Domino DF 700 XL and Building cube cases

[SplinterBound]

Hello,
  I am now the owner of a festool Domino machine.  As my Credit Card stops smoldering, I have decided on one of my projects to undertake.  One of them is a small cube storage cabinet  If you have ever seen the cube storage furniture sold at box stores.  This is what I am referring too.  They hold fabric square cubes to store items in a square holder on a shelf.  I plan to use 1/2 material and probably poplar since the price of other hardwood is still in the stratosphere.  This will be for indoors so I am not concerned about moisture too much.  So the plan would be to create two sides a  bottom and top.  But the shelves in between I plan to attach with tenons.  Being that the Domino is typically used in an edge referenced manner, how would I go about getting the Domino to place the tenons in the same line going up or down on the board.  So if you imagine adjustable shelves that use pegs.  I would be substituting the peg holes with tenons.  But clearly I want to ensure that the tenons are straight front to back on the side pieces, and in line with each other?  I was thinking that I can use a straight edge clamped to the wood to give me one consistent plane along the long side of the board.  But I would need to be able to place the tenons also on the same plane, and at the same location as the shelf.  Being that the DF 700 is a monster of a tool.  I am trying to go for something simple with clamps to make it easier to setup.  Unless there is another way???
Community:  Your suggestions are appreciated.

 

[Stone Message]

I made a video about the Domino DF500 which mostly covers the DF700 as well. Take a look at the section from 23 minutes 20 seconds in for what you are trying to achieve.


Peter

 

[afish]

Couple things:
1. congratulations on your new tool
2. 1/2 material for this project seems light.  I would be looking at 3/4 min.  A, because the 3/4 will hopefully stay a little straighter and B. It will give you more meat for the dominos
3. Which brings up another issue.  The DF 700 is a bit of a monster for the work you are describing.  Typically the 700 is more for Large projects such as building Doors (not cabinet doors either) the 500 is much better suited for case work. I dont use or own a 700 but the the smallest cutter for the 700 is 8mm or 5/16 which doesnt leave much or any material in 1/2.  The rule of thumb is 1/3 of material thickness so if you are using 1/2 or 12mm that means you should be using 4mm dominos.  Now, I have used 5mm before but thats what I would consider the max.  If you dont have any meat around the tenon then its going to be a weak joint and most likely fail.  There is an adaptor that allows the 700 to use smaller cutters but I have no experience with it so others could offer better advise in that area.
4. Now to answer your question for locating the dominos in the vertical pieces.  Thats pretty easy I would most likely use a jig. A scrap piece of wood that was cut at the proper dimensions that would reference off the front and bottom edge of the vertical pieces and was cut (SQUARE) and at the proper dimension the the DF700 or 500 would butt up to along the bottom of the machine.  For the df500 I can tell you its 10mm from the bottom of the plate to the center of the domino.  First decide on where the domino is going to be placed in the horizontal pieces (shelf) this will vary and may or may not end up directly in the center (most likely not) so you are going to have to keep track of top and bottoms once you have the location in the ends figured you can determine the location in the vertical pieces and do the math for the jig.  Yes you can clamp a square but consistency is going to be very important.

Good luck.

 

[jarbroen]

I bet Peter's video is the best way to get a visual aid for the process.
The way to Domino holes for shelving is to take the shelf and lay it along the reference line. 
You put the bottom of the Domino flat on the vertical to rout the shelf sides. 
You but the bottom of the Domino machine against the edge of the shelf for your vertical plunge into the box side.
That way, you're referencing off the same line and the same part of the Domino machine.  Easy peasy.
This works with material around 18mm-3/4".  With 1/2" stock the bottom of Domino machine reference(9mm to center) would put you really close to the one edge.

Not sure if that works as well on the XL as it does on the 500.  I've used the above method to build a bunch of cabinet projects with the DF500.

Basically, the best options would be to size up your material or size down the Domino.  Since you already have the XL on order, getting thicker stock might be the solution.  You can use the 8mm Dominos in 3/4" material - just keep in mind the placement.

 

[Stone Message]

The DF700 has a minimum depth of cut of 15 mm (nominal). That probably means 17 mm depth as there is an allowance for glue.

There is no real issue using 8 mm dominoes in 15 mm stock as long as you are careful - just watch the cutter coming all the way through on the 15 mm minimum depth setting.

Peter

 

[SplinterBound]

I made a video about the Domino DF500 which mostly covers the DF700 as well. Take a look at the section from 23 minutes 20 seconds in for what you are trying to achieve.


Peter

Thank you for the response. 
Peter

 

[SplinterBound]

Couple things:
1. congratulations on your new tool
2. 1/2 material for this project seems light.  I would be looking at 3/4 min.  A, because the 3/4 will hopefully stay a little straighter and B. It will give you more meat for the dominos
3. Which brings up another issue.  The DF 700 is a bit of a monster for the work you are describing.  Typically the 700 is more for Large projects such as building Doors (not cabinet doors either) the 500 is much better suited for case work. I dont use or own a 700 but the the smallest cutter for the 700 is 8mm or 5/16 which doesnt leave much or any material in 1/2.  The rule of thumb is 1/3 of material thickness so if you are using 1/2 or 12mm that means you should be using 4mm dominos.  Now, I have used 5mm before but thats what I would consider the max.  If you dont have any meat around the tenon then its going to be a weak joint and most likely fail.  There is an adaptor that allows the 700 to use smaller cutters but I have no experience with it so others could offer better advise in that area.
4. Now to answer your question for locating the dominos in the vertical pieces.  Thats pretty easy I would most likely use a jig. A scrap piece of wood that was cut at the proper dimensions that would reference off the front and bottom edge of the vertical pieces and was cut (SQUARE) and at the proper dimension the the DF700 or 500 would butt up to along the bottom of the machine.  For the df500 I can tell you its 10mm from the bottom of the plate to the center of the domino.  First decide on where the domino is going to be placed in the horizontal pieces (shelf) this will vary and may or may not end up directly in the center (most likely not) so you are going to have to keep track of top and bottoms once you have the location in the ends figured you can determine the location in the vertical pieces and do the math for the jig.  Yes you can clamp a square but consistency is going to be very important.

Good luck.

Thanks for your response. 
One thing that I did not mention, is I purchased:

https://www.senecawoodworking.com/products/smal-mortise-set-for-festool-domino-xl-df700

As you had stated, the 500 is more suited for the smaller tenons.  And it is definitely a monster when it comes to smaller wood stock.  But with that being said.  I don't do enough projects to justify buying two machines.  So this adapter set gives me enough flexibility to used the 700 to go down to 1/2 stock.  Which is as small as I will need to go.
  In a perfect world having the right tool for the right job every time, would be the way to go.  But sometimes money plays a factor in your decisions in life, unless you are a billionaire and then it doesn't matter.  Or win a festool lottery!!

I will figure out some sort of jig to register the shelves and where they will land.  Obviously measure twice, and cut once.  The main challenge will be to make sure the squares are inline with each other.  I will try a test piece to see if I am on the right track, before messing up the vertical piece that will be furniture. 

Of course the lazy solution would be just to go down to my local crapmart and purchase a china press board simulated piece of furniture:
https://www.walmart.com/ip/Better-H..._0&wl14=square cube storage&veh=sem&gclsrc=ds

BUT WHAT WOULD THE FUN BE IN THAT???

Thanks for your advice.

 

[SplinterBound]

I bet Peter's video is the best way to get a visual aid for the process.
The way to Domino holes for shelving is to take the shelf and lay it along the reference line. 
You put the bottom of the Domino flat on the vertical to rout the shelf sides. 
You but the bottom of the Domino machine against the edge of the shelf for your vertical plunge into the box side.
That way, you're referencing off the same line and the same part of the Domino machine.  Easy peasy.
This works with material around 18mm-3/4".  With 1/2" stock the bottom of Domino machine reference(9mm to center) would put you really close to the one edge.

Not sure if that works as well on the XL as it does on the 500.  I've used the above method to build a bunch of cabinet projects with the DF500.

Basically, the best options would be to size up your material or size down the Domino.  Since you already have the XL on order, getting thicker stock might be the solution.  You can use the 8mm Dominos in 3/4" material - just keep in mind the placement.

Thanks for your response.

The shelves are going to wind up requiring the tenon to be routed perpendicular to the vertical edge.  So you can not reference the front and back of the vertical, because the Joiner tool will be in the wrong orientation.  I put a post up that has a picture of what a cube storage unit looks like.  A picture is worth a thousands words.  Of course there are several ways to build this.  But I wanted to try and build it this way.  So that I would be utilizing the Joiner in a non standard fashion.  Even though I guess since this tool will work in any orientation, there is no standard fashion.  That challenge is part of my project.