Kapex 60, initial dust collection impression

D00

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Jun 30, 2016
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Hi There!  [smile]

Got my Kapex 60 about a week ago, replacing a Milwaukee MS216B, which replaced a Metabo KS216M. Stepping up in quality every time about the same amount every time.

The new machine is supposed to be used in my garage which is adjacent to the living room, only separated by one door. So you'll figure dust collection is critical and a big factor in the decision to buy this particular saw (the wife wouldn't be too enthusiastic about a dustgenerator I suppose and neither do I). Can't stand sawdust everywhere. Kapex machines are alleged to be the best in the dusty department I understood.

My vacuum is a Metabo ASR2025, which, if looking at the specs sits between a Ct Midi and a CT26 if Metabo got the numbers right. 3.660 l/min / 1200 W / 248 hPa (mbar). It has a reasonably short 36 mm hose with the Festool 36 mm connector slid over the port on the Kapex.

Now, dust collection isn't all to good. Especially when plunging it sucks. It's better than the Milwaukee and miles better than the Metabo, but I expected better after watching a lot of Kapexes on youtube (all 120's I realize now). Is the 120 just that much better, and if yes, why? Did anyone try to improve it some way?

Would cutting a larger rubber flap be of any help? Really looking forward to any other experiences.
 
Sorry to hear about your less than optimal experience.  From what I have personally experienced from the bigger Kapex and from what I have read here, a plunge i.e. Non sliding cut will usually result in less dust collection.

I fully realize that every Kapex critic out there will jump on this and ask me for the basis of my statement and to that I will say:  search function.

Peter
 
D00 said:
I expected better after watching a lot of Kapexes on youtube
Dust collection always looks better in the videos than it is in real life.  [wink]

 
When you plunge, the teeth are just hitting the surface and flicking the dust pretty much straight back. When you slide first then pluge the teeth are already deep in the piece and flick the dust up, towards the collection chute.
 
One trick I read on this forum was to let the saw/ dust collector run for 10-20 seconds before starting the cut. That seems to improve collection. Also, I changed to the short and fat hose. With all that, collection isn't 100%, but it's really good.
 
The Festool 36mm hose provides better suction on my K60 than the standard27mm  hose.What are the hose options for the Metabo Vac?
 
Untidy Shop said:
The Festool 36mm hose provides better suction on my K60 than the standard27mm  hose.What are the hose options for the Metabo Vac?

I am using a 36 mm hose and connector (as stated in the OP), the used to be a 27 mm connector on this 36 mm hose. Tried that with the Kapex and it makes no real difference in dust collecting performance (27 mm goes into the port on the saw and the 36 mm slides over, no real improvement here).

Anyone got any experience wth both the 60 and the 120? I am just within the 15 days period, so I might swap it for the 120 if it performs significantly better.
 
D00 said:
Tried that with the Kapex and it makes no real difference in dust collecting performance (27 mm goes into the port on the saw and the 36 mm slides over, no real improvement here).

I only have the 120, however the short 36mm hose made a significant improvement over the 27mm hose.
 
D00 said:
Untidy Shop said:
The Festool 36mm hose provides better suction on my K60 than the standard27mm  hose.What are the hose options for the Metabo Vac?

I am using a 36 mm hose and connector (as stated in the OP), the used to be a 27 mm connector on this 36 mm hose. Tried that with the Kapex and it makes no real difference in dust collecting performance (27 mm goes into the port on the saw and the 36 mm slides over, no real improvement here).

Anyone got any experience wth both the 60 and the 120? I am just within the 15 days period, so I might swap it for the 120 if it performs significantly better.

Just to be clear on the hose connector. ................. you have a D36 hose with a reducing connector? So even though the hose is 36 the actual connection is still 27? 

Seth
 
[size=13pt][member=1619]SRSemenza[/member]  [member=61746]D00[/member]  [member=1674]Peter Halle[/member]
[size=10pt]Just to be clear on the hose connector. ................. you have a D36 hose with a reducing connector? So even though the hose is 36 the actual connection is still 27? 

Seth


[attachimg=1]​

[size=13pt]Down here at least, the connector supplied on my 36mm hose [purchased with CT26] fits outside the circumference of the KS60 dust port, whilst the 27mm hose connector fits within. [See first two images.] Consequently with the 36mm hose and its connector connected to the dust port there is no internal ridge facing the airflow, hence better dust extraction. With the 27mm hose and connector there is a ridge restricting airflow. The same aplies to my HK55 [last image].

To attach the 36mm hose to a D500 and Festool routers I purchased an adaptor [Third Image]. With these tools there is still better extraction using the 36mm hose with the adapter than with the 27mm hose. I continue to use my old CT 22 with 27mm hose for sanding.
 

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Your vac & hose choices seem appropriate to the task, although a 36mm connection mounted over the saw's dust port would provide maximum airflow.  Interesting that there's no difference!

Why not send the Saw back & try another?  Makita's new SCMS (LS1019). has been getting excellent user feedback.  It has twin dust ports: one on the Saw carriage & another larger fixed port at the "stem" of the pivot assembly, which are ducted together for extraction.  According to users (of which I aren't one it must be admitted) it's extraction system is pretty well designed & quite effective.  I'm using cordless Metabo & corded Bosch SCMSs myself, which have "acceptable" dust extraction only, although both benefit from substituting the bag for powered extraction.

If it's any consolation, the current crop of SCMS generally have superior dust collection capabilities (even with dust bags) to the "old school" Radial Arm Saws.
 
Yea pretty much all the tools have been updated with the new dust port connection on them. Im glad I bought all my Festool tools before they were converted. Looking at getting the RTS 400 though and unfortunately that was never made with the old style, so if I do get it Ill be forced to get with that new connector to some degree. Hoping later someone finds a way to convert it to the old style.
 
SRSemenza said:
D00 said:
Untidy Shop said:
The Festool 36mm hose provides better suction on my K60 than the standard27mm  hose.What are the hose options for the Metabo Vac?

I am using a 36 mm hose and connector (as stated in the OP), the used to be a 27 mm connector on this 36 mm hose. Tried that with the Kapex and it makes no real difference in dust collecting performance (27 mm goes into the port on the saw and the 36 mm slides over, no real improvement here).

Anyone got any experience wth both the 60 and the 120? I am just within the 15 days period, so I might swap it for the 120 if it performs significantly better.

Just to be clear on the hose connector. ................. you have a D36 hose with a reducing connector? So even though the hose is 36 the actual connection is still 27? 

Seth

Hi there, no, the hose and connector are 36 mm. I tried the 36 mm hose with reducing (27) connector also, did not make a huge difference.

Let me clarify that the fine dust (which is by far the most important), does get sucked away for 95% which is great, when sliding. It is mostly fine sawdust/small chips (you know what I mean) that stays behind. Maybe it would be a option to install a Low Pressure High Volume extraction point behind/below he saw to further improve..
 
Is there a ridge or lip inside the saws port that is part of the saws swivel elbow ? The way that elbow fits into the metal portion looks like there could be.

Seth
 
Hello. I've got the Kapex with a 36 mm hose and a Fein vac.  I'm disappointed with the dust collection.  I expected more.  Not sure what to do.  Hard to imagine I paid so much for this saw.
 
sbarlin said:
Hello. I've got the Kapex with a 36 mm hose and a Fein vac.  I'm disappointed with the dust collection.  I expected more.  Not sure what to do.  Hard to imagine I paid so much for this saw.
Do some cuts without the vac being connected, after that you'll like the dust extraction (even when not being perfect) ;)
 
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