Experiences with the Surfix Oils

[Stone Message]

Hello everyone,

I am (finally) trying to make my mind up about the Surfix system. I need to know how good the oils are (I already have seen how handy it is to have the Surfix oil dispenser with its foam pads).

I have a potential job that will entail an oak kitchen table and possibly an oak kitchen work surface. The finished job has to be able to withstand a wet bottomed red wine bottle being left overnight (say 7 hours) and there is to be no trace when the bottle is removed and the surface wiped with a damp cloth. So we are really concentrating on the Heavy Indoor oil product which Festool recommend for such applications.

Please let me know your experiences rather than just hunches - if I get this job wrong I could lose other work.

Peter

 

[ezdrive]

Stone;

I just looked at this system for the first time at Woodcraft on June 16, 2012.  I have the same curiosity as you, but no experience with the oils used by Festool.  I am not sure if you did a Google search, but here is a recent review that may help you (us) make a decision to try the product.

http://topcoatreview.com/2012/06/surfix/

Sincerely,

Ray

 

[Stone Message]

Thanks Ray. I had found that review by Topcoat but it really only tells you what Festool tell you in their various flyers and pdf files. Topcoat did not do any tests and I have to be sure that whatever oil I use is able to protect an oak surface from a red wine stain. I need to hear from someone who has tested this or who can point me in the direction of some test results.

Kitchen work tops take a lot of abuse and one of the most common causes of customer complaints is from spills of ketchup, wine and similar substances. I really have to find the right product and I need to be sure that Festool have got this right.

Peter

 

[Scott B.]

Thanks Ray. I had found that review by Topcoat but it really only tells you what Festool tell you in their various flyers and pdf files. Topcoat did not do any tests and I have to be sure that whatever oil I use is able to protect an oak surface from a red wine stain. I need to hear from someone who has tested this or who can point me in the direction of some test results.

Kitchen work tops take a lot of abuse and one of the most common causes of customer complaints is from spills of ketchup, wine and similar substances. I really have to find the right product and I need to be sure that Festool have got this right.

Peter

Peter

I would be happy to spill some red wine (or other) on our video demo piece. It is hemlock and walnut. Let me know if it would help for you to see that.

 

[Guy Ashley]

Peter

I have used this on an oak kitchen worktop (3 coats)and both the client and his wife drank like a fish and no complaints after two years.

http://www.osmouk.com/previewpage.cfm?bookid=book001&chapter=57&page=124

Perhaps a phone call to their technical department would get some reassurance. If it has got to be bomb proof like a pub bar top, then it's a two part lacquer.

 

[Kev]

I don't know of any oil finish that would withstand the penetration of red wine if left for 7 hours. I'll be very interested in any oil finish that has resilience to this level!

Kev.

 

[Scott B.]

This thread got me to thinking (never a good thing)...torture test in the works, with vid.  [scared]

 

[Stone Message]

Dear Peter, Guy and Kev

Knowing that Surfix has been on an oak surface for 2 years with no complaints is very encouraging. I read the Festool guide (a pdf file on their UK web site) and they say that 2 coats is the norm but a third can be applied; I would use 3 to be on the safe side. I think that I will take the plunge - I said on a previous FOG entry that I cannot justify the Surfix kit without a job that has Surfix written on it. That job has come up and so I am going to give it a go.

Incidentally, I did test the Osmo Top Oil in my video and that managed to survive the red wine and ketchup 7 hour test with no problem at all. Although I could use Osmo on my next project I also want to get a review of the Surfix System onto my channel. I will keep my fingers crossed that I can get an article published about both Osmo and Surfix which will put food on the table.

Thanks everyone. By all means try a red wine test but Osmo passed the 7 hour test and that is the bench mark for Surfix to beat!

Peter

 

[Kev]

Hi Peter,

Your Osmo review got me reading about it. They seem to be very specialised in stain resisting - I'd be very impressed it Surfix had similar resistance ... but I wouldn't bet with my money  [big grin]

How many different red wines have you tested?  [wink]

cheers,

Kev.

 

[Stone Message]

Hi Peter,

Your Osmo review got me reading about it. They seem to be very specialised in stain resisting - I'd be very impressed it Surfix had similar resistance ... but I wouldn't bet with my money  [big grin]

How many different red wines have you tested?  [wink]

cheers,

Kev.

Hi Kev

I try not to keep count but I do have a glass every evening - my doctor told me that it was good for me. Cheers!

Peter

 

[Greg Lock]

Hi
Surfix is very good for a Kitchen worktop, so long as the instructions are followed. Allow time for repeat coats. The oil has an additive which seals the timber after the oil has been applied or so i have been told. This works by two diffrent evaporation times for the materials. Also on the basic instructions !!!that it is fine for food surfaces.
  The other area i like is that it does not yellow the timber, it keeps the natural hue of the timber.

G.L

 

[Timtool]

Here is my review of it on my site after using it a year.

I personally don't have any furniture at home with it, though i made a 3-digit amount of workbenches with it. So i can't tell how it holds up personally.
On my MFTB toolbox i put somewhere around 4-5 coats of heavy duty oil, and a week or two ago on an install job where it was raining intermittently and someone also put his coffee mug on it, you could see the liquid making dark stains on it as if it went through, but when dry all stains were gone and the grain was not lifted.
It's not water repellent like poly.

 

[meatman]

Hi Peter
Long time no speak.
I have extensive experience of using Osmo and Surfix.
I started using Osmo Polix oil about 6 years on Oak flooring, as yet I have not had to go back and reseal any of those floors. That is using a two coat system. I have also used Osmo on Oak worktops and table tops, if you apply the coats very thinly and wipe dry with a clean rag after about 15-20 mins the finish you are left with is far more superior. Another little tip when second coat of oil is dry hit with 320 grit very light sand then add liquid wax and buff, the finish is first class. As good if not better than any finishing oil I have used before.

As you know I have fallen hook line and sinker for the festoys so when Surfix came out I had to have it.
I have all 3 types I have used the heavy duty oil the most. I have bought the green & white vlois and may I say I have used them in my opinion I think Surfix is a waste of money and time.

My reasons, the finish, is not any better than the Osmo using only two coats
The rigmarole of finishing to 240 grit applying the oil and then weighting the 15mins to use the green vlois, then drying with a cloth. Second coat sand to 320grit apply oil weight 15 mins then use white vlois and dry again the finished effect is great but no better than Osmo paint on and wipe off
The pads in the boxes get clogged up and the do dry out so when you come to use it next time you have to change the pad more expense.
Not as cost effective as Osmo
Not very good at covering any thing that's not flat.

The positives about Surfix. You can put oil on quickly and cleanly
The finish is good but no better than the Osmo

I now pour Osmo into the Surfix container and continue that way the best of both.
If you want any more info on oiling wood pm me and I will give you a call

Meatman

 

[Scott B.]

Here is my review of it on my site after using it a year.

I personally don't have any furniture at home with it, though i made a 3-digit amount of workbenches with it. So i can't tell how it holds up personally.
On my MFTB toolbox i put somewhere around 4-5 coats of heavy duty oil, and a week or two ago on an install job where it was raining intermittently and someone also put his coffee mug on it, you could see the liquid making dark stains on it as if it went through, but when dry all stains were gone and the grain was not lifted.
It's not water repellent like poly.

Tim

I have been running today what I would describe as a passive torture test on our surfix video test slab. I am finding a similar phenomenon to what you described, which is causing me to let the piece mellow out over night and look at it tomorrow before drawing a conclusion.

I put 6 different liquids on the piece and let them sit. For context, one of them was sodium hydroxide, which is one of the most caustic and agitative wood strippers we use. I'll be putting together the results tomorrow.

 

[fritter63]

It sounds like suffix is the similar to what we have here in the U.S. called "watch danish oil"? It also claims to solidify just under the surface, however my experience has been that it eventually gets very dry and not a good long term finish unless you keep re-oiling.

Do you (in Europe) not have polyurethane, varnish, or laquer?

 

[Kev]

It sounds like suffix is the similar to what we have here in the U.S. called "watch danish oil"? It also claims to solidify just under the surface, however my experience has been that it eventually gets very dry and not a good long term finish unless you keep re-oiling.

Do you (in Europe) not have polyurethane, varnish, or laquer?

You mean that stuff like paint - but you can see through it ?  [tongue]

 

[Stone Message]

Hi Peter
Long time no speak.
I have extensive experience of using Osmo and Surfix.
I started using Osmo Polix oil about 6 years on Oak flooring, as yet I have not had to go back and reseal any of those floors. That is using a two coat system. I have also used Osmo on Oak worktops and table tops, if you apply the coats very thinly and wipe dry with a clean rag after about 15-20 mins the finish you are left with is far more superior. Another little tip when second coat of oil is dry hit with 320 grit very light sand then add liquid wax and buff, the finish is first class. As good if not better than any finishing oil I have used before.

As you know I have fallen hook line and sinker for the festoys so when Surfix came out I had to have it.
I have all 3 types I have used the heavy duty oil the most. I have bought the green & white vlois and may I say I have used them in my opinion I think Surfix is a waste of money and time.

My reasons, the finish, is not any better than the Osmo using only two coats
The rigmarole of finishing to 240 grit applying the oil and then weighting the 15mins to use the green vlois, then drying with a cloth. Second coat sand to 320grit apply oil weight 15 mins then use white vlois and dry again the finished effect is great but no better than Osmo paint on and wipe off
The pads in the boxes get clogged up and the do dry out so when you come to use it next time you have to change the pad more expense.
Not as cost effective as Osmo
Not very good at covering any thing that's not flat.

The positives about Surfix. You can put oil on quickly and cleanly
The finish is good but no better than the Osmo

I now pour Osmo into the Surfix container and continue that way the best of both.
If you want any more info on oiling wood pm me and I will give you a call

Meatman

Hi Meatman

Knowing how committed you are to Festool and knowing what a great craftsman that you are I think that your comments are very significant. Thanks for that insight.

I think that we all need to see some pictures and get the written comments of everyone who has done any tests of Surfix. If I do a review of something and say it is great only to find that it is not then I will be letting a lot of people down. I have tested some Osmo oils and my review is available for everyone to see and I stand by what I have said.

Keep the work going on this - we must reach a satisfactory conclusion.

Peter

 

[danjames]

Hi guys.
Can you tell me where I can get the osmo oil in England.

Thanks Dan.

 

[Guy Ashley]

Hi Dan

This is my supplier

http://www.marchesironmongery.co.uk/

 

[Stone Message]

Hi Everyone

I had bitten the bullet and now my Surfix kit has arrived. I have unpacked it, started the filming of my video review and hope to have something to tell you by the weekend. If it takes any longer than that then I will have to have a pause as I have to take a break for my daughter's wedding.

The kit looks better than I remembered from the demo that I saw. The Festool instructions are really not that good and, for a product like this, need to be improved. I get more information from the writing on the outside of a can of paint. This is, of course, my standard gripe about Festool - anyone would think that I was trying to get a job as a technical writer! [no - I will leave this to the experts like Rick Christopherson].

Many thanks to everyone who has contributed to this thread and to Meatman whom I was talking to when the delivery man came down the drive.

Peter