Jig saw advice - Carvex or ?

[ururk]

I needed to buy a new jig saw, and after much angst looking over tool reviews ordered the 576535 (PSBC 420 HPC 4,0 EBI-Plus). I didn't think to check this forum first... I suspect some may know where I'm going. It hasn't shipped and I'm considering cancelling the order.

First off, I have never liked using jig saws because they have never cut at a 90 degree angle (this is using Bosch blades), which is one of the reasons I picked the Carvex based on some reviews. Additionally, my last jig saw (craftsman) failed because of poor internal construction, so I wanted something that would last. I only had less than 5 hours on the one that failed, if that.

Anyhow, I started reading about the issues the Carvex has with blade "alignment" - and based on what the forum is saying, Festool has not addressed this with any engineering changes - correct? It's listed as "new" on the Festool site, but I don't know what that means - is the saw redesigned - or just the combination of parts?

I want cordless - d-handle or barrel doesn't matter - though the Mafell P1CC is tempting even though it is corded and even more expensive. I am not interested in the corded Festool jigsaw. I am "bought in" to the Bosch 18v system, so you'd think I would have jumped on their cordless jigsaw but the reviews seemed "meh" - not the worst, but not high up there either. My hope is, if I had a better (cordless) unit, I'd reach for it more often rather than say, my Tajima G-Saw. I don't usually do finish cuts with that hand saw, but I'd never use my old jig saw because it never tracked straight, and I could never use it for near-finish cuts. I would like a better jig saw for times when a clean jig saw cut is good enough.

Thoughts? Recommendations?

 

[Cheese]

I'd vote for the Mafell 1st and the Trion 2nd...but those are both corded.  [tongue]  So that locks you into the Carvex platform if you want to go cordless, but I've heard good things about the Hilti offering which I would seriously take a look at. The Carvex is just ok...

Just noticed it's your first post so  [welcome] to the FOG.

 

[woodbutcherbower]

Yes - welcome to the FOG. I agree with [member=44099]Cheese[/member] - the P1CC exists in a class of one IMO. It's the only jigsaw out there which makes cuts which are consistently 100% square to the surface - I bought mine at a tool show after watching a rep cut a perfect square-edged circle around a £2 coin in 40mm thick oak. It achieves this using a unique and massively engineered blade clamping mechanism. The Carvex has its fans on here, but it sits in the very unusual position of having just as many haters as lovers on here. Almost unheard of for a Festool product. I understand a cordless version of the P1CC is in the pipeline, but the release date is totally unknown - well into 2023 I'm guessing.

The 22-volt Hilti? I had the rep call round and give me a demo recently. It was very, very good indeed - the closest I've ever seen to what's achievable with a P1CC. They do both a barrel-grip and D-handle.

Hope you get fixed up.
Kevin

 

[Michael Kellough]

If you want the best, follow the above advice.

If your requirements aren’t that extreme try the Bosch cordless. In the states you can return it within 30 days.

 

[ururk]

I understand a cordless version of the P1CC is in the pipeline, but the release date is totally unknown - well into 2023 I'm guessing.

The 22-volt Hilti? I had the rep call round and give me a demo recently. It was very, very good indeed - the closest I've ever seen to what's achievable with a P1CC. They do both a barrel-grip and D-handle.

Hope you get fixed up.
Kevin

Thanks for those suggestions - the Hilti is slightly cheaper and gives me something else to look at!

If you want the best, follow the above advice.

If your requirements aren’t that extreme try the Bosch cordless. In the states you can return it within 30 days.

Who do I buy the Bosch from to get the 30 day returns? If I can test it out and evaluate for myself, I'd feel better buying it first.

Amazon states:

This item can be returned in its original condition for a full refund or replacement within 30 days of receipt.

If I use it, not sure if they'll accept the return. I've returned a lot of stuff to them - but never when evaluating something - only for unused or defective items (ie, failure within 30 days with proper use).

 

[Michael Kellough]

In my experience Amazon’s return policy is extremely liberal but Lowes is too.
I think you can get free shipping from Lowes as well.
If the tool’s performance doesn’t match your expectations…

You can also take advantage of this 30 day satisfaction warranty to determine whether you prefer barrel or top grip.

 

[ururk]

Out of stock at Lowes, I guess I can buy it from Amazon and return if it doesn't cut straight - but the d-handle version has a variable speed trigger, not a speed control wheel. Not sure how fatiguing those are when trying to run at 50%, etc...

 

[morts10n]

I bought 2 Trion and one Carvex before my frustrations were eliminated by the Mafell

 

[ururk]

Well, this escalated quickly:

Bosch JSH180B - $128 - with dust attachment, L-Boxx, exact fit insert, battery set (to be comparable to Festool/Mafell) - $312
Festool Carvex - $519.00 - with base accessory kit (was curious how this compared in price) - $778
P1CC - $615 - with tilt base - $778

Cancelling the Festool order tomorrow morning, I ordered the Bosch (just the tool though). I'm not convinced I'll be happy with it - if not I'll return and wait till a cordless P1CC is released - I can wait. I need the jig saw for a project, but I will continue doing it the manual way for now if the Bosch doesn't work out. What's an extra 12 hours of my time?

Why so much "angst" over this tool? It isn't just this tool - tool buying in general is difficult for me. I try not to overspend... but I also want to buy something that works well and will last. I know if I get another sub-par jig saw it will only be used when I have no other option.

 

[pixelated]

If it’s helpful, I have a 12v Bosch recip saw that I’ve been very happy with.

 

[afish]

Im curious, what types of tasks are people using a jig saw for that is so critical. To me a jig saw is more off rudimentary tool.  The very design of a small metal blade prone to flexing with no bottom guide making a stabbing motion 1000's of times per minute and prone to significant chipping on either the top or bottom surface kind limits the tool to no precision type tasks 

 

[ururk]

Im curious, what types of tasks are people using a jig saw for that is so critical. To me a jig saw is more off rudimentary tool.  The very design of a small metal blade prone to flexing with no bottom guide making a stabbing motion 1000's of times per minute and prone to significant chipping on either the top or bottom surface kind limits the tool to no precision type tasks

For me, anyways, it would be nice if the jig saw could:

Replace a circular saw when cutting a board to length (up to 2x material)
Be the *final* step (before sanding) in cutting a shape out of plywood or when notching a board
Cut bevels in 4x8 wood sheets to a shape (not a straight line) - impossible to do with any other tool
Track straight even when the grain wants to pull it in one direction or another

There may be others - and this is why this decision is so "difficult" for me, anyhow. I don't think I would ever use it enough to justify the price of the Mafell, but I want something better than my previous unit and if it is precise I'll reach out to it more often than not. Like you say - it is a rudimentary tool but given the right design and blade type it can be so much more (Mafell's "v-shaped" blades, for instance). I was able to justify the price of the Carvex because it came with a battery and charger - it would let me purchase other Festool battery tools without having to purchase additional batteries.

 

[Mini Me]

I reckon I could cut a 2 metre board or panel quicker with a handsaw than a jig saw, in fact I am sure of it. Jigsaws by their nature are a fairly crude device and the Mafelle is the least crude from all reports.

 

[Cheese]

Im curious, what types of tasks are people using a jig saw for that is so critical.

For me the biggest deal is for the cut line to be 90º to the surface, that's my overriding concern. Here's a photo of a 12" circle cut in 3/4" ply. Difficult to see but the entire cut line is 90º to the surface using a standard Mafell W2 blade. Festool blades also work well in the P1cc and cut at 90º.
I tend not to use the double thickness Mafell W1 blade because it feeds so slowly and the other blades work well in the P1cc.

[attachimg=1]

And if eliminating sawdust is your thing, here's a photo of the dust leftover after I cut the end off of a piece of 3/4" ply. In order of cleanliness...Mafell...Trion...Carvex.

[attachimg=2]

[attachimg=3]

[attachimg=4]

 

[woodbutcherbower]

[member=44099]Cheese[/member] You're still wearing your safety white socks and moccasins !!!!!

 

[nvalinski]

Im curious, what types of tasks are people using a jig saw for that is so critical. To me a jig saw is more off rudimentary tool.  The very design of a small metal blade prone to flexing with no bottom guide making a stabbing motion 1000's of times per minute and prone to significant chipping on either the top or bottom surface kind limits the tool to no precision type tasks

I used to agree with you, but then I bought a P1CC. The P1CC gives me the ability to make accurate complex shapes in furniture and scribing thick counters that previously I needed a bandsaw to accomplish (and still needed sanding). For repeatable tasks, you are probably better off using routers and templates (where a less accurate jigsaw + spindle sander will be fine), but the P1CC gives me results nearly as good for any of my one-off needs and makes more accurate templates with less work. I also have grown accustomed to coping trim with it upside down, though I find myself leaning maybe towards picking up a less accurate 12V Bosch with a collin's coping foot for this task.

 

[Vtshopdog]

All these years honestly thought it was me making my Bosch cut somewhere around (+/-) 5-10 degrees, but reading this thread it appears it’s the tool not operator error ;D

 

[ururk]

All these years honestly thought it was me making my Bosch cut somewhere around (+/-) 5-10 degrees, but reading this thread it appears it’s the tool not operator error ;D

It's always the tool never the operator!

 

[Crazyraceguy]

I have always seen jigsaws as a slightly refined version of a reciprocating saw. (SawZall)
I don't really expect finished cuts from one. In general, I am just trying to get the bulk of the material out of the way.

 

[afish]

I have always seen jigsaws as a slightly refined version of a reciprocating saw. (SawZall)
I don't really expect finished cuts from one. In general, I am just trying to get the bulk of the material out of the way.

yep, that was kind of what I was getting at.  Back in the old days I might remove most with a jig saw but for finished cuts where accuracy counts I would make a template/jig and route the last bit.  I couldnt think of one one instance that I needed a jigsaw to make a almost perfect cut. But different strokes, I guess. outlet cutouts, cutting up the negatives off the cnc is about all I reach for a jigsaw for.  scribes are usually done as close as possible with a track saw and finished with a grinder.  I missed out on the RAS