Kapex life span

[Brice Burrell]

I asked my dealer and they haven't had any failures.

Dealers aren't necessarily the first point of service here in N. America, so they may not know if any of their customers had failures.

 

[travisj]

I asked my dealer and they haven't had any failures.

Dealers aren't necessarily the first point of service here in N. America, so they may not know if any of their customers had failures.

I wrote that in haste, I apologize.  I could have been more clear.  My dealer did not know of any failures with the armature or burning up the motors.  He did have some that were abused or had other issues.  They do a lot of service work on Porter Cable and Bosch tools, but obviously they do not repair Festool.

 

[Brice Burrell]

First, jmb has been posting his projects on here for years, I'm pretty confident he knows what the heck he's doing. Besides the point however. when you design a product, you design it to be used and consider faults with reason. If someone is using their kapex as a type of mallet to drive stakes, I would expect it to stop cutting wood properly, if at all. However, if you're cutting wood, dull blade or not I would expect better performance for the ticket price as opposed to motor disintegration.

The ts saws will not cut if the motor is overloaded. Their drills will not drill if there is an overload. The tech is available and in some ways pioneered by festool.  These motors should not fail

I'd guess Festool designed the Kapex with the most powerful motor they could and still have it work when plugged into their vacs.  I can't help but wonder if this compromise leaves the Kapex under powered for hard professional use.  So why not have the same overload protection that the drills and other tools have?  Well, maybe because the saw would shutdown far too often in normal use.... This is all speculation on my part.       

 

[Nigel]

I have had a cheap an cheerful scms for years with the same blade - never been sharpened, just for rough cutting because it's not very accurate. I have cut loads of Oak and even old chestnut planks for firewood and it still goes the same but hellish noisy. I wanted to upgrade to a Kapex but I'm glad I didn't now and if I had I would of put a nice blade and kept it sharp! It's a lot to shell out for limited durabilty.

 

[GhostFist]

Side note, re vacs. The starmix or rebranded metabo has a dial to set the amperage of the tool you're plugging into it. Nice idea

 

[Holmz]

...
I'd guess Festool designed the Kapex with the more powerful motor they could and still have it work when plugged into their vacs.
...

All I ever hear is "it is a system".

 

[AlexThePalex]

Side note, re vacs. The starmix or rebranded metabo has a dial to set the amperage of the tool you're plugging into it. Nice idea

What is the benefit?

 

[jmbfestool]

Just throwing it out there.

Im not sure because i havent found the reciept yet. Ill have a look tomorrow.

I think the kapex is 6years old.  The motor failed just under 4 years i think and has now failed again.

If i add the cost of the kapex alone and repair
The kapex has cost me to date  £200 a year

If i decided to get it repaired again (which i am not going to)
Then it will have cost me to date £250 a year roughly.
It seems life expetancy is average 3years
So it will cost me £180 a year at best to own a kapex.

Seen as i am deciding to buy a different brand chop saw.
The UG-stand and arms will become obsolete which adds to the total cost loss.

The kapex to this day has cost me
£283 a year for 6 years.

 

[harry_]

I have a Bosch 4412 SCMS that I have owned for at least a decade. I have had various plastic parts break on it over the years but nothing that ever kept it from performing. Even had it fall out of my truck and stayed true. Very much to my grateful surprise!

I'v had the Kapex on my list for years now and like many previous in this thread an others, I am left a little weary of that purchase.

 

[GhostFist]

Side note, re vacs. The starmix or rebranded metabo has a dial to set the amperage of the tool you're plugging into it. Nice idea

What is the benefit?

To prevent circuit overload

 

[glass1]

jmb.... I have known the dealer for twenty years. He is a personal friend. Said user is the one who admitted to using dull blades. Maybe it only lasts a few years. I sure hope not. I have hope festool extends the warranty on the motor. It should last 10 years. I feel your pain but none of the other new saws float my boat for various reasons.

 

[jmbfestool]

jmb.... I have known the dealer for twenty years. He is a personal friend. Said user is the one who admitted to using dull blades. Maybe it only lasts a few years. I sure hope not. I have hope festool extends the warranty on the motor. It should last 10 years. I feel your pain but none of the other new saws float my boat for various reasons.

I agree.  All other saws dont float my boat either.

They are to heavy, to big, poor dust extraction, slide to the rear etc

I love the kapex and i really would love to buy another one but i just cant afford nor justify a tool with a 3-4year life span. When others can easily last 6-7years +

Had it lasted the 6 years i would be down the shop now buying another one... Maybe even two

 

[harry_]

jmb.... I have known the dealer for twenty years. He is a personal friend. Said user is the one who admitted to using dull blades. Maybe it only lasts a few years. I sure hope not. I have hope festool extends the warranty on the motor. It should last 10 years. I feel your pain but none of the other new saws float my boat for various reasons.

I agree.  All other saws dont float my boat either.

They are to heavy, to big, poor dust extraction, slide to the rear etc

I love the kapex and i really would love to buy another one but i just cant afford nor justify a tool with a 3-4year life span. When others can easily last 6-7years +

Had it lasted the 6 years i would be down the shop now buying another one... Maybe even two

But what were your gains in production in the time that you did have it?

 

[Kev]

Any appliance insurance companies over there that'd offer a +5 years ?

 

[TomE]

Common practice in the US to offer extended warranties on most anything, for a fee of course.

I have extended warranties on my new kitchen appliances primarily because the 'not so old' appliances they replaced failed to the point where repair was almost as costly as new replacement. I still have a freezer that's over 40 years old going strong.... simpler times I suspect.

If there is a circuit board involved anywhere, you' re probably going to suffer failure there first. In turn, that failure can lead to failure of the parts under it's control.

This stuff reminds me of a situation, sometime back, when out-of-spec capacitors caused failures to a small batch of product produced by highly touted major manufacturers of computer motherboards.

Word of problems got out and users could check their systems visually for fat or leaking capacitors. I was lucky and didn't have problems but the small group of users who lost their systems were unhappy to say the least.

The problems with these motherboards showed first for overclockers, those folks tinker with their systems to gain max speed, usually for gaming. However, plain ol' business users who just want stuff to work, could suffer the same failures over time.

Nothing showed during testing and quality controls, the problems only showed after 'real world' use.

Don't know if Festool or affiliates offer extended warranty insurance, maybe they should.

 

[Holmz]

...
I agree.  All other saws dont float my boat either.
...

For me it is either a Kapex or use an Erika.
I actually have 30M or architraving (skirting and moulding) to mitre this weekend.... so I'll use a track saw and MFT.

 

[Tinker]

I have had only one SCMS, a Hitachi 8-1/2".  It is probably oover 20 years old by now.  I used it often up until I came home with a ATF 55, MFT 1080 and CT 33.  From there, it was only used sporaticly.  I never had a problem with it and it does, after taking time to adjust to perfection, still cut dead on at square.  Only a hair off at 45º.  The only saws i can compare for longevity with every day use have been my Milwaukee circular saws.  The 8-1/4 was used and abused fr over 30 years before it finally caught fire. That saw was used for cutting bricks, blocks, concrete, stone and nial and concrete impregnatd lumber.  It fell off of scaffolding and off of a moving truck on the highway.  Until it caught fire, it never quit.  My 7-1/2" Milwaukee also lasted for 330 years until i gave it to my son for his work. That was about 4 or 5 years ago and as far as i know, the saw is still in use. I have not the confidence that my Festool saws will last as lonng, even tho they will never be put to the hard work and abuse that those old circular saws from way back years ago. 

I have played with several Kapex saws and I like the ease of operation.  They operate on a different set of concepts than my Hitachi SCMS.  On my Hitachi, the only piece of plastic I can find anywhere it the little tab behind the blade to capture dust.  I have not looked to see if there are any plastic parts on the Kapex.

Brice has mentioned the possibility of a problem in running the Kapex thru the CT vacs.  Is it possible a bigger vac would help to prevent such burnouts as what is discussed in this thread. Is it the fault of the CT, the Kapex or at the panel. I had a RAS for years.  Even with no dust vac hooked up, it would often tip the fuse box and i had to wait til it cooled down.  I don't think such overloading did the saw any good even tho it trip at the panel.  Maybe Festoy needs to rethink the CT where the Kapex is being run thru them.
Tinker

 

[jmbfestool]

jmb.... I have known the dealer for twenty years. He is a personal friend. Said user is the one who admitted to using dull blades. Maybe it only lasts a few years. I sure hope not. I have hope festool extends the warranty on the motor. It should last 10 years. I feel your pain but none of the other new saws float my boat for various reasons.

I agree.  All other saws dont float my boat either.

They are to heavy, to big, poor dust extraction, slide to the rear etc

I love the kapex and i really would love to buy another one but i just cant afford nor justify a tool with a 3-4year life span. When others can easily last 6-7years +

Had it lasted the 6 years i would be down the shop now buying another one... Maybe even two

But what were your gains in production in the time that you did have it?

Im not sure.

I think.... Not to sure but mates have  dewalts, makitas or metabos ,when we are on site together only one of us sets up.  Sometimes its me sometimes its them.  When im using theirs i dont feel like it has taken me any longer to do the jobs.

I think the kapex just makes my life easier and more enjoyable but i dont think it has made a big impact on productivity.
Remember the UG stand didnt exist when i bought the kapex. I bought the mft top with the arm
Extentions and it was rubbish to many parts.

The UG stand to me is what has set the kapex more apart from other chopsaws.

I went to my dealer to day.  I had a look at the bosch glide.  Its bit big and heavy but the dealer is sending me one for a week to Try out.

Hes said i should send the kapex off and see what they come back with. I might aswell because i was only got to skip it. 

Hes coming round later to pick it up from mine personally and then sending it festool. I better get the kettle on for him!

 

[Brice Burrell]

...Brice has mentioned the possibility of a problem in running the Kapex thru the CT vacs.  Is it possible a bigger vac would help to prevent such burnouts as what is discussed in this thread. Is it the fault of the CT, the Kapex or at the panel. I had a RAS for years.  Even with no dust vac hooked up, it would often tip the fuse box and i had to wait til it cooled down.  I don't think such overloading did the saw any good even tho it trip at the panel.  Maybe Festoy needs to rethink the CT where the Kapex is being run thru them.
Tinker

I don't think it's the vac, it's possibly the saw that is the problem.  My guess is the motor on the Kapex is not powerful enough for hard professional use, so eventually it burns out for some users.  It has "less powerful" motor so it can be run through the vac and not trip the circuit the saw/vac is plugged into.  Not plugging the saw into a vac won't help because the saw's motor is still too underpowered for hard use. This is all speculation on my part.     

 

[Tinker]

...Brice has mentioned the possibility of a problem in running the Kapex thru the CT vacs.  Is it possible a bigger vac would help to prevent such burnouts as what is discussed in this thread. Is it the fault of the CT, the Kapex or at the panel. I had a RAS for years.  Even with no dust vac hooked up, it would often tip the fuse box and i had to wait til it cooled down.  I don't think such overloading did the saw any good even tho it trip at the panel.  Maybe Festoy needs to rethink the CT where the Kapex is being run thru them.
Tinker

I don't think it's the vac, it's possibly the saw that is the problem.  My guess is the motor on the Kapex is not powerful enough for hard professional use, so eventually it burns out for some users.  It has "less powerful" motor so it can be run through the vac and not trip the circuit the saw/vac is plugged into.  Not plugging the saw into a vac won't help because the saw's motor is still too underpowered for hard use. This is all speculation on my part.   

Your speculation comes from more first hand experience than from my point of the question.  I seem to recall some pretty hefty beams that JMB showed in some of his projects.  Maybe in his case, he was on the right track when he mentioned loking at radial saws. 
Tinker