Domino Mortise Width

[Mike Goetzke]

I'm working on a project but at the same time experimenting with making and using extra wide tenons made with the Woodpecker's half round router bits.

One thing driving me crazy is I like using the DF700 and DF500 cross stops that have 1.0 mm increments but for some reason all the mortises machined from the 700 or 500 end in 1/2 mm widths. WHY DID THEY DO THIS!

Mike

 

[Packard]

Maybe they thought that using 2 tenons would do the job of one wider one?

 

[bobtskutter]

[huh]
I don't understand the 0.5mm comment, I thought the mortise width was a whole number?

Bob

 

[smorgasbord]

The way the Domino cuts the mortise is to oscillate the bit back and forth. I think on the "normal" setting the bit moves 6.75mm in each direction, for a total 13.5mm. So, the width of the mortise is 13.5mm wider than the diameter of the bit you're using.

I don't know about the two wider settings on the DF500, nor the one wider setting on the DF700.

 

[Mike Goetzke]

The way the Domino cuts the mortise is to oscillate the bit back and forth. I think on the "normal" setting the bit moves 6.75mm in each direction, for a total 13.5mm. So, the width of the mortise is 13.5mm wider than the diameter of the bit you're using.

I don't know about the two wider settings on the DF500, nor the one wider setting on the DF700.

Yes, I found a chart here and they all end in .5mm.

 

[bobtskutter]

http://web.hypersurf.com/~charlie2/DOMINO/DOMINO_TenonsMortiseWidth.html
?

Bob

 

[Crazyraceguy]

IIRC, the medium width is +6mm and the wide width is +10mm

So, 13.5mm, + diameter of cutter, + 6mm, or +10mm

 

[smorgasbord]

IIRC, the medium width is +6mm and the wide width is +10mm

So, 13.5mm, + diameter of cutter, + 6mm, or +10mm

Thanks! What about the DF700's wider setting? Is it 6mm, 10mm or something else?

 

[Crazyraceguy]

I'm not 100% sure, but would say that is it likely +6

 

[Jim_in_PA]

Suggestion...cut your mortises first and then make the loose tenons to fit.

 

[Mini Me]

As Jim said, forget the dimension and make the loose tenons to fit. I don't understand why you are using a router to make the mortice when multiple cuts with a domino will do the same thing.

 

[derekcohen]

I'm working on a project but at the same time experimenting with making and using extra wide tenons made with the Woodpecker's half round router bits.

One thing driving me crazy is I like using the DF700 and DF500 cross stops that have 1.0 mm increments but for some reason all the mortises machined from the 700 or 500 end in 1/2 mm widths. WHY DID THEY DO THIS!

Mike

Hi Mike

I use the DF500 to make wider-than-standard mortises, rather than stick to standard widths. For some years after purchasing the DF500 (to aid in a kitchen build), it lay unused as I found the prescribed mortise widths a limitation. I preferred integrated tenons and would then size the mortise to fit.

Ganging or using multiple dominos is a limitation since it will force one to design according to a standardised width. What I prefer to do is draw my design, and then determine the ideal size for loose M&T joinery.

I make the tenon stock first, thicknessing the stock, cutting to full width, then rounding over the edges on a router table. I have just purchased the WP bits to aid here, but before simply used a roundover bit.

Routing (with the DF500) the mortise comes next, and an exact fit is fairly straight-forward now as I built a jig to mark out the centering spots.



This will create any size mortise for a 6mm, 8mm, and 10mm on the DF500 narrow setting.

The vertical line on the left side positions the left centre plunge mark.



And the right side positioning ...



The most recent use has been for chair legs ...



The centre lines are the marks for the Domino.

.. and chair seats ...



Lots if arm shaping yet to do, but check the wedged through tenons ...





Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[smorgasbord]

Those of us with a DF700 can use the paddles to quickly create wider mortises that are a consistent width. Check out this video:

 

[Mike Goetzke]

Thanks to all - lots of great info. Derek's gauge is interesting but I have 15 - 14mm x 1-5/8” mortises to put in two boards. I was thinking of attaching a thin board to the end of my real board that had 15 - 5mm holes to reference with the trim stop, cut the mortises, and then readjust the trim stop and cut them a second time. This will give me very close to my 1-5/8” with a wide setting and reindex it 11mm different (on my 700).

Also, didn't notice this before but if you use the small mortise adapter on the DF700 the mortises will be 0.5mm wider than with the DF500. Right?

 

[smorgasbord]

I don't understand why you are using a router to make the mortice when multiple cuts with a domino will do the same thing.

If I understand the OP, he's using the router to create wider tenon stock - that's what Woodpecker's metric-sized half round (aka bull nose) bits will do.

What I don't understand is why he cares whether that tenon stock is 0.5mm wider or narrower. Can you explain?

Also, didn't notice this before but if you use the small mortise adapter on the DF700 the mortises will be 0.5mm wider than with the DF500. Right?

Except for the shorter 4mm bit, the Small Mortise Adapter will create an effective bit length for the 5mm and 6mm bits that's the same length as the stock DF700 bits 8mm and up. So, the oscillating action should create the same mortise width. This is easily checked using the 8mm bit from the DF500 in the DF700 with adapter.

But, this makes me think the 4mm mortises are slightly narrower than the other mortises, even when using only the DF500 with no adapters, since those bits are a bit (sorry) shorter. True?

 

[Mike Goetzke]

I don't understand why you are using a router to make the mortice when multiple cuts with a domino will do the same thing.

If I understand the OP, he's using the router to create wider tenon stock - that's what Woodpecker's metric-sized half round (aka bull nose) bits will do.

What I don't understand is why he cares whether that tenon stock is 0.5mm wider or narrower. Can you explain?

Also, didn't notice this before but if you use the small mortise adapter on the DF700 the mortises will be 0.5mm wider than with the DF500. Right?

Except for the shorter 4mm bit, the Small Mortise Adapter will create an effective bit length for the 5mm and 6mm bits that's the same length as the stock DF700 bits 8mm and up. So, the oscillating action should create the same mortise width. This is easily checked using the 8mm bit from the DF500 in the DF700 with adapter.

But, this makes me think the 4mm mortises are slightly narrower than the other mortises, even when using only the DF500 with no adapters, since those bits are a bit (sorry) shorter. True?

I mentioned I'm using the WP bits.

Since I would like to use the cross stops they have 1mm increments. Not a huge deal - I was just curious why would they use a 0.5mm figure in the mortise width for the DF700 and even 1mm units on the DF500.

 

[luvmytoolz]

I don't understand why you are using a router to make the mortice when multiple cuts with a domino will do the same thing.

If I understand the OP, he's using the router to create wider tenon stock - that's what Woodpecker's metric-sized half round (aka bull nose) bits will do.

What I don't understand is why he cares whether that tenon stock is 0.5mm wider or narrower. Can you explain?

Also, didn't notice this before but if you use the small mortise adapter on the DF700 the mortises will be 0.5mm wider than with the DF500. Right?

But, this makes me think the 4mm mortises are slightly narrower than the other mortises, even when using only the DF500 with no adapters, since those bits are a bit (sorry) shorter. True?

True, 4mm gives 16.5mm compared to the next closest 5mm at 19mm.

 

[smorgasbord]

Since I would like to use the cross stops they have 1mm increments. Not a huge deal - I was just curious why would they use a 0.5mm figure in the mortise width for the DF700 and even 1mm units on the DF500.

Wait - are you saying for the 8mm dominos, the tight mortise width the DF500 produces is not the same as the tight mortise width the DF700 produces?

 

[luvmytoolz]

Since I would like to use the cross stops they have 1mm increments. Not a huge deal - I was just curious why would they use a 0.5mm figure in the mortise width for the DF700 and even 1mm units on the DF500.

Wait - are you saying for the 8mm dominos, the tight mortise width the DF500 produces is not the same as the tight mortise width the DF700 produces?

This is what mine measured.
[attachimg=1]

 

[smorgasbord]

This is what mine measured.

Thanks for that - super interesting!

So, the DF700 mortise widths are 0.5mm narrower - which means a bit harder to remove the dominos when trial fitting, etc.

And the DF700's Wide setting isn't that wide at all - less than the middle setting on the DF500. I wonder if this is intentional since the DF700 is a later developed tool? That is, they decided the looser mortises didn't need to be that loose?