First Square for Woodworking?

[Patrick Cox]

I am getting ready to buy my first square for woodworking and I am looking for advice.  When I look at the various options out there, it seems there are many.  Try square, Speed Square, Combination square, Framing Square...I am sure I am missing some.  And I am not sure which would serve me best as a first square and then which size as well.  I have been leaning toward a Woodpecker Try Square but then if I go that direction, I am not sure if I need a 12" square or if a smaller one like 6" or 8" would be a better first square.  And then is Woodpecker worth the price for this item? 

I am mainly cutting with my TS55 as I don't have a table saw.  For smaller cuts I will use my MFT3 table so I guess the main purpose of the square would be ensuring that my table is setup square before I cut.  And I guess also to check cuts and then to ensure assembled pieces are square.  So, any tips on this would be appreciated!  Thanks!

 

[Birdhunter]

I used a Starrett 12" combination square for many years and never really needed anything else. I still have it and it is my most used tool.

I think Starrett is the absolute best. Don't buy a cheap combination square thinking they are all the same. They are not.

 

[blaszcsj]

I would get the woodpecker 12" square if you want to square your MFT and use it for other stuff as an all arounder. You can the get larger or smaller ones as desired. You can also get the Groz engineer square set from woodcraft as it comes with a variety. I use them for setting up my table saw and jointer fences.

 

[Patrick Cox]

I used a Starrett 12" combination square for many years and never really needed anything else. I still have it and it is my most used tool.

I think Starrett is the absolute best. Don't buy a cheap combination square thinking they are all the same. They are not.

Thanks for your reply. I am curious why you chose a combination square. Is the 45 that useful?  Or other reasons?  Thanks.

 

[Patrick Cox]

I would get the woodpecker 12" square if you want to square your MFT and use it for other stuff as an all arounder. You can the get larger or smaller ones as desired. You can also get the Groz engineer square set from woodcraft as it comes with a variety. I use them for setting up my table saw and jointer fences.

Thanks!  So you would say the 12" square is more useful for general purpose than say 6" or 8"?  Just confirming. Thx

 

[ear3]

There are many different, equally viable methods for setting up the MFT.  It's possible just to use dogs and the hole pattern without a square.  For me, since I don't keep my MFT set-up permanently, but set it up as needed then put it away, I wanted a relatively quick way to resquare it.  So I invested in a Woodpeckers 32" precision t-Square:
http://www.amazon.com/Woodpeckers-P...32 t-square&qid=1463800381&ref_=sr_1_1&sr=8-1

I then keep a scrap of plywood the with of the MFT table handy, on which I scribe a line with the T-Square.  Squaring up the rail and fence is as quick and easy as placing the scrap on the MFT then lining up the splinterguard to the pencil line. 

In terms of other squares, the Woodpeckers 1281 is always a good bet, and I would also recommend getting a set of engineers squares for smaller operations, like the set made by Groz:
http://www.amazon.com/Groz-01113-In...TF8&qid=1463800478&sr=8-2-fkmr0&keywords=groz+engineer+square

BTW, I would keep my eyes open on Ebay or another like source for the Woodpeckers 18" or 26" Precision Square.  It's unfortunately a one time tool, so new ones will be hard to come by:
http://www.woodpeck.com/psq2015.html

I actually got both mine by simply posting a WTB on the FOG, so it is possible to get them.  The 26" square is particularly useful when breaking down sheet goods for squaring up the cross-cuts.  A good square is worth its weight in gold.

I am getting ready to buy my first square for woodworking and I am looking for advice.  When I look at the various options out there, it seems there are many.  Try square, Speed Square, Combination square, Framing Square...I am sure I am missing some.  And I am not sure which would serve me best as a first square and then which size as well.  I have been leaning toward a Woodpecker Try Square but then if I go that direction, I am not sure if I need a 12" square or if a smaller one like 6" or 8" would be a better first square.  And then is Woodpecker worth the price for this item? 

I am mainly cutting with my TS55 as I don't have a table saw.  For smaller cuts I will use my MFT3 table so I guess the main purpose of the square would be ensuring that my table is setup square before I cut.  And I guess also to check cuts and then to ensure assembled pieces are square.  So, any tips on this would be appreciated!  Thanks!

 

[blaszcsj]

I would get the woodpecker 12" square if you want to square your MFT and use it for other stuff as an all arounder. You can the get larger or smaller ones as desired. You can also get the Groz engineer square set from woodcraft as it comes with a variety. I use them for setting up my table saw and jointer fences.

Thanks!  So you would say the 12" square is more useful for general purpose than say 6" or 8"?  Just confirming. Thx

If I had to pick one that's the size I would get. It covers most board sizes for layouts, and not too big that its unwieldy.

Edward gave a pretty good description of the other sizes and what they are good for.

 

[waterloomarc]

I'm a hobbiest and just build furniture. I live by my 6" Starrett combination. I've had it for 10 years now and it's still dead square. I find the smaller size more handy for my work. I have 12" combination squares as well but they don't see nearly as much work.

If I were starting out again now buying my first and could only have one I would buy Woodpecker's 1281. While I prefer my smaller 6" square, it obviously can't do the work of a larger square. Whereas a larger square can usually do the work of the smaller. Having a smaller one is just a nice convenience.

Whatever you do, don't cheap out. This is one area where you most often do get what you pay for.

FWIW I have a 9" Sorby try square that is probably my second most used square.

Edit: I lose points for reading comprehension. I missed the part about you wanted this to square up your MFT.

 

[Jesse Cloud]

The basic test for a square is to take a straight board (lay it on a flat surface, put a light behind it, if any gaps, slide it back and forth - if the gap moves, its not straight).  Then place the square on the flat surface and draw a line down with the thinest pencil you have - probably a 0.5mm mechanical pencil.  Then flip the square over, set the line as close as you can to the one you just drew and draw another one.  If you see any variation, send the square back.  Its not square and it will hold you back in your woodworking.

I used to attend a woodworking school, where the school bought squares to resell to into students.  We tested good name brands with this method and sent them back if they didn't pass.  The return rate was about one third, even for very reputable brands.

The price you pay for a square increases dramatically with the length.  Don't go overboard if your cuts are mostly short.

When you find a good square, keep it as a reference square - not for daily use.  Use it to make your own dead-square square.  Be patient, make as many cuts as it takes, then when you hit dead square, make a few copies for day-to-day use.  Keep your original square for setting up machines and other precision tasks.

 

[copcarcollector]

so I guess the main purpose of the square would be ensuring that my table is setup square before I cut.  And I guess also to check cuts and then to ensure assembled pieces are square.  So, any tips on this would be appreciated!

Anderson Plywood (Los Angeles) has an inexpensive square designed for the MFT, which I am sure could be used for other things as well.
http://www.andersonplywood.com/square-for-festool-mft-square/

 

[Cheese]

I agree totally with Birdhunter...purchase a 12" Starrett and go from there. To this day, Starrett is the standard to which all other squares are measured against. While a Woodpeckers square is guaranteed to be square within .001/.002" per foot, the Starrett will typically be within .0005-.001" per foot. I've checked all 4 of mine on a granite plate with a granite block and they are all within .0002-.0005" per foot.

This may seem like overkill, yet when you need to ensure that the tools you use are accurate, the Starrett square will be the tool you go to verify compliance with all of your other squares/measuring tools. I can't stress this enough, you need to have a standard to measure squareness against, and the Starrett combi square is the answer.

Besides that, it has so many other functions that despite it's high price tag, it's actually cheap to own. I usually use 2 of them to set the distance from the splinter strip to the edge of the ply for the TS 55.

 

[McNally Family]

Here is an excellent link to some of what Starrett offers:
http://www.msi-viking.com/assets/im...34 and 435 Series Combination Square Sets.pdf

The specific model I am considering for my son's birthday present is #C434ME-300, which includes 1/2mm and 32nds on one side; mm and 64ths on the reverse side.  That way you have both metric and Imperial together.

 

[Birdhunter]

Patrick,

The Starrett Combination Square gives you multiple functions. The 2 obvious ones are the 90 and 45 degree angles. Another is to measure the depth of a mortise or the height of a saw blade or router bit. Marking locations for a series of screw holes along the edge of a board is another. The ability to slide the ruler in and out of the body gives the Starrett an edge over a fixed square.

I now have a bunch of Woodpecker squares, but if I could only keep one square in my shop, it would be the Starrett.

 

[Patrick Cox]

I'm a hobbiest and just build furniture. I live by my 6" Starrett combination. I've had it for 10 years now and it's still dead square. I find the smaller size more handy for my work. I have 12" combination squares as well but they don't see nearly as much work.

If I were starting out again now buying my first and could only have one I would buy Woodpecker's 1281. While I prefer my smaller 6" square, it obviously can't do the work of a larger square. Whereas a larger square can usually do the work of the smaller. Having a smaller one is just a nice convenience.

Whatever you do, don't cheap out. This is one area where you most often do get what you pay for.

FWIW I have a 9" Sorby try square that is probably my second most used square.

Edit: I lose points for reading comprehension. I missed the part about you wanted this to square up your MFT.

No worries on the MFT.  That is just one use.  I also need the square for general use like checking square of pieces and assemblies...etc.  I appreciate your answer.

 

[bdiemer]

My vote also goes for the starrett. I have many squares. I use 2. The 12 inch Starrett combo and the starrett 4 inch double square

 

[Holmz]

PC a combo square is good, but [member=61142]Patrick Cox[/member] you are over thinking this. The wood bends and has compliance, so it is it like nickel alloys.

 

[ear3]

[member=61142]Patrick Cox[/member] I know this isn't a square, but since repeatable measurements are part of the secret to achieving a square cut, thought I'd mention the Incra flexible rulers, about which I wish someone had told me a lot sooner:
http://www.incra.com/measuring_marking-trules.html

You can also get them in metric!  This will give you the function that people often use a combination square for, which is marking a line off the end of the ruler by sliding it along the edge.

Also, if you ever get a domino, this is the perfect layout device for joining narrow stock for face frames and the like.

Woodpeckers achieves the same thing through their saddle T squares (though without the ability to do 64ths), which again, was unfortunately an OTT (but fairly popular as evidenced by the fact they did a second run of them just recently), but which may be available through Ebay:
http://www.woodpeck.com/sdltsqr.html

 

 

[bertv]

Plus one on the Starrett combination square. Next one: find an art supplies store and buy the largest plastic triangle(s) the have, preferably ones made of lexan (polycarb, I think). Start with a 90/45/45, add a 90/60/30. Some brands have have ones with a metal cutting edge — very handy if you scribe with a knife.

 

[Cheese]

Here is an excellent link to some of what Starrett offers:

[member=61142]Patrick Cox[/member] as noted in this post, the 12", 18", 24", 300mm & 600mm blades are all interchangeable with the same head and are all available separately. They just simply slide into recess in the head and are then locked down.

If you go this route, I'd recommend choosing the satin chrome blade option. They are much easier to read. [smile]
http://www.starrett.com/docs/other-...on-square-insert---form-955.pdf?Status=Master

 

[rvieceli]

A thread about squares can't go on without a mention of the Products Engineering blems from Harry J Epsteins. PEC makes a quality product under their own brand and also for Mitutoyo.

These are cosmetic blemishes that have NO effect on the square itself and frankly I have a hard time finding anything.

12 inch 2 piece combo is $24. 4 inch double $15 and 6 inch double $17.50
http://www.harryepstein.com/index.php/tool-brand/products-engineering.html

Ron