Lets see what YOU would charge to make this unit.......

[Chowman]

This discussion reminds me of every time I struggled to price a wedding (used to shoot 25-35 each year on the side). I always felt like I couldn't possibly charge as much as a "full time pro" even though my work was better than some. I would say something like, "I'll help him out." or "I can give you this or that for your budget." But the plain fact of it was that I used my valuable weekends to put a modest amount of "spending money" in my pocket. Did I cover my expenses? Did I account for wear and tear on the gear? Earlier posts have detailed many more items that a business professional needs to take into account.

Bottom line: I didn't make a lot of money and started to resent being out of the house and giving away my time from the family and dogs. At the very end of my shooting days after I had decided that I had enough and would do no more, two work acquaintances came to me (oddly, within one week) and insisted only I could shoot their child's wedding. I asked for and received more than I ever had before! Lesson learned way too late.

If I could have a mulligan, I'd charge for my services as much as others were willing to pay. You'll only know the upper limit when people refuse to pay what you ask.  Do as others here have suggested. Value your time. Value what else you may be missing out on while you toil away in the shop. And never ever be bashful to ask for fair compensation for your skills as a craftsman over and above expenses.

 

[-woodsman-]

Wayne please post some pics of the new project and maybe your shop as well.  How long does one of your renderings take?  If you hadn't said it was one I would have thought it was real. 

Hi Woodsman,

When im done with the installation i will post pics of progress and the final product in a new thread. That rendering took about 6 hours to do.

Thats a lot of hard work there Wayne.  I cant tell wich is better your renderings or your woodworking. No really I cant.  [scratch chin]
I'm looking forward to seeing more of your work.

 

[fshanno]

Hi Wayne, just curious what price did you settle on?

I had already giving a quote before opening this thread, I charged R18 800.00. I think thats about $2700 US.

$2700 seems low.  But hey, you got to do what you got to do.  And looking on the bright side, hobbyists pay to get to do what you get paid to do.  I've never met a serious hobbyist that didn't love his hobby more than his profession.  My doctor is building a boat.  Medicine is okay but you get him taking about the boat?  He lights up like a Christmas tree.  He'll go on and on and totally screw up his schedule.

Did you notice that the bottom course of bricks in your rendering is about 3/4" tall?  A bricklayer probably wouldn't do that.  Can you adjust the XY of a material map on an object with your software?  And by the way, what is your software? VIZ?

 

[waynelang2001]

Hi Wayne, just curious what price did you settle on?

I had already giving a quote before opening this thread, I charged R18 800.00. I think thats about $2700 US.

$2700 seems low.  But hey, you got to do what you got to do.  And looking on the bright side, hobbyists pay to get to do what you get paid to do.  I've never met a serious hobbyist that didn't love his hobby more than his profession.  My doctor is building a boat.  Medicine is okay but you get him taking about the boat?  He lights up like a Christmas tree.  He'll go on and on and totally screw up his schedule.

Did you notice that the bottom course of bricks in your rendering is about 3/4" tall?  A bricklayer probably wouldn't do that.  Can you adjust the XY of a material map on an object with your software?  And by the way, what is your software? VIZ?

This is the last job im doing with my old pricing so it is a bit low, i did notice the bricks but its a bit to late to fix it once the rendering is finished, no point in redoing it just for the bricks. At least its there actual bricks from there house, i took a picture of a small section and mapped it out in photoshop. For all my modeling and renderings i use 3ds max.

 

[nickao]

Well the guys here stating that they would not charge as much as they can are making a big mistake. I don't bid and then reduce the price thinking I will get a referral. I get referrals on the prices I charge now, no need to discount for that. Referrals have nothing to do with what a client pays initially. It has to do with the quality of the work and if there are any problems and how those problems are handled during the job. If the client agrees to pay they are happy with the price before the job starts. Referrals depend on keeping the client happy through the process and end result.

It seems people are confusing "getting as much as humanly possible" as ripping someone off. That is your self confidence and lack of belief in  your own work or items. If you are charging more than you think your stuff is worth fine, I don't charge more than I think my work is worth, actually less, but I charge as much as I can get. If you do not lose 50% of the work when you are bidding than you are charging to little. I am one person and can not handle all that work so I only want the top 50%.

All I can say is I know one company that charges as much as humanly possible, they have great referrals and the clients are happy. And the name of that company is FESTOOL!

 

[jujigatame]

I own a catering business... Pig Roasts mostly.

I have priced myself right in the sweet spot where 50% of people think I am WAY overpriced and the other 50% think my prices are either fair or even a bargain.

I also don't discount unless it is for repeat customers, or the military.

Don't be afraid to charge more, you can always come down on your price, but you can never go up.

 

[woodguy7]

Mmmm, pig roast  [cool]

I'm off for a bacon sandwich

 

[fshanno]

All I can say is I know one company that charges as much as humanly possible, they have great referrals and the clients are happy. And the name of that company is FESTOOL!

HELLO! 

Game over.  I think you proved your point.  Yes indeed, as much as humanly possible, and usually worth it.

 

[Mr. Jeff Smith]

All I can say is I know one company that charges as much as humanly possible, they have great referrals and the clients are happy. And the name of that company is FESTOOL!

HELLO! 

Game over.  I think you proved your point.  Yes indeed, as much as humanly possible, and usually worth it.

I would have payed more for my TS55.  The exception that proves the rule? I don't think so.

 

[Dave Ronyak]

Wayne,

I am not a pro woodworker.  I am a ?retired? corporate type (engineer and IP attorney/manager) and an amateur woodworker/home refurbisher/remodeler for ~40 years.

I think you priced your project too low.  Much good advice on pricing and successfully running a woodworking based business has been given by many others above.  One aspect of your project and skills I did not note being discussed above is your ability to design and model a project.  I think your model/computer generated mockup is excellent.  That, too, is worth something to a client.  Architects in USA typically charge at least 10% of the cost of the project.  You should factor your design creativity and time into your pricing as well as the time and materials, etc. needed to build and install the project.

Dave R.

 

[Bill Barker]

Just a bit of a different approach I have used a simple formula for estimating for years. For an average project I take 3.5 times material including hardware, fasteners, finish and waste
If the detail increases then the multiplier moves up to 4.
Over 30 years this has yielded a good living.
Cheers
Bill

 

[Eli]

Just a bit of a different approach I have used a simple formula for estimating for years. For an average project I take 3.5 times material including hardware, fasteners, finish and waste
If the detail increases then the multiplier moves up to 4.
Over 30 years this has yielded a good living.
Cheers
Bill

That's interesting Bill. I don't think I've ever seen quite that approach, but it's smart if it gives you a good profit margin and I love that it's tied to material cost fluctuations. Any idea what your average profit with that method is?

 

[Bill Barker]

Eli we where happy to have a 15 to 18% after wages and overhead etc.
It has worked well
Cheers
Bill

 

[upscale]

25.00 may sound like a lot and may be fine if you are an employee where taxes are taken out. Remember that 25.00 cost the employer at least 45.00 so 45.00 is what the single woodworking businessman needs to charge just to get the 25.00 an hour.

That reminds me of my first carpentry job as an apprentice. The guy I was working for charged the client double the hourly rate I he was paying me and that was aside from the hourly rate he was charging for his own work. The reason I know this is that my boss couldn't figure out the hourly rate for the client and asked me to do it for him. It astounded me that his math skills were so poor, but it did impress on me the idea that the cost for employees had their own associated overhead costs ~ despite that fact that to this day, I still believe in that particular instance, the customer was being gouged.

 

[woodguy7]

The un written rule here is if you pay an employee 10, then you charge them out at 20.  It is the minimum you need to charge once all the relevant expense's have been deducted.

Woodguy.

 

[gbruzze1]

Based on your figures of $1,100 for material and 12 days of labor, assuming 8 hour days, I would charge $5,900.  But then for something that beautiful, I would probably add on another 10% based on the fact that its a totally custom unit, they can not buy anything like that.  And if I had the references on this type of work and was regarded as doing work better then the others around, I might even bump it up a little more.  I mean, if your reputation speaks for itself, then the customers will be willing to pay a premium for your work, considering you are viewed as head and shoulders above the competition.  But then again other factors would play in for me.  With the economy, I have been trimming my prices a little bit just to keep busy and have some money coming in.  But this project you got just screams premium work, therefore it demands a premium price.  Good luck and by the way amazing rendition, I thought it was the completed project.