Dust Deputy vs CT Cyclone performance tests?
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Quote from: tallgrass on October 02, 2018, 12:57 PM
I really would be surprised is there is any real world difference in the "efficiency" in these separators.
I really would be surprised if there wouldn't be any real world differences in "efficiency".
Here some background information on the reasoning behind my expectation.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 03:13 AM by Gregor »
That is very interesting. Fairly straight forward boiler plate information. Very informative if one is looking into these and trying to understand how they work.
However what is over looked in your source material is that these are not real integrated systems. What we are discussing here is not an integrated system that is engineered to meet certain specifications. What were are looking on is a an augmentation to an existing vacuum, or dust extraction system. These systems are not going to be used in an optimized environment. As such they are a general solution. The one advantage that Festool has is that their system is designed to operate with a given set of dust extractors. This will allow the appropriate design that matches their machine specs. This is in contrast to the dust deputy that has to work within a range of possible dust extractors. Which they do quite ably.
I am not suggesting that there will not be differences in efficiency, rather that the nature of their utilization will not render these differences meaningfully noticeable. What is more, how is the end user going to appreciate or even notice this? What will the nature of this increase or decrease represent in a mixed bag of saw dust and shop crud? Considering that a truly optimized solution is optimized to deal with a particular environment. None are magnificent across all condition.
I understand the consequences in the industrial environment. Where specifications of performance can be measured and adjusted for. In the portable environment the design is so compromised In favor of size that I truly think there are to many variables in play to really fuss over. For example, simple humidity variations could cause issues depending on what separated. Sanding vs sawing, the mass differential alone their would be an issue, if one was hunting for a "%" of efficiency. .The physics of these separators limits what can be achieved. How would you even translate a 5% variation?I am an engineer, I get going down the rabbit whole of the math and theory. In this case, however I think it is a forest for the trees. We are talking about bring the benefits of a separator to an existing ecosystem of extractors. I would bet the benefits far out way the the compromises. Pick the system that suits you and enjoy.
don't let this stop anyone from trying to quantify the efficiency across all work shop environments and dust extraction media. I would actually find it fascinating. [big grin]
I really would be surprised is there is any real world difference in the "efficiency" in these separators.
I really would be surprised if there wouldn't be any real world differences in "efficiency".
Here some background information on the reasoning behind my expectation.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 03:13 AM by Gregor »
That is very interesting. Fairly straight forward boiler plate information. Very informative if one is looking into these and trying to understand how they work.
However what is over looked in your source material is that these are not real integrated systems. What we are discussing here is not an integrated system that is engineered to meet certain specifications. What were are looking on is a an augmentation to an existing vacuum, or dust extraction system. These systems are not going to be used in an optimized environment. As such they are a general solution. The one advantage that Festool has is that their system is designed to operate with a given set of dust extractors. This will allow the appropriate design that matches their machine specs. This is in contrast to the dust deputy that has to work within a range of possible dust extractors. Which they do quite ably.
I am not suggesting that there will not be differences in efficiency, rather that the nature of their utilization will not render these differences meaningfully noticeable. What is more, how is the end user going to appreciate or even notice this? What will the nature of this increase or decrease represent in a mixed bag of saw dust and shop crud? Considering that a truly optimized solution is optimized to deal with a particular environment. None are magnificent across all condition.
I understand the consequences in the industrial environment. Where specifications of performance can be measured and adjusted for. In the portable environment the design is so compromised In favor of size that I truly think there are to many variables in play to really fuss over. For example, simple humidity variations could cause issues depending on what separated. Sanding vs sawing, the mass differential alone their would be an issue, if one was hunting for a "%" of efficiency. .The physics of these separators limits what can be achieved. How would you even translate a 5% variation?I am an engineer, I get going down the rabbit whole of the math and theory. In this case, however I think it is a forest for the trees. We are talking about bring the benefits of a separator to an existing ecosystem of extractors. I would bet the benefits far out way the the compromises. Pick the system that suits you and enjoy.
don't let this stop anyone from trying to quantify the efficiency across all work shop environments and dust extraction media. I would actually find it fascinating. [big grin]
Kodi Crescent
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[member=2242]tallgrass[/member]
I was going to ask if you were an engineer, then I got to the final paragraph. What engineering field did you study?
I was going to ask if you were an engineer, then I got to the final paragraph. What engineering field did you study?
I’ve had the DD for Festool on my 26 for some time and have been really happy with it. I liked the new cyclone idea a lot and ordered one...received it and IT IS GREAT..one thing that jumps out with me is the compactness of it....no gangly hoses catching on stuff..still observing the difference between them but heck both work great. Been using a midi and a mini in the field and both seem to loose a bit of suction when the bags are @ 8o-85% full so I don’t get to fill them all the way....so....I installed the cyclone on and I think this is going to be the ticket for me on the road.
Sawing,routing &sanding so far are working really nice...haven’t checked the bag but everything seems to be in the bag/clear compartment, and I can plug an extra tool in the yellow three way cord and just dump the bin when full. And save on bags.
Note: there is nothing that holds/clamps the clear Bin in and it moved around a little, but a strip of foam mat (like non slip rug mat) firmed it up perfectly.
Sawing,routing &sanding so far are working really nice...haven’t checked the bag but everything seems to be in the bag/clear compartment, and I can plug an extra tool in the yellow three way cord and just dump the bin when full. And save on bags.
Note: there is nothing that holds/clamps the clear Bin in and it moved around a little, but a strip of foam mat (like non slip rug mat) firmed it up perfectly.
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Michael Kellough
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@Vomdawg. So you simply cut a hole in the back of the Mini hose garage so use the (otherwise too short) supplied hose? Well done and thanks for the review.
Mechanical. It is a sickness. 
I have to remind myself..... " put the pencils down and step away from the bench. " What is worse is that I have my own machine shop. IT is easy to loose sight of improvements in search of incremental gains. The law of diminishing returns should never be forgotten. I actually thing when it comes to the festool separator the square shape may be a benefit. That will require more thought.
I have to remind myself..... " put the pencils down and step away from the bench. " What is worse is that I have my own machine shop. IT is easy to loose sight of improvements in search of incremental gains. The law of diminishing returns should never be forgotten. I actually thing when it comes to the festool separator the square shape may be a benefit. That will require more thought.That's one of the things I hate with that thing: It isn't integrated that well into the systainers as you can't one-hand lift it with a bin mounted (as the bottom will fall off) and handling the bin separate leads to it eating excessive amounts of space in the car.Vondawg said:
The bins also seem to like building static charge (from what I have seen when unpacking one in my shop), leading them to attracting dust and small chips on the outside that contaminate the place you carry it toward.
Pricing... let's better not talk about that. Sufficient to say that I'm happy to not live in a country that allows price fixing.
