"I'M BEING MONITORED!"

[Matthew Schenker]

The red flag indicating a combative poster at least helps to steer me away from time wasting threads.

That's the idea!  If someone is "red," it helps us know who to ignore.  In the meantime, maybe the member in question will realize there's much more to gain by being friendly and helpful.

  I like your laid back style of management here, this is one area where it could hurt the forum however. Members like Festeringtool degrade this forum. Reluctance to remove a problem member, in my opinion, is the wrong approach. This reluctance allows the disruption to continue, upsetting the good members and ruining the atmosphere here. I mean no disrespect, just voicing a difference in opinion. I will respect your decisions of how to best handle these situations.

I'm watching things closely here, and taking your opinion very seriously.  But I do believe in providing the utmost opportunity for everyone to consider things freely and independently, rather than being forced.  I think we all benefit from that kind of attitude defining our forum.  Now, I know there are risks to that way of doing things.  At the moment, things seem to be quiet and the complaints have ceased.

To be clear, this is the last chance for festeringtool.  If the complaints spike again, I'll take further action.

Matthew

 

[mhch]

  Although everyone is free to speak, speaking with no other purpose than making unpleaseant and useless
  comments in a repetitive way is probably more of a pain than anything else, and for sure is not quite what
  this forum was meant for.

  Is this appearing on a forum not like software viruses and the like ? No one complains the anti-virus software
  tools are preventing people to speak, they can speak, however the sounds they make is filtered and hopefully
  kept out of disturbing others.

 

[semenza]

Hi,

        I find it hard to ignore when the posts are spread throughout perfectly good threads. And responses to those posts show up as quotes in other posts.

Seth

 

[Mike_Chrest]

Matthew,
  Can't we activate the ignore function again?
Mike

 

[jonny round boy]

I like the 'monitoring' approach. Personally, I don't think anyone should be banned from the forum. My main reason being that on the internet it's extremely difficult to ban people - if someone is determined to do nothing but wind people up (and I'm not saying that's the case with Festeringtool (his recent postings show some interest in the tools, rather than just criticising)) then banning them tends only to make them more determined.

There's another Forum in the UK where one particular individual (DD and the like will probably know who I mean) was doing exactly this, and they banned him. So he re-registered under another name, and continued. They banned him again, and this cycle continues to this day. He (may be a she, but I doubt it!) has been banned probably a dozen times or more, but is still being a bit of a pain in the butt.

If someone is intent on causing trouble, then ignoring them tends to work in the long run. Banning them doesn't as it gives them the attention they crave, and they can easily sign up again with a different e-mail address, and (if the forum logs computer ID's) by going through proxy servers.

 

[greg mann]

While us having to deal with this is a pain it is probably a useful process. Because of the collective attitude and civility of this group we will develop an approach and gain group experience on how to deal with this. One thing is for sure. No matter how this plays out it will not be the last time. Frankly, with the kinds of animosity and irrationality I have read elsewhere when Festool is mentioned I think we have done quite well. More often than not I believe some folks have come here with very skeptical attitudes only to be exposed to perspectives that they had not anticipated. Enlightenment may be too strong an adjective but acceptance probably isn't.

 

[dirtydeeds]

matt's approach make sense to me. most forums have an acceptance or ban 'em attitude

matt has a thrid way, which puts the "offender" on notice

with reasonable people (unless festering is a chav or a ned) "being on notice" will work.

i would like to think festering will mend his ways

ps i dont know the welsh, cornish or irish terms for chav or ned

 

[Matthew Schenker]

If someone is intent on causing trouble, then ignoring them tends to work in the long run. Banning them doesn't as it gives them the attention they crave, and they can easily sign up again with a different e-mail address, and (if the forum logs computer ID's) by going through proxy servers.

On a technical note, SMF allows me to ban members based on name, IP address, e-mail address, and host name, or a combination of those.  If someone were banned using those criteria, he or she would have to go through a lot of effort to re-join.

While us having to deal with this is a pain it is probably a useful process. Because of the collective attitude and civility of this group we will develop an approach and gain group experience on how to deal with this. One thing is for sure. No matter how this plays out it will not be the last time. Frankly, with the kinds of animosity and irrationality I have read elsewhere when Festool is mentioned I think we have done quite well. More often than not I believe some folks have come here with very skeptical attitudes only to be exposed to perspectives that they had not anticipated. Enlightenment may be too strong an adjective but acceptance probably isn't.

matt's approach make sense to me. most forums have an acceptance or ban 'em attitude
matt has a thrid way, which puts the "offender" on notice
with reasonable people (unless festering is a chav or a ned) "being on notice" will work.
i would like to think festering will mend his ways

I agree, which is why I have hesitated on the ban.  In the end, we all gain a lot more by making absolutely sure that any bans are totally and unquestionably necessary.  It's much more of a triumph, in my mind, to have members become part of the community who started out with communication problems, rather than ban them.  Of course, if it becomes clear that someone is truly bent on destruction, the ban option is always there.

Matthew

 

[Terp]

LEAVE BRITNEY ALONE!

Oh wait, sorry, my fault.  Wrong thread!

 

[dirtydeeds]

i have to say, altough i would have been in the "im being monitored" section a few weeks ago

some of the members here have been very kind to me, dan clark and iggy to mention two in particular have been particularly genourous

other un mentioned members of the forum, including matt schenker, (bad spelling and bad arm)  have also been influential in my "re habilitation" 

i hope festering will be man enough to re apply for membership (with matt's approval) with a new identity and a new attitude

i would also hope that festering notes my remarks and respects my request, particulaly in regard to informing matt of his intended change of identity

good luck to you festering however you intend to proceed

 

[Dave Rudy]

ps i dont know the welsh, cornish or irish terms for chav or ned

How about the English terms?  LOL

 

[dirtydeeds]

chav (english) and ned (scottish)

these terms make "trailer trash" seem "ivy league"

 

[Ned]

...unless festering is a chav or a ned...

Oh dear.  According to the Urban Dictionary, "ned" describes a Non Educated Delinquent.

Stop that snickering, Brits!

Ned

 

[John Langevin]

While none of us welcome this situation, I think in the long run it will be of benefit to the forum. The forum is growing rapidly, especially in terms of those who actually post or reply and this type of thing needs to be discussed and addressed just as we are doing here. Matt, I think you have handled it fairly, objectively, and with foresight as to what the best sort of precedent should be set. I think it is working, the last several posts/replies that I have seen from festeringtool have been in keeping with the intent and tone of the forum. Let's hope we can soon welcome him as a contributing member of our group.
  With respect to all, John Langevin

 

[The Woodentop]

While none of us welcome this situation, I think in the long run it will be of benefit to the forum. The forum is growing rapidly, especially in terms of those who actually post or reply and this type of thing needs to be discussed and addressed just as we are doing here. Matt, I think you have handled it fairly, objectively, and with foresight as to what the best sort of precedence should be set. I think it is working, the last several posts/replies that I have seen from festeringtool have been in keeping with the intent and tone of the forum. Let's hope we can soon welcome him as a contributing member of our group.
  With respect to all, John Langevin

I agree. And that's why in my last post on this subject (remember Adolf? LOL) I near enough suggested you should lift that horrible tag you've given Festering and give him/her a chance. If he/she doesn't act with the right attitude you can always Monitor him again. Encourage him/her to be normal??

 

[Eli]

I like that the few guys that I didn't get along with at first seemed to adjust (or maybe I did) and they're still here. I like the way you've done it Matthew. And everyone should remember in the future that someone really obnoxious at first should just get the cold shoulder and let's not waste time or posts on them until they're ready to really join up (and be a 'useful engine' in the parlance of Thomas the Tank Engine).

 

[Matthew Schenker]

Everyone,
OK, I just turned off the red light on festeringtool.  Let's see what happens now.
I think this generated a healthy discussion, and even though it was about a problem I do think it created better understanding.
Matthew

 

[Terp]

Matthew,
  I've actually grown to appreciate Fester the last few days.  He just has a wacked sense of humor.  I think he withstood quite a barrage, & stuck around for his public flogging, so to speak.  So here here, Fester seems to have toned it down, & stuck around.
  I think we all learned alot here.  I'm only sorry it's not going to be so easy to find Fester.  It's usually entertaining to say the least.  Not the insults just the banter.  Although it is time to kill this thread now, eh.

 

[John Langevin]

Yes Terp, lets take him out of the stocks, let him pull his pants up and welcome FESTERINGTOOL 

 

[The Woodentop]

Yes Terp, lets take him out of the stocks, let him pull his pants up and welcome FESTERINGTOOL 

Has something been going on that I've missed? I knew he'd been ostracised I didn't realise it was more serious!