Festool Pro 5 LTD - Sander
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CrpntrFreak
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I came here to post that exact link. It even comes with the voucher. I hope this will tone down the blood suckers trying to sell the Pro5 for way more.ben_r_ said:
CrpntrFreak said:
I think bloodsucker is little bit much dude. I bought the Pro5 the first day and waited months for the thing to show. I think its a great sander and I wouldn't sell mine. Way after the promotion ended I found one at a local shop and snagged it. Systainers are expensive to ship and as a seller if anything goes wrong with the transaction it comes back to me. So a small markup considering shipping costs is not unreasonable. Either way if you don't want it, don't buy it.
Holmz said:
Yes, a few were reported to have jumpy syndrome. Seems to have been remedied in later production models.
I'm not sure what you consider a "deal" , but FT never is discounted here - so 60-80% off of new (pending how you value the voucher)is probably considered a deal by most. Even if they have to wait 2-4 months to realize the savings.
$50 for a sander is about as cheap as it gets over here. For one that works well from a top tier supplier, has good dust collection and comes in a usable carry box valued at around $80 itself - is pretty good value any way you slice it if you ask me.
So it's not an EC ? Nor is it a rotex. And didn't cost $400-$600 like those sanders either. It's not a $30 made in China Harbir Freight either. Saying it's not something else is pointless.
I like the EC too and the Rotex , but if I just need a quick sand and don't want to use the vac, then EC really isn't the ticket. If I am lightly sanding panels all day then rotex will do the job, but it wears out my arms. And in those cases I much prefer the $50 sander especially after I think about the costs.
Holmz
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[member=727]antss[/member]
If I may opine...
Is it any better than a harbour freight or other sander?
Yeah it says Festool but what does that mean?
Does it mean that one would perceive that they are getting a top shelf sander?
Or is it pretty much the same as any other sander with a Festool label?
Basically I was leaning forward looking at getting one (for a gift), and then thought, "why... Would 'I' use it, and for what?" ... So for me it made no real sense, as if one wanted one sander then the ETS/EC or DEROS are pretty ideal.
For $100 it still gets the wood smooth, so one can argue that it is a truely great value. But is it any better than a Bosch, Ryobi, etc? It would be nice to have a comparison in the price range with power, dust collection, vibration, ergonomics. Without a way to compare is difficult to do anything other than opine on the sander. And since I do not have one, I has even less fact to present on the subject other than opinion.
It is also unclear as to what the goal of the promotion was, and hence it is hard to gauge whether the promotion can be deemed as being a success.
I suppose that if people like [member=65145]manuc[/member] like it and get drawn to an ETS/EC (and other tools) then it is a success for Festool.
If I may opine...
Is it any better than a harbour freight or other sander?
Yeah it says Festool but what does that mean?
Does it mean that one would perceive that they are getting a top shelf sander?
Or is it pretty much the same as any other sander with a Festool label?
Basically I was leaning forward looking at getting one (for a gift), and then thought, "why... Would 'I' use it, and for what?" ... So for me it made no real sense, as if one wanted one sander then the ETS/EC or DEROS are pretty ideal.
For $100 it still gets the wood smooth, so one can argue that it is a truely great value. But is it any better than a Bosch, Ryobi, etc? It would be nice to have a comparison in the price range with power, dust collection, vibration, ergonomics. Without a way to compare is difficult to do anything other than opine on the sander. And since I do not have one, I has even less fact to present on the subject other than opinion.
It is also unclear as to what the goal of the promotion was, and hence it is hard to gauge whether the promotion can be deemed as being a success.
I suppose that if people like [member=65145]manuc[/member] like it and get drawn to an ETS/EC (and other tools) then it is a success for Festool.
It seems you're really chuffed with your EC. And I'll agree it's a better all around sander than the p5.
But at a cost. It's heavier, and can't/shouldn't be used without a vacuum.
So the p5 is more suited for a quick sand of say sheetrock compound with a bag or use overhead. Something the EC are not well suited to. But if it's all you have then it'll do the job.
I've got two Bosch models - a medium sized 5" with a handle I got to do some gates and a palm sander made by B&D. Also have used porter cable's 333 for decades and still have two of them. Workhorses, but they'll numb your hand. The p5 is better than all in terms of vibration. But I wouldn't want to use it to clean those gates. The Bosch has more power and larger orbit making it more suited to the job.
The p5 cost less than all of them. Factor in inflation and the others start looking $$ when compared. I view sanders like routers, one is never enough. And different types/brands are better suited to given tasks. An OF2200 might be great for making exterior door frames but stinks for inlay work. A little dewalt 612 is great for that , but isn't going to raise a door panel for you. Same with sanders.
For $50-100 the p5 is a really nice sander. Wouldn't want it to be my only one though. And at $260 , the reg. price, I'd feel entirely different about it. Because while it's nice , it's NOWHERE near 3x as good as other offerings. It's a great value at $50-$100 but it's not the holy grail.
But at a cost. It's heavier, and can't/shouldn't be used without a vacuum.
So the p5 is more suited for a quick sand of say sheetrock compound with a bag or use overhead. Something the EC are not well suited to. But if it's all you have then it'll do the job.
I've got two Bosch models - a medium sized 5" with a handle I got to do some gates and a palm sander made by B&D. Also have used porter cable's 333 for decades and still have two of them. Workhorses, but they'll numb your hand. The p5 is better than all in terms of vibration. But I wouldn't want to use it to clean those gates. The Bosch has more power and larger orbit making it more suited to the job.
The p5 cost less than all of them. Factor in inflation and the others start looking $$ when compared. I view sanders like routers, one is never enough. And different types/brands are better suited to given tasks. An OF2200 might be great for making exterior door frames but stinks for inlay work. A little dewalt 612 is great for that , but isn't going to raise a door panel for you. Same with sanders.
For $50-100 the p5 is a really nice sander. Wouldn't want it to be my only one though. And at $260 , the reg. price, I'd feel entirely different about it. Because while it's nice , it's NOWHERE near 3x as good as other offerings. It's a great value at $50-$100 but it's not the holy grail.
Holmz said:
I had a Bosch sander and it was pain in the rear with dust everywhere even with the little provided bag or with a hose hooked up. As I mentioned, while I was sold on Festool already I had no intention of getting a sander. The Pro5 didn't impress me at first and the abrasives wore out quickly hooked up to my shop vac. After I got the CT Mini is when it shone. I've never had a sander with this good dust collection and the abrasives are not wearing out much at all. This is infinitely better than my equivalent Bosch. Factoring in the CT it's not cheap, but the results are definitely infinitely better. I understand the comments on the EC which I have no idea about having never used one, but for someone who hasn't tried festool sanders before, the difference is immediately visible on the Pro5.
Strange. I have Bosch ROS20VSC and its practically dustless with vacuum hooked up. Don't really get all the hype about Festool dust collection. That was a big deal 20 years ago, but most modern sanders have comparable efficiency. They are not as smooth or quiet though.woodvkk said:
Holmz
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woodvkk said:
Ok this is interesting.
Have you tried the Bosch with the FT vacuum yet?
Some comparison of removal using the same media and wood would also provide a quantifiable comparison.
(Regarding later post)
I have the DEROS on the end of a CT26. It us brilliant for wood and drywall. Usually best with their smaller more flexible hose. The ETS/EC is very similar.
Obviously (IMO) one may prefer a more agressive 5-mm stroke ETS/EC if they have Pro5 for finishing... It at least differentiates the two machines.
Cheese
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Hey [member=40772]Holmz[/member] & [member=727]antss[/member]
A Pro 5 is nothing more than an updated ETS 125 with a new switch, new exhaust port and an extra 50 watts of power.
So...just to throw a little more petrol on the fire, I ran across this review. They rated the ETS 125 as "Best Overall", however
the Makita BO5041 was rated as "Best Value".
https://www.canadianwoodworking.com/tools/5-random-orbital-sanders
Here, the ETS 125 is rated second.
http://www.toolsofthetrade.net/power-tools/corded-tools/tool-test-5-inch-random-orbit-sanders_o?o=2
A Pro 5 is nothing more than an updated ETS 125 with a new switch, new exhaust port and an extra 50 watts of power.
So...just to throw a little more petrol on the fire, I ran across this review. They rated the ETS 125 as "Best Overall", however
the Makita BO5041 was rated as "Best Value".
https://www.canadianwoodworking.com/tools/5-random-orbital-sanders
Here, the ETS 125 is rated second.
http://www.toolsofthetrade.net/power-tools/corded-tools/tool-test-5-inch-random-orbit-sanders_o?o=2
Holmz
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[member=44099]Cheese[/member] so there is a Canadian review - but it seems lacking in a few ways:
1) there is not ETS/EC, so the ETS being "the best" is at total odds with the majority of users here.
- also no DEROS, which would not likely win best value.
- also a few other gems missing
2) I did not see specs or measurements for vibration or noise, or effective removal rates.
It is not exactly dispassionate like comparing Nurburgring lap times.
So it is a bit of an "alternative truth", and while not a lie, it is somewhat an omission of truth.
Good use of "petrol", I was looking for the Ohio blue tips, but here we have only Redhead brand matches.
1) there is not ETS/EC, so the ETS being "the best" is at total odds with the majority of users here.
- also no DEROS, which would not likely win best value.
- also a few other gems missing
2) I did not see specs or measurements for vibration or noise, or effective removal rates.
It is not exactly dispassionate like comparing Nurburgring lap times.
So it is a bit of an "alternative truth", and while not a lie, it is somewhat an omission of truth.
Good use of "petrol", I was looking for the Ohio blue tips, but here we have only Redhead brand matches.
Cheese
Member
Holmz said:Good use of "petrol", I was looking for the Ohio blue tips, but here we have only Redhead brand matches.
Just decided to find some reviews of 5" sanders and found the internet pretty empty in that arena, specifically when it came to the ETS 125 which is the basis of our discussion. Lots & lots of reviews on the standard $50-$100 torch bearers, but it's pretty thin on ETS...EC...and Deros.
leakyroof
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Have to disagree. I own both sanders and they are very different. I love the Pro 5 for between coats sanding, and the EC 125/3 will actually strip finishes for me if they're not too tough of a coating or finish that needs something more aggressive than the EC.ben_r_ said:Pick up the ETS EC 125/3 and sell the Pro 5woodvkk said:
With a 2mm orbit, the Pro 5 is gentle and predictable, you'd have to be more careful with an EC sander doing the same task if you're worried about over-sanding.
nickao
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Cheese said:
I agree with the poster the Pro 5 is an ETS with 50 more watts, it's still a dog of a sander with issues though, I have two. The one review at its core is the most biased, stupid, misinformed review ever.
Who compares a 209.00 sander to a 89.00 or 109.00 sander?
The ETS is actually the WORST sander in its price range and had they done a proper review and moved to the next level sander for each manufacturer listed that has upper models they would have found the Festool was at the BOTTOM of the list.
Look at the pricing of the sanders in this review, if the ETS didn't come in as best there would be a large problem. Seek out the DeWalt, Bosch and Makita sanders that cost closer to 209.00 list price Canadian of the Festool ETS 125 and then compare. The ETS will be shown to be a poor sander.
The ETS is okay for in-between coat sanding at best, unless you get one that hops around. My Pro 5's sit on a shelf, My ETS 125's sold off.
If someone is looking for a 179.00(US) to 229.00(US) priced 5" sander, IMHO look at something other than Festool.
- I agree with DT, at full price the Pro5/ETS is not a good value especially when compared with lower cost alternatives. - but- I'm pretty sure those manuf. mentioned, don't have a better more expensive 5" sander. Festool/Mirka are kinda the top of the heap there. Rupes is hard to find in the USA.
- which brings me to most of the reviews- The mass media tests are not always well structured but at least they are a staring point for consideration. One off blogger reviews are usually hampered by the publisher not having extensive time with the tool, especially long term as well as not having a stable of comparable products.
These things are often limited to first looks and pro/con opinions mostly based on gut feelings. There are some good in depth analyses though. That CW review is a lot of info in one place but it's pretty much ALL opinion. Mr. Brown may find a sander "comfortable" - but will I ? Will you ?
But it's comparing a 5" finish sander to a rotex that I find more silly than a $109 vs. $250 sander comparison. That said, it could be argued that $39 no name sander has no business against a $109 sander either. But in these case I think it's plausible. The end purchaser might not be the same but I find especially useful to know how a $50 sander performs against on costing $100 vs. on that's $200.
The last test I saw that really made a real attempt at something quantifiable was a FWW one ten? years ago. They used exactly the same sandpaper, and boards and then weighed material removed and then looked at the scratch patterns made by each unit. Their conclusion was the Bosch was the best overall. Go figure. the ES125 had 100% by weight dust collection with a vac , but so did the makita and a klingspor model which is a clone of the bosch ! So that should tell you just how reliable even a well reasoned test can be. NOT VERY ! Little was made of ergonomics or vibration. And I disagreed with the tester's assessment of vibration entirely having owned used 5 of the 9 tested.
125 was under powered then too. Only the craftsman removed less material. 125 cost double the median sander price in the test too.
- if Pro5's price range is $50-100 then it's not a dog. @ $260 - it's a wet dog, like all its predecessors.
- which brings me to most of the reviews- The mass media tests are not always well structured but at least they are a staring point for consideration. One off blogger reviews are usually hampered by the publisher not having extensive time with the tool, especially long term as well as not having a stable of comparable products.
These things are often limited to first looks and pro/con opinions mostly based on gut feelings. There are some good in depth analyses though. That CW review is a lot of info in one place but it's pretty much ALL opinion. Mr. Brown may find a sander "comfortable" - but will I ? Will you ?
But it's comparing a 5" finish sander to a rotex that I find more silly than a $109 vs. $250 sander comparison. That said, it could be argued that $39 no name sander has no business against a $109 sander either. But in these case I think it's plausible. The end purchaser might not be the same but I find especially useful to know how a $50 sander performs against on costing $100 vs. on that's $200.
The last test I saw that really made a real attempt at something quantifiable was a FWW one ten? years ago. They used exactly the same sandpaper, and boards and then weighed material removed and then looked at the scratch patterns made by each unit. Their conclusion was the Bosch was the best overall. Go figure. the ES125 had 100% by weight dust collection with a vac , but so did the makita and a klingspor model which is a clone of the bosch ! So that should tell you just how reliable even a well reasoned test can be. NOT VERY ! Little was made of ergonomics or vibration. And I disagreed with the tester's assessment of vibration entirely having owned used 5 of the 9 tested.
125 was under powered then too. Only the craftsman removed less material. 125 cost double the median sander price in the test too.
- if Pro5's price range is $50-100 then it's not a dog. @ $260 - it's a wet dog, like all its predecessors.
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