Ergonomic or more beneficial Festool workshop layout

[dinkjs]

Its not a what if question.....it is more a workspace reality "what if" question

I am reconsidering my layout of my workspace and how I and my tools work together....I need to be more efficient in how I do things.  So lets put these, what I consider core items or fixtures into the mix.  I really need help on optimum spacing, direction and such.

So here are the core items or fixtures

1. MFT
2. Kapex
3. CT Dust Extractor
4. Systainers/ Sortainers

I would think realitive space is not something to consider since we are looking at effincicy, and comfort.

Let's not include wood storage in this thinking, but you could throw in a router table if you wanted to.

Just some info on me.....34 years old, 6 foot 3 inches

So we are looking for optimum spacing in between key items or fixtures

 

[sancho57]

II set my work space more for work flow and time saving. meaning if I can save a step Im saving time and being more efficient.

 

[Jesse Cloud]

Lots of different good answers to this question.  Depends on how you use the tools, when and how often.

I have a 'stock prep' area where the table saw, jointer, planer, etc live.  The Kapex is on the border between that area and the joinery area.  At the heart of the joinery area is the MFT.  The CT lives next to the MFT and has a WCR on top.  Most of the tools and accessories (wrenchs, bits, rulers, square, pencils, etc) that I use for joinery live on the WCR.  Systainers are in shop-made sysports, easily accessible but also out of the way.

I build furniture.  If I were doing a lot of cabinetry or molding, the answer would probably be way different.

We might have some better ideas if you could give a couple of examples of specific problems you want to solve.

 

[dinkjs]

We are only talking about Festool products here.....nothing else

 

[mouppe]

MFT up against the window with the fence running parallel to the window. Dust extractor to the left side of the MFT with the boom arm hanging over the MFT. MFT 800 with CMS router module stored under MFT. Second MFT 800 stored under workbench until needed for finishing or layout tasks. I prefer the lower height of the MFT 800 for sanding and since I have two I can place them alongside each other lengthways, sideways or in a double-diamond for maximum area coverage.

DIY Sysports against the wall opposite the MFT.

Systainers that don't fit in the sysports randomly stacked elsewhere in the workshop.

 

[ccarrolladams]

Dinkjs,

If you previously told us what it is you will be building and what sort of space you have available, the search feature here at FOG did not show that data to me.

Since 1946 I have worked with wood in spaces ranging from a 5th floor walk-up in Greenwich Village, NYC to single, double and triple car garages, to a 6,000 sq ft cabinet shop I had for 35 years, to my 2nd floor condo, many rental shops and now to my 20,000 sq ft cabinet shop. Currently I own many of the best fixed machines available, and I also own virtually every Festool available in the USA.

None of my large fixed machines can be moved without calling in a team of riggers. My plant has a sophisticated dust collection system, with the stacks and bags outside per local law. In my plant all the work tables are easily moveable, as are several CT22 dust extractors. Two of my Kapex are on rolling stands we built before the UG was available. The Kapex we use on sites for installs does have an UG stand. My other two Kapex are on long fixed benches, on the east wall for the frame/door department and on the west wall for other departments. The fixed Kapex have Tiger Stops. Behind them are standard miter saw dust collection shrouds connected to the plant DC system with 100mm hose. Those Kapex each have an accelerator device, which connects to the Kapex with a 36mm AS hose  and discharges into the DC system with a 100mm hose. This provides the high velocity dust extraction needed by the Kapex.

Our Track Saw cutting table is used for sheet material when miters and bevels are required. I own several TS55 and a lot of rails. All of my cabinet makers has a CT22 available, which they position as needed for effective sanding, routing and using Dominoes.

When I was using spaces such as my condo and the garages, all of my equipment was moveable. I suggest you consider doing something like that. Your Festool CT will do an excellent job collecting dust from your Festools. For your Kapex I encourage you to use a short 36mm AS hose. For OF1400 and OF2200 routers, TS saws and Festool planers, use normal length 36mm AS hose. The smaller routers, the Domino, the jig saws and all sanders only use 27mm hose. With sanders it is vital the CT be close enough you can adjust the suction with using the sander.

How long a space to devote to the Kapex is a function of the length of stock being cut.

The best thing about Festool guide rails and TS saws is the sheet material stays in one place while the saw moves. This save a bunch of space. If you have a long rail, a set of the long Festool screw clamps and a sheet of thin Luan or plywood, you can use the top of a stack of plywood as its own work bench.

I also suggest you plan where you will store raw material and how you will move it into your work space. Also consider how you will move finished projects out of your work space.

Best wishes.

 

[Steve R]

Its not a what if question.....it is more a workspace reality "what if" question

I am reconsidering my layout of my workspace and how I and my tools work together....I need to be more efficient in how I do things.  So lets put these, what I consider core items or fixtures into the mix.  I really need help on optimum spacing, direction and such.

So here are the core items or fixtures

1. MFT
2. Kapex
3. CT Dust Extractor
4. Systainers/ Sortainers

I would think realitive space is not something to consider since we are looking at effincicy, and comfort.

Let's not include wood storage in this thinking, but you could throw in a router table if you wanted to.

Just some info on me.....34 years old, 6 foot 3 inches

So we are looking for optimum spacing in between key items or fixtures

Dinkjs,

There is no answer to this question. You need to determine this for yourself.  Your question is like asking what religion, what political party, What food.... should you choose. Part of the fun of setting up a shop is making it yours by working it out... there are no silver bullets that kill bad shop designs. What works for you might be the worst for me... and vice versus... Don't want to burst you bubble...but it is your shop and your choice.

Cheers,
Steve

 

[Kevin Stricker]

Well you can start by addressing the parts of the Festool system that are not efficient for shop use.  The MFT is a portable workbench, for your shop you want a bench that is both stable and has good storage(IMO).  Under one of my MFT's lives a CT, compressor, a sysport with 6 systainers( most used tools for joinery), and 5 other smaller drawers (holding layout tools, drivers, fasteners, nail/staple guns)all in one cabinet with locking casters with an identical footprint to the MFT. 

Even if you do not choose to make a similar sys-bench you need to make sysports as stacks of systainers are about as inefficient as it gets.

For the Kapex, if it lives in the shop it needs a good home.  6-8' fence on each side with accurate stops so you can set and cut, not measure and mark.  It's bench should hold other necessary shop tools, have cabinets for accessory storage, a CT parking spot( or central DC) and lots of wood storage for long boards( maybe above on the wall) and cutoffs.  A bay for a rolling scrap bin is nice too.

As far as the layout of these fixtures, it depends on your shop and what you are making.  I prefer to have workbenches in the center of my shop so I can work around them.  On walls they tend to become littered with projects and tools.  I think the miter station is most efficient on a wall as it should be 14-18' long ideally.  You say to not include wood storage, but in my mind the wood storage is one of the most important aspects for shop layout.  If you cannot efficiently get and dispose of your wood you will be wasting time every day cleaning up boards that end up lying against a wall or stacked on a workbench.  Having tools that are designed for site use consider your wood storage, sheet good breakdown, and scrap storage first.  Then design your workflow/layout around that.

 

[Tinker]

At 6'3" tall, if you had my shop, you could set up so you stand in the middle and work on everything from one spot in the middle of the floor. [poke] [cool]
Tinker

 

[sancho57]

I built a set of sysports to hold my FS all are on one side of my shop to house my systainers and other tools I have. including my edge baning tools, router bits.etc

My MFTs off center towards the sides of the systports. With in 2-3 steps away from the systsports.

I also added some ply shelving  ( pieces of ply loose using cleats to keep in place) on the cross members of the MFTs to put systainers, jigs etc  and other things.

My CT has a work center on it with clamps, 24" and torpedo levels soft hammer small finishing hammer, essential clamps., folding rule, tape measures  etc.

My Kapex sets on a Kapex MFT inbetween 2 cabs with drawers and a fence on the cabs for indeed/out feed.

Its all about work flow for me, trying to save time and effort

 

[James Watriss]

I think you're going about this the wrong way. If you're really looking to improve shop efficiency, you need to look at the whole shop, whether you 're dealing with production items, or one off custom stuff.

Festool fits into my shop flow in a lot of different ways, so I use them in a fairly central location... But not in permanent workstations. One sys port houses all of my router stuff. Another has sanders. Drill is next to my bench. Track saws and Domino are also in a sys port. I grab what I need when I need it, and bring it to where I'm working.

Like I said, I think you're going about this the wrong way. If you're genuinely interested in boosting productivity, read The Toyota Way. Go through the exercises in shop layout, and work path. Focusing on what is probably the most flexible and adaptable part of the shop is basically working backwards, when the real time and effort savings are to be found elsewhere.

 

[fshanno]

Good luck to you with that.  I've never been able to do it in my 22x22 garage shop.  It's a hodgepodge mess.  It's insane.  It's dominated by a cabinet saw in the middle with a 50" fence.  Dumb, dumb, dumb.  Here's the story.

"Is that one of those Festool saws over in the box?  I've heard of those.  Cool box."

"Yea, it's a TS55.  They call the box a systainer, with a 'y'.  I've got several different lengths of guides for it too. Nothing better for cutting up sheet goods."

"I see.  Then why particularly do you need a 50" fence on your tablesaw?"

"Oh that?  It was a free upgrade when I bought the saw." 

Really?  That's how you make decisions?  You totally screw up your workflow but "It was free!"  Idiot.

Here's what I've got in a 20x22 garage shop.

1. Cabinet saw with a 50" fence.  Idiot.
2. 6" jointer
3. router table
4. planer/oscillating sander on a flip over bench.  20"x30"
5. MFT which is set up all the time because I love it.  (Really?  That's how you design your shop?  "Because you love it.")  Idiot.
6. Kapex on a Ridgid miter stand with 5' wings on both sides.
7. 14" bandsaw
8. full size drill press
9. Kreg Forman pockethole machine on a Rockler rolling stand
10. 24x60 workbench
11. another 24x60 workbench
12. 2hp dust collector on a 24x48 roll around
13. full size Craftsman tool box, mid range, nice ball bearing drawers.
14. large shop fan with a 20 diameter base.
15. full size refrigerator.
16. grinder on a stand
17. fathers old tool box on wheels that was build in the 40's that is 20x48 and I will die before getting rid of it.
18. one wall completely taken up by bicycles - two commuter on the floor and two road on the wall.
19. and for the grand finally, are you ready?  A 4'x8' cutting/assembly table.

Want to help me plan my shop layout?  I thought not.

Here's a clue.  Make clocks, napkin holders, nice little things.  They've got plenty of furniture, made lovingly by little Chinese fingers, down at Ashley's.  BUT DON'T BUY ANYTHING ELSE, WHATEVER YOU DO!