn't otherwise necessarily attempt. Again, though, I know of no tool I own which satisfies all my woodworking needs for that type of tool.

 

[Jim_in_PA]

I will go so far to say that the Domino (either version) is the one Festool tool that is a good purchase even for folks who prefer tool brands of different colors. I made an error in judgement for waiting too long to acquire mine. (I have the D700 XL)

 

[Birdhunter]

I also put off buying the Domino 500 due to cost and that I was ok with traditional mortise tenon joints.

Once I got the 500, I regretted not doing so earlier. I later got the 700 for building some big stuff.

There is a learning curve for both machines. Watch videos and practice on scrap.

Stay away from post market accessories until you have used the machine for a while. I have a drawer full of neat accessories that are very dusty. The one accessory I do use is the Big Foot. It adds stability to some. Cuts.

I don’t know what tools you own, but I usually advise new woodworkers to buy a Woodpecker square, Starret combination square, and Lie Nielsen block and bench planes.

 

[RussellS]

This might be a post I should not make because I do not own a Domino.  But I agree with all of the prior responses.  I'm going to equate my Dewalt biscuit joiner to the Domino.  I know, sacrilege.  But long ago I got the biscuit joiner and it made lots of things easier.  Lining up boards so they were flat and joining wood together invisible.  It took a lot of thought, worry, trouble out of lots of mundane tasks.  I think the Domino does that.  But as others said, it does not do everything and there are many times you will use another method.  And that is OK.  But you probably could use the Domino too.

The Domino might be kind of like those $80,000 four door pick-ups you see everywhere now.  It can haul lots of people.  It can haul lots of stuff either in the backseat or box.  It can pull trailers.  With 4x4 it can go anywhere off road or in snow.  And being $80,000 it has leather and stereos and bluetooth and every other luxury on earth.  So it kind of replaces the minivan and replaces the work truck and replaces the SUV and replaces the luxury Cadillac sedan too.  Sort of the one vehicle to rule/subjugate them all.  Kind of like the Domino for joints.  And woodworking is about joints.

 

[Birdhunter]

Funny in that I own both Dominos and the Mafell dowel machine, but I still dig out my DeWalt biscuit machine occasionally. Confession, I own two DeWalt biscuit machines. One regular size and one for wee biscuits.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

I had a Dewalt biscuit joiner and used it frequently for years, but after losing it in a fire, I have not replaced it.
There are things the DF500 can do that the biscuit joiner cannot, but not the other way around. There is nothing you "need" a biscuit joiner for if you have a DF500.
Now a Lamello Zeta P-2 is a completely different thing. They are fantastic too.

 

[hammy]

This might be a post I should not make because I do not own a Domino.  But I agree with all of the prior responses.  I'm going to equate my Dewalt biscuit joiner to the Domino.  I know, sacrilege.  But long ago I got the biscuit joiner and it made lots of things easier.  Lining up boards so they were flat and joining wood together invisible.  It took a lot of thought, worry, trouble out of lots of mundane tasks.  I think the Domino does that.  But as others said, it does not do everything and there are many times you will use another method.  And that is OK.  But you probably could use the Domino too.

The Domino might be kind of like those $80,000 four door pick-ups you see everywhere now.  It can haul lots of people.  It can haul lots of stuff either in the backseat or box.  It can pull trailers.  With 4x4 it can go anywhere off road or in snow.  And being $80,000 it has leather and stereos and bluetooth and every other luxury on earth.  So it kind of replaces the minivan and replaces the work truck and replaces the SUV and replaces the luxury Cadillac sedan too.  Sort of the one vehicle to rule/subjugate them all.  Kind of like the Domino for joints.  And woodworking is about joints.

I've got the pickup so I can relate to the Domino comparison!

 

[mkasdin]

I can relate I’ve got a $800 truck so it’s more like the Dewalt biscuit joiner. 2004 Ford F-150 270,000 miles supercab. Paid for many years ago, so no payments and no insurance on the vehicle. It ain’t pretty but it runs, tows, hauls ...

 

[mcooley]

Here are a couple of my best and worst parts of the tool.

First, it is a great tool for speeding up the process of doing loose tenons but not a substitute as others have said for when hand done is required. That said I use my DF 500 a lot and I have a small custom furniture making studio.

I like the versatility when it comes to using it in both the horizontal and vertical configurations as well as clamping small pieces directly to the fence plate and just mortising in place in the vertical position.

Tool quality is high and nothing too flimsy but not the lightest weight either. Ergonomics is not great though and the fact the barrel grip is basically non-existent is strange unlike the Mafell. The rear grill vent, the plug and your hand isn't the greatest place to plunge from but it gives you the most control. Being up near the dust shroud means one's knuckles get in the way of a deep plunge.

The machine is very accurate which is what counts but as I alluded to before aside from oiling the rails there isn't much maintenance and tune ups to do. I do recommend the extended manual document not published by Festool. Their manual is not helpful.

A few other issues about repairs. All of us know here that Festool does full rebuilds on most issues so if you think they are just going to fix the one issue and not look at the whole thing then prepare yourself because I sent my DF 500 in for replacing one of the power connector pins which had broken off and they found the "pot" for the pendulum needed replacement. The repair went from being around $100 to closer to $300. 

Issues then are no LED light for better sighting; no foot on back-end to prevent tool from spinning out on tabletop with the hose connected; poor ergonomics with no rubber grip or properly shaped barrel; lack of fine adjustment on stops other than plastic cams or making your own for the rails; power switch is often too cumbersome; and would prefer aluminum parts as far as accessories but this is the case for nearly all Festool accessory items.

In all it is a great tool but to get the most out of it you will need to fashion from time to time some jigs. In fact I have had some jig design ideas for years which would be great for the Domino. The main one is when plunging not on an edge and so there are many times when referencing off an edge isn't happening. And although there are many after market accessories for doing just that there aren't to my knowledge ones for working somewhere else on the board and in particular on pieces that are not shelving etc. But for smaller more furniture like pieces.

Hope this helps.
https://prideandarchive.com/

 

[shed9]

I originally had the DF500 and the XL700 (and RTS adapter) but sold the 500 a fews years back. I thought the 700 would cover all I needed and the 500 was more a nice-to-have that really wasn't earning it's keep. I regretted the sale ever since and picked up a new 500 in the last week.

So from a perspective of did you buy the tool and would you buy it again, yes.

The 700 is (in my opinion) the better tool in ergonomics, weight and versatility but the 500 is sometimes just the more convenient option.

The thing with Festool right now in the current climate and inconsistent availability, if you buy it and you don't get on with it you could sell it with little to no financial loss.

 

[hammy]

Here are a couple of my best and worst parts of the tool.

First, it is a great tool for speeding up the process of doing loose tenons but not a substitute as others have said for when hand done is required. That said I use my DF 500 a lot and I have a small custom furniture making studio.

I like the versatility when it comes to using it in both the horizontal and vertical configurations as well as clamping small pieces directly to the fence plate and just mortising in place in the vertical position.

Tool quality is high and nothing too flimsy but not the lightest weight either. Ergonomics is not great though and the fact the barrel grip is basically non-existent is strange unlike the Mafell. The rear grill vent, the plug and your hand isn't the greatest place to plunge from but it gives you the most control. Being up near the dust shroud means one's knuckles get in the way of a deep plunge.

The machine is very accurate which is what counts but as I alluded to before aside from oiling the rails there isn't much maintenance and tune ups to do. I do recommend the extended manual document not published by Festool. Their manual is not helpful.

A few other issues about repairs. All of us know here that Festool does full rebuilds on most issues so if you think they are just going to fix the one issue and not look at the whole thing then prepare yourself because I sent my DF 500 in for replacing one of the power connector pins which had broken off and they found the "pot" for the pendulum needed replacement. The repair went from being around $100 to closer to $300. 

Issues then are no LED light for better sighting; no foot on back-end to prevent tool from spinning out on tabletop with the hose connected; poor ergonomics with no rubber grip or properly shaped barrel; lack of fine adjustment on stops other than plastic cams or making your own for the rails; power switch is often too cumbersome; and would prefer aluminum parts as far as accessories but this is the case for nearly all Festool accessory items.

In all it is a great tool but to get the most out of it you will need to fashion from time to time some jigs. In fact I have had some jig design ideas for years which would be great for the Domino. The main one is when plunging not on an edge and so there are many times when referencing off an edge isn't happening. And although there are many after market accessories for doing just that there aren't to my knowledge ones for working somewhere else on the board and in particular on pieces that are not shelving etc. But for smaller more furniture like pieces.

Hope this helps.
https://prideandarchive.com/

Thanks very informative and helpful!

 

[Michael Kellough]

[member=32478]mcooley[/member] sais, “I have had some jig design ideas for years which would be great for the Domino. The main one is when plunging not on an edge and so there are many times when referencing off an edge isn't happening.”

Hope you find time to present some of these ideas. That would be very interesting.

 

[mcooley]

[member=32478]mcooley[/member] sais, “I have had some jig design ideas for years which would be great for the Domino. The main one is when plunging not on an edge and so there are many times when referencing off an edge isn't happening.”

Hope you find time to present some of these ideas. That would be very interesting.

Thanks, yeah, me too!

 

[emlclcy]

i'm looking at getting one, all the adverts say a systainer 2, anyone seen it in a systainer 3?
regards
carl