Granat vs Rubin 2?

[onocoffee]

I was at a Festool dealer today considering sandpapers. I've been using both the Granat and Granat Net and noticed the display said the Rubin 2 was more aggressive, but how does this change the results in the finer grits, like 120 and up? I figured that 120 is 120 is 120, or no?

How will the sanded finish differ with the Rubin 2 vs Granat?

 

[luvmytoolz]

Depends on what you're planning to sand. Granat is pretty popular with painted finishes as it doesn't load up as much as other types, but is thinner and rips more easily. The Rubin isn't as good as the Granat but is tougher, so good on edges and tricky stuff.

However, if you're really only going to sand timber, I'd highly recommend just going to one of the mesh net discs, they are so much longer lasting and give a great finish, and with extraction stay clean. I don't use any of my old Granat/Brilliant/Rubin discs since I went to net discs ages back. The Abranet Ace (and especially Ace HD in the really low grits) are simply superb, as are the Granat mesh and Cubitron.

 

[Huey52]

Way back when I got my first Festool sander (ETS 125 Req) I also got the systainer with Granat standard discs. I've only used about half of same as once I transitioned to 3M Cubitron II 775L discs I've seldom returned.

As [member=75933]luvmytoolz[/member] wells cites the Cubitron much better evacuate dust, especially with a Festool dust extractor. Be sure to use the appropriate backing pad for mesh-type discs to protect the sander pad.

I get mine via Taylor Toolworks thanks to Stumpy Nubs recommendation; a good sampler pack:
https://taytools.com/collections/br...achment-clean-sand-multi-hole-dust-extraction

Festool backing pad (for Granat mesh/net but works well with Cubitron):
https://www.amazon.com/Festool-2033...NrKUvB08Etzy0WgWs&dib_tag=se&keywords=Festool+sander+pad&qid=1729941699&sprefix=festool+sander+pad%2Caps%2C107&sr=8-1

 

[Jim_in_PA]

I am generally sanding bare wood 95% of the time. I've been using Ruben/Ruben II (or equivalent) for a couple of decades. Granat is great for sure, but it's not in my arsenal other than with what came with my RO90 at the present. I have not tried a "net" type product yet, but it's on my radar for sure.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

I like the "net" abrasives too. I've used the 3M and Abranet with great results. They are especially good in the higher grits. (Polishing plastics)

 

[Mettes]

[attachimg=1]

This is from a presentation during a workshop by Festool on surface finishing.

To the left is the Granat's grinding material, to the right Rubin's.
You can see how they wear over time.  The Granat (aluminium oxide) goes flat, which is ideal for leveling paint, to keep it as flat as possible, with as less deep groves as possible.
The Rubin (ceramic) is more brittle and it stays sharper, deeper groves, but faster removal.  The deeper groves are less a problem on bare wood.

Important to know, and the reason why Granat is effective both on bare wood and paint is that in the lower grits they use a combination of both.  The P40, P60 and P80 that is. 

 

[Crazyraceguy]

Well, that's just cool. Thanks, great to know.

 

[onocoffee]

Hans - that's some great info on the wear patterns of Granat and Rubin.

[member=75933]luvmytoolz[/member] - I have been using mesh net abrasives lately - starting with the Abranet and then with the ETS EC 150/3, I got the GranatNet set - and I learned about needing the protective layer The Hard Way (new pad cost me fifty bucks!).

 

[luvmytoolz]

Hans - that's some great info on the wear patterns of Granat and Rubin.

[member=75933]luvmytoolz[/member] - I have been using mesh net abrasives lately - starting with the Abranet and then with the ETS EC 150/3, I got the GranatNet set - and I learned about needing the protective layer The Hard Way (new pad cost me fifty bucks!).

That's a bummer with the pad! Don't know what the cost is like now, but a while back I bought a bunch of 5 packs from Mirka, as it was about half the cost of Festool's and didn't have a specific hole pattern so extraction is perfect.

 

[Mettes]

[attachimg=1]

This one I also found interesting.

Instead of skipping a grit, Festool advice is this.
Up to grid P100 you can double: from P40 to P80 for example or P24 to P40
From P100 up to P500 you can add 100. So you can go from P150 to P240, skipping 2 grits
and upwards of P500 you can double again

Switching Rotex from coarse to fine sanding is around P100.  And make the switch with the same grit.

 

[luvmytoolz]

This one I also found interesting.

Instead of skipping a grit, Festool advice is this.
Up to grid P100 you can double: from P40 to P80 for example or P24 to P40
From P100 up to P500 you can add 100. So you can go from P150 to P240, skipping 2 grits
and upwards of P500 you can double again

Switching Rotex from coarse to fine sanding is around P100.  And make the switch with the same grit.

I suspect it's because they don't load up as much as the normal paper/cloth backed discs, but with the mesh nets depending on the hardness of the timber, you can often just start at a high grit and get really great results without any noticeable effect on the life of the disc. So long as there aren't very noticeable saw marks I'll usually go straight from 120/180g to 240/320g as the cutting action on the mesh discs is so effective.

The only exception for me to this is when doing resin/wood mixed projects, you really need to work through the grits in that case as every scratch is highlighted in the resin.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

The only exception for me to this is when doing resin/wood mixed projects, you really need to work through the grits in that case as every scratch is highlighted in the resin.

Corian (and other brands) is the same way. You can get all the way to full shine and still find scratches from lower grits. You have to be very diligent and thorough in the completeness of your sanding. The problem is that it's very hard to see the scratches in the lower grits, because of the powdering effect.
Even with good extraction, you still need to do a water wipe-down between grits.
This is most important in darker colors, where a higher sanded finish is required.

Strangely enough, those same lines in that list are where I switch sanders too. I use the Rotex up to 100-120 then change to the ETS EC. If I am going above 500, it's back to the Rotex. The locked orbit polishes much better than random.