Leigh D4R Pro and Festool OF-1400

dannybirdie

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Joined
Nov 4, 2021
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4
Hi,
  I was considering purchasing the Leigh D4R Pro Dovetail jig, and the Festool OF-1400.

  I read there are some concentricity issues with the guide bushing alignment on the Festool OF-1400. Is this true? Any info on this would be appreciated.

  Are there any other shortcoming on the OF-1400? Thanks in advance.

Thanks,
Danny
 
I use the 1400 on the D4R. The bit isn't dead center on the guide, but if you are holding the router the same way, it isn't relevant (for example, I have the 1400 handle in my right hand whenever I'm routing... if I switched hands rotating the router, it would cause issues).

If you had 2 routers with centered bits, you could load the dovetail and straight bits into the separate routers and save some setup time between stacks of different layouts, but it goes very quickly.

It is annoying, though, that it isn't centered or centerable...
 
For those who have never used a Leigh dovetail jig, they are great for production work once dialed in.  The YouTube videos make it look easy, but I was struggling with it for a small project using walnut, cherry, and maple panels.  I wasted so much time chasing the setup problems and could have hand cut the dovetails in a small fraction of the time I spent on the Leigh jig and OF1400.

Cutting half blind dovetails with the Leigh jig uses only one cutter and the depth of cut is the same for the pin and tail boards.  The art of setting the cutter depth is finding the sweet spot where the joint is tight.  Leigh has a recommended depth of cut for each of the four cutters used for half blind dovetails, and the cutter choice depends on the thickness of the pin board.  Small adjustments are made in the cutter projection to compensate for loose or tight joints.  Once the joint is tight on the test cut, the settings are not changed for the rest of the project.

In my case, the pin and tail boards are both 18mm, but they can be different thicknesses.  The router must be fitted with the 7/16-inch outer diameter guide bushing.  The OF 1400 (and OF 2200) use a snap-in bushing plates and are supposed to be factory set so the center of the bushing guide is over the center of the arbor.  This sounds great, if it works, but there is no way for the user to adjust the guide bushing using a centering mandrel.

I started with the recommended depth of cut of 13mm for the router bit I was using, and cut a pin and tail board using some offcuts I saved from the milling process.  This produced a joint that was too loose with a 1.5mm gap in the joint.  I did not expect such a large gap, but followed the directions and extended the bit by the correct amount to close up the gaps.  I made a second set of cuts on a fresh edge of the offcuts. These were also too loose by about the same amount as the first set of cuts and I was nearly at the point of no longer having a half blind dovetail.

Since I didn't want to use up my precious walnut offcuts, I milled a four-foot length of 3/4-inch thick poplar to 18mm thick.  Then I cut it in half lengthwise so I had a pair of two-foot long practice pin and tail boards.  No matter what changes I made to the cutter depth, I could not reduce the gaps in the joint.  After each failed attempt, I cut off the pins and tails so I had a fresh edge for the next attempt.  I divided my time to reading the well-written manual for the Leigh jig (it really is well-written) and watching lots of YouTube videos to see where I was failing.  I was doing everything correct, yet the joints would not close up.  To make matters worse, most of the workers in the videos were using the OF 1400.  I was almost at the point of hauling the jig and router to the nearby river and letting them become a new artificial reef project.

Near the end of the second day, I decided to reset everything to the Leigh recommendations and make another trial run.  That is where I noticed the problem.  The snap-in guide bushing adapter plate in the OF 1400 was moving side to side as I moved the router through the guide fingers of the jig.  I unplugged the router, turned it upside down on the workbench, and gave the adapter plate a wiggle.  Sure enough, there was movement of the plate in the base of the router.  This is why the joints were always loose no matter what I did with the router bit depth.

After a lot of research on the Internet and here, I discovered this is a well-documented failing of both the OF 1400 and the OF 2200.  This problem does not exist with the OF 1010 because the guide bushings are attached to the base by screws and the mounting holes are large enough to allow for adjustment when used with a centering mandrel.

To demonstrate the movement, here is a very short YouTube video from ten years ago showing the amount of movement of the guide bushing adapter plate on the OF 1400.  This is not my video, but my OF 1400 has the same amount of movement.



I didn't have the adapter plate for my OF 1010, so I ordered two and waited.  With shipping from Austria, the total cost was about €20.  When they arrived two days later, I attached the 7/16-inch guide bushing to one of the plates, centered the bushing to the arbor, set the depth of cut to 13mm, and made another test run.  I think I heard angels singing in the background.  The fit was almost perfect, but there was a 0.4mm gap in the joint (I used a feeler gauge to check).  I made a 0.4mm adjustment to the cutting depth and made another test cut on fresh edges of the boards.  It was a perfect fit.  I made two more sets of joints to make sure the second test cut was not a fluke, and they were identical.  Success!  The total time with the OF 1010 to complete the trial runs and make two proof of concept runs was about 30 minutes.  I spent the better part of two days chasing shadows with the OF 1400.

Bottom line: I had never used guide bushings with the OF 1400 until I bought the Leigh jig, and I bought the OF1400 solely because of the Leigh jig.  If you need to make precise cuts using guide bushings, I would NOT recommend the OF 1400 or OF 2200, as they are not fit for purpose in this operation. Otherwise, they are great routers for use with fence guides or guide rails, or bearing guided cutters, but don't rely on them when using guide bushings.  I cannot explain why others in YouTube land have great success using the OF1400 with their Leigh jigs, but it didn't work for me. 

Since I also use the Vacuum and Router Support (VRS) rail with my jig, dust collection through the router is not required.  The vacuum hose connects to the sliding tray on the VRS and is great.  If I had access to a fixed base router with a fine depth adjustment, I would use it instead of the Festool routers. Unfortunately, all of the routers I have found in the 1400W range have a plunge base.
 
When I bought my OF2200 I had the wiggle issue as well and went back and forth with Festool many times, to their credit they were extremely responsive and helpful, but at the same time I think in a product of that price range a fit like that is just unacceptable.

In the end I just tapped around the outside edge with a hammer to deform the guide by the barest immeasurable amount. It ended up an absolutely perfect fit as a result.
 
I definitely prefer the OF1010 for routing dovetails, for not only the centering ability, it is also more nimble and plenty powerful enough.
But, it can be done, as Paul said, as long as you hold it the same way every time. The slight off-center can be compensated for in that way.
As far as the looseness/wiggling that [member=15936]MikeG[/member] experienced, that can usually be eliminated by slightly bending outward on the tabs that hold them in place. That little bit of tension should keep it stationary. It may remain off-center still, but no longer moving around.
 
dannybirdie said:
Are there any other shortcoming on the OF-1400? Thanks in advance.

The other problem I had with the OF1400 was self-induced.  The Leigh VRS is supposed to support the router base during the entire cutting process for the pins and tails.  The top of the VRS rail has slightly sloping sides that meet near the middle of the rail to form a peak that becomes a single point of contact along the length of the support rail.  During normal use, one side of the router base rides over the finger guides and the other side rides over the VRS peak.  This keeps the router base level during the cutting process. 

Unfortunately, I blindly relied on this while I was going through test cuts before I noticed the base was sliding off of the peak and down the sloping side as I cut the pins.  This allowed the router base to tilt slightly away from the jig (towards me) and change the cutting path.  At this point, I didn't realize the guide bushing was also moving and thought I had only one problem to fix. 

I bought some 5mm thick phenolic plate and made a custom base that had an elongated extension on one side that would ensure firm contact with the VRS peak at all times.  The base I made replaced the existing base and worked great.  The router did not tilt and I was able to continue my journey down Frustration Lane where I later discovered the second problem described in the previous post above. 

It is possible to keep the OF1400 flat on the guide fingers after the base loses contact with the VRS, but one moment of inattention will cause the entire cutting operation to go wrong if the base tilts.  The OF1010 base is smaller and much easier to keep flat on the guide fingers without relying on the VRS for support.
 
The centering issue makes it unfit for guide bush work. Unfortunate, because apart from that, it's a great router. A fatal flaw.
I already have a 1010 set up for LR32 work, but if I went with a Leigh jig, I'd bite the bullet and get another.
 
Here are some photos showing the problem with the base sliding off of the VRS peak. The first photo is the OF1400 (without guide bushing or cutter) on the Leigh jig and VRS. The left side of the router base is flat on the guide fingers and the right side of the base is on the VRS peak.

OF1400-Base-1.jpg

This photo shows the router moved to the left as it would be when cutting the pins. The right side of the base has moved off of the VRS peak and has dipped down. The left side of the base is slightly raised.

OF1400-Base-2.jpg

This photo shows the standard base and the modified base with a 25mm extension. The modified phenolic base is a little thicker than the stock base to ensure it doesn't flex.

OF1400-Base-3.jpg

This photo shows the modified base attached to the router.

OF1400-Base-4.jpg

This photo shows the OF1400, with the modified base, well beyond where it would normally be when cutting pins. The base extension on the right is still riding on the VRS peak and the base on the left is still flat on the guide fingers.

OF1400-Base-5.jpg

Had this been the only correction needed, I would have been very happy with using the OF1400 with the Leigh jig. I did experiment with bending the tabs on the guide busing adapter plate, but I couldn't find an angle that would lock the plate in place and still allow it to release when not needed. The OF1010 will be my router of choice with the Leigh jig.

@montyss is in the process of making a prototype base for the OF1400 that replaces the existing base and adapter plates. His design has an opening in the center for the Porter Cable style of guide bushings and allows alignment of the guide bushing using a centering cone.
 
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MikeGE said:
Here are some photos showing the problem with the base sliding off of the VRS peak.  The first photo is the OF1400 (without guide bushing or cutter) on the Leigh jig and VRS.  The left side of the router base is flat on the guide fingers and the right side of the base is on the VRS peak. 

[attachimg=1]

This photo shows the router moved to the left as it would be when cutting the pins.  The right side of the base has moved off of the VRS peak and has dipped down.  The left side of the base is slightly raised.

[attachimg=2]

This photo shows the standard base and the modified base with a 25mm extension.  The modified phenolic base is a little thicker than the stock base to ensure it doesn't flex.

[attachimg=3] 

This photo shows the modified base attached to the router. 

[attachimg=4]

This photo shows the OF1400, with the modified base, well beyond where it would normally be when cutting pins.  The base extension on the right is still riding on the VRS peak and the base on the left is still flat on the guide fingers.

[attachimg=5] 

Had this been the only correction needed, I would have been very happy with using the OF1400 with the Leigh jig.  I did experiment with bending the tabs on the guide busing adapter plate, but I couldn't find an angle that would lock the plate in place and still allow it to release when not needed.  The OF1010 will be my router of choice with the Leigh jig. 

[member=28131]montyss[/member] is in the process of making a prototype base for the OF1400 that replaces the existing base and adapter plates.  His design has an opening in the center for the Porter Cable style of guide bushings and allows alignment of the guide bushing using a centering cone.

Why is the VRS plate shaped like that? I assume it would be a problem with any router, not just the 1400?
 
Lincoln said:
Why is the VRS plate shaped like that? I assume it would be a problem with any router, not just the 1400?
 

I can only speculate, but having a single point of contact, the peak, near the center line of the rail makes it easier to set the height of the VRS so it is level with the top of the finger guides.  If the VRS rail was flat, it would also have to be coplanar with the finger guides. 

Yes, I think it would be a problem with any router that did not have a wide base.
 
I use the dovetail jig with my OF-1010. 
I agree with Crazyracingguy that the smaller router would be preferred over the 1400, but I have used the Leigh jig with a full sized router in the past, so the 1400 should be OK, as far as size and weight.

By the way, don't be discouraged when it takes you several hours of reading and re-reading the manual every time you want to use the Leigh jig.  It happens to me too.

Also, when cutting the tails (board clamped vertically) you can put a sacrificial backup behind it (clamped horizontally) to help prevent chipping when the cutter exits the back of the board.
 

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Crazyraceguy said:
I definitely prefer the OF1010 for routing dovetails, for not only the centering ability, it is also more nimble and plenty powerful enough.
But, it can be done, as Paul said, as long as you hold it the same way every time. The slight off-center can be compensated for in that way.
As far as the looseness/wiggling that [member=15936]MikeG[/member] experienced, that can usually be eliminated by slightly bending outward on the tabs that hold them in place. That little bit of tension should keep it stationary. It may remain off-center still, but no longer moving around.
 

Concur!  Leigh Jigs offers the 704R guide bushing plate which does have enough slack to make centering a piece of cake on the OF 1010. https://www.leightools.com/guide-bushings-adaptors/
 
I didn't read all the replies since I last drifted by; I do like the base [member=70363]MikeGE[/member] made. I think I didn't have much of a problem with the sloped part since I have the VRS really close to the material. Also, my material was 3/8" (9.5mm) thin. But gonna steal that.

The 1400's seeming inability to have the bit centered on the guide bushing was bugging me earlier so I wanted to look at the snap-in bushing insert and the available accessories to see if I could McGyver a fix. Along the way, I popped a 1/2" centering pin in and tried the 17/32" I.D. PC-compatible bushing (the bushing with a lock nut; sadly I lack a 1/2" I.D.).

It wasn't centered.

Then, I popped out the bushing insert, rotated it 180º, and popped it back in. Perfect. So all this time, my bushing insert was centered if I inserted it the correct way. The other way was absolutely off-center. I put a dot of whiteout on it to align with the handle so I know the correct orientation.

Maybe give that a go... try it both ways to see which fits. It might be centered and you had my dumb luck of putting it in the 'wrong' way each time I checked.

I tried taking these photos with the lens directly over the pin; if anything, they show what I see so there's that... last pic shows the dot of whiteout in case you never used a typewriter before...

 

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PaulMarcel said:
Maybe give that a go... try it both ways to see which fits. It might be centered and you had my dumb luck of putting it in the 'wrong' way each time I checked.

Thanks for the information and suggestions, @PaulMarcel . I tried the adapter plate both ways in the OF1400, but could not eliminate the movement. It won't help me to center the bushing over the arbor if I can't control the lateral movement during use. With the Leigh jig and half-blind dovetails, the slightest movement of the bushing relative to the cutter is enough to create bad joint.
 
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A .svg file for making a base plate with Shaper Origin to accept Porter cable style guide bushings is loaded on Shaper Hub for the Festool OF 1400 for anyone interested. There are 2 files  1 is the normal round base 170mm and the other rectangular base is 200mm X 180mm for use with the Leigh Jig
On Shaper hub its " Festool OF 1400 Base Plate "
 
montyss said:
A .svg file for making a base plate with Shaper Origin to accept Porter cable style guide bushings is loaded on Shaper Hub for the Festool OF 1400 for anyone interested. There are 2 files  1 is the normal round base 170mm and the other rectangular base is 200mm X 180mm for use with the Leigh Jig
On Shaper hub its " Festool OF 1400 Base Plate "

I wonder if the bushings end up perfectly centered when using this base. May try it and see. Thanks for the post!
 
What am I missing...why would anyone even try to use a Festool 1400 with a PC bushing to produce nice clean dovetails? If you want nice tight joints that combination is just plain goofy. Unless you completely jettison the standard 1400 router bushing setup, it's a lesson in futility.

Better to use a 1010, it's smaller and easier to handle with NO bushing movement. Honestly, after all these years, I hear Sedge continue to drone on about "at Festool we hear what you want and we respond". His latest proclamation within the last few weeks revolves around  the LED lighting for the 1010.

I cannot believe that there are more incoming requests for LED lighting for a 1010 than there are requests to fix the 1400/2200 router bushing issues. I can give the 2200 a pass because most folks probably use it in a router table but the 1400 is really designed to be a hand held unit first.

 
Cheese said:
What am I missing...why would anyone even try to use a Festool 1400 with a PC bushing to produce nice clean dovetails? If you want nice tight joints that combination is just plain goofy. Unless you completely jettison the standard 1400 router bushing setup, it's a lesson in futility.

Better to use a 1010, it's smaller and easier to handle with NO bushing movement. Honestly, after all these years, I hear Sedge continue to drone on about "at Festool we hear what you want and we respond". His latest proclamation within the last few weeks revolves around the LED lighting for the 1010.

I cannot believe that there are more incoming requests for LED lighting for a 1010 than there are requests to fix the 1400/2200 router bushing issues. I can give the 2200 a pass because most folks probably use it in a router table but the 1400 is really designed to be a hand held unit first.

My Leigh D4R kit comes with four 1/2-inch shank router bits, some of which will be used on an upcoming project. I'm not sure I can squeeze these into the OF 1010 arbor. I think my options are to wait for Festool to fix the problem with the OF 1400/2200 (without holding my breath), buy another router (still looking), or give the base plate by @montyss a try. I am not opposed to buying another router, but I have not been able to find a fixed base router that will accept cutters with a 1/2-inch shank, has an adjustable bushing adapter, has a wide base to span the alignment fingers and the VRS peak, and has micro adjustment for the cutting depth.

@PaulMarcel , montyss's thicker plate replaces the plate on the OF 1400; however, it attaches with two user-provided M6 machine screws recessed into the plate instead of the five smaller countersunk screws. The OF 1400 is already drilled and tapped for M6. The PC-style bushing is a snug fit in the plate and the adjustment to center the bushing to the arbor is possible because of the slightly oversized M6 holes. The five smaller holes are included in the modified plate just in case the bushing perfectly aligns with the arbor.
 
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