First project with my new Domino 500

I glue everything that is not to be disassembled later.  I especially glue MDF.  MDF doesn't have the strength to hold screws as well as Plywood.

Also, gluing up MDF at butt joints can help with the finishing.  While the glue is drying, sprinkle MDF dust onto the glue and push it in with a puddy knife in those holes that seam to appear out of nowhere.  Usually, I don't have to go back and fill in the holes after sanding.  This also works great for covering up screw holes and painting it with latex paint.  Basically, your making your own wood puddy out of MDF Dust.  You should have plenty of MDF dust in the Vac.
 
Thanks for the tip about using liquid hide glue jacko9, I plan to stop off and pick up a bottle.  Is Titebond Liquid Hide Glue good?  Reading their specs they show "open assembly time" of 10 minutes and "total assembly time" of 20-30 minutes.  Anyone know what's the difference between these terms?  I was planning to start in the middle and work my way out during the glue up.

Since I was new to the Domino tool at the beginning of this project I started off on the joints where one board joined to another at the ends.  The mistake I made at first was putting the inside face up when making the domino holes on the end, but I figured that out pretty quickly and the piece I had done could simply be flipped.  I was concerned that there might be tiny variations in the width of the boards, so I made a standard of drilling the Domino holes using the tight setting when drilling in the end of a board, but set it to the medium wide setting when drilling into the face of a board - so every joint has just a little adjustability.  At first I wasn't sure how I was going to accurately make the holes where a board intersected the middle of another piece, then I figured the following method:  I'd mark the edge of where the perpendicular board should fall on the other board.  I'd then lay the perpendicular board on top of the first board with the edge lined up with my mark.  I'd also be careful to line up the line edges precisely together, I'd then clamp both to my MFT.  Since the distance from the bottom of the Domino to the middle of the cutter is 10mm which was close to the halfway line through the MDF I'd lie the base of the Domino on top of the bottom board and make the holes in the perpendicular board using the guide paddles.  I'd then set the Domino perpendicular to the bottom board and press the bottom flat against the top board and drill the slightly wider slots in the bottom board.  Hit my marks precisely every time, in fact I now think those joints are even easier than the ones where the boards join at the ends, but only if you KNOW the ends are cut perfectly square.  If this was hard to visualize I can shoot some pictures if anyone would find it helpful.
 
I don't have any Titebond Liquid Hide glue around, but I do have a bottle of Titebond III which claims to have the same open/working time.  Would that be a good substitute for this big assembly job or should I go find the Liquid Hide glue?
 
sprior said:
I don't have any Titebond Liquid Hide glue around, but I do have a bottle of Titebond III which claims to have the same open/working time.  Would that be a good substitute for this big assembly job or should I go find the Liquid Hide glue?
Click to expand...

Nice project btw, looks sweet!

 
sprior said:
I don't have any Titebond Liquid Hide glue around, but I do have a bottle of Titebond III which claims to have the same open/working time.  Would that be a good substitute for this big assembly job or should I go find the Liquid Hide glue?
Click to expand...

I like the Titebond Liquid Hide glue and I think it has more leeway than other glues for complicated assemblies.  The difference between open time and working time relates to the glue skiming over in air but once you start your assembly the glue stays "fluid" longer to allow for getting everything square. Titebond also sells Titebond II extended open time glue but, I have had good results with complicated assemblies with Titebond Liquid Hide glue.

The alternative is to glue up your project in stages.  I would advise that you do a dry assembly with clamps and cauls before using glue on your project, surprises do occur and it's nice to be able to correct it before you have to beat apart a glue joint.

Jack

 
I'm doing the glue up now.  I'm not in a rush so I'm gluing one joint at a time using regular Titebond II and a pair of Woodpecker clamps which should keep me perfectly perpendicular.  I'm doing one joint an hour to allow time for the glue to set in the MDF.  The plan has been to start in the middle and move my way out.  I sanded the faces of the MDF before assembly so it's paintable smooth - I'll just have to go back and clean up any glue and also get the outside corners perfectly smooth.
 
Great first project  like the look of those clamps

If you domino the wrong side of the board just glue in some domino's and cut them flush when dry and recut from the right side .. not that I have ever needed to do that [wink]
 
While I was cutting the domino holes I also did a dry fit.  Before I took apart the dry fit I put pieces of painters tape on the top edge of each piece and drew arrows all facing the same direction.  I'm keeping all the pieces standing in their dry fit positions while they're waiting to be glued.  I'm hoping all of this will keep me from swapping any pieces or flipping them around.  There are slight variations in the widths of the pieces so I'm keeping the bottom side of the joints all flush which will be the front of the shelf when it's all put together and it'll be nice and perfect from the front.
 
Thanks for the responses.  I always glue the joints when I use the Domino.  The pocket hole screws are just for creating a tight joint so I don't have to use clamps.

I haven't used Hide glue before and I've been meaning to ask some questions.  I think I've read that is doesn't cause problems with finish, so clean up is much easier.  Is this true for you guys?  Is it as strong as PVA?
 
stahlee said:
Thanks for the responses.  I always glue the joints when I use the Domino.  The pocket hole screws are just for creating a tight joint so I don't have to use clamps.

I haven't used Hide glue before and I've been meaning to ask some questions.  I think I've read that is doesn't cause problems with finish, so clean up is much easier.  Is this true for you guys?  Is it as strong as PVA?
Click to expand...

Hide glue properties can be found on the Titebond web site.  Keep in mind that hide glue has been used for centuries and there are many pieces still intact.  The only weakness of hide glue is its poor performance in moist conditions.

BTW, I don't use hide glue very often unless I'm repairing older furniture.  In some cases it's necessary to take apart a few joints to get the furniture back together and hide glue is easy to work with.

Jack
 
Now the shelf unit is all glued up and mostly sanded.  It's made from MDF and I'm looking to finish it in a satin or semi gloss black.

Any advice on painting it?  I'm wondering if I should use a sanding sealer, then primer then paint, or can I just use primer?  In a perfect world I'd like to not end up with brush marks.  I bought a spray system from Rockler last Fall but I live in the NE US so I'd have to wait months to be able to do this outside and I'd like to get this project wrapped up long before that.  BTW, I HATE painting/finishing stuff so I'm looking for as easy as possible.
 
looking great.
i like that style ,
i would use one of the zinzeer products. i like the coverstain one the best(not sure why, probably yhr smell of the 123 is too bad)
dilut it a bit for the first 2 coats on the mdf 'endgrain' 
then lightly sand it after each full coat . after a few coats the mdf will be completely covered and be perfectly smooth.
then paint with the colour
 
I like the Zinzeer products and the 1 2 3 Undercoat has that refreshing odor that opens your sinus passages [wink]
 
That is much bigger than I thought from the earlier images.  I like the design.

You might try a pad for painting - will give you very good coverage but no brush strokes.  The ones I have used in the past are around 3 x 4 inches in size and work really well.

neil
 
I've never had much luck finishing where my blade has touched the fibers.  Fuzz.  I can sand with 4000 grit and still get fuzz.  The more I sand the more it fuzzes.  I've gotten away from using MDF where an edge that I've milled in any way must be visible.

On simple thing you might try is joint compound on the edges.  I've heard of using shellac or lacquer.  Some have used bondo type products or wood fillers.  Something you can put on it to cover the fibers or something that will make them hard enough to sand.  Experiment on scrap before you hit that nice case.

If I can offer my opinion, which know is in the minority, I wouldn't hesitate to paint with a brush, even for contemporary pieces and even if spraying was a viable option.  I like the look of hand painting with a brush when it's done well. 
 
I've been using shellac (Zinser Sealcoat is a good option) before my final sanding (220 grit) for about a year now and couldn't be more impressed with the results.  Got the recommendation from a fine homebuilding article about french polishing a handrail. 

The shellac flashes off fast, but waiting 24hrs. definitely eliminates some of the film that forms on the paper. Definitely a go to move for fine finishes.
 
Guilliaume, you mention "your finisher".  Is that someone who works for you or another contractor?  I guess you're raising the fantasy that maybe I can get someone to paint this thing for me for not too much money and I can move onto the next project doing something I like - cutting and joining wood.
 
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