MFT Top Replacement

[JayStPeter]

My high-end dishwasher uses a spring attached to a piece of string with plastic molded ends for door tension.  I replaced the strings and pulleys for the third time last week and apparently jostled it enough to cause the water connection to start leaking.  Well, it leaked down into my shop and, more specifically, directly onto my MFT top.  I can only guess that it had been leaking for about 4 days by the time I saw it.  My MFT 1080 top, my router jig, and a couple pieces of scrap are in bad shape.  Otherwise, the mostly Al MFT is OK.  There were a couple screwdrivers on it that were surface rusted and the angle unit will need to be cleaned up a little, but I suspect apart from the top there will be no noticeable damage to the MFT.  None of the other attachments were on it at the time.  Overall, I'm lucky that's all the damage to the shop other than some ceiling drywall that will take me a few hours (no money) to fix.
I've been planning for a while to make a large MFT/cutting/assembly table type thing and just keep the MFT around as a portable device.  Even without a specific solution, my MFT is often folded in the corner and my assembly table is my cutting table.  So, I'm hesitant to spend $100 for another top.  Has anyone made their own.  I could use the current top as a template as there is a piece of MDF sitting in my rack.  Right now the top is drying out and starting to look like it might be good enough to at least use as a template (assuming I clamp/screw the potato chip down to the new top).

 

[Jesse Cloud]

Hey Jay,
Bummer about your MFT top.  I haven't made one myself, but as usual that doesn't stop me from blabbing on...

First of all, Festool does make a 20mm router bit - so there's half the problem solved.

If your old top is warped, you might want to cut out three rows or columns that are pretty flat and use that for a template.  After you get the first three rows or columns done, you can shift it over one and put some 20 pvc in the holes you just cut to ensure alignment.

Lastly, if part of your old top is in good shape, save it.  I've been thinking for a while that it would make great jig material.

 

[Notorious T.O.D.]

Here is a way to duplicate it with a plunge router and top bearing router bit...



Best,
Todd

 

[honeydoman]

just buy another top.  isn't your time worth more than taking the time to drill out all those freeking holes, cutting the mdf, going to hd to buy mdf etc. 

that is my recommendations.

 

[woodshopdemos]

If you do use a 20mm router bit, do NOT plunge with it. To plunge and use a bearing, you need to use a smaller diameter bit - 1/2" I would suggest. Tat way you c an start the router an d plunge already in the hole. If you used a 20mm bit, the hole side and placed the router in the hole and t hen started the router, you willl find yourself in orbit.

 

[nickao]

Yes that's right you do not need have a 20mm bit at all if you are using a top as the template. Using a 20mm bit wold be used with another technique not using the original top as a guide.

 

[JeromeM]

If you do use a 20mm router bit, do NOT plunge with it. To plunge and use a bearing, you need to use a smaller diameter bit - 1/2" I would suggest. Tat way you c an start the router an d plunge already in the hole. If you used a 20mm bit, the hole side and placed the router in the hole and t hen started the router, you willl find yourself in orbit.

All of the advice, specialy the using a top bearing bit is good as you already have an exact pattern to work from.

Yes that's right you do not need have a 20mm bit at all if you are using a top as the template. Using a 20mm bit wold be used with another technique not using the original top as a guide.

I however do not and am going to make a much larger top (about 1x1.6m) so what I will do is.
1) Using the LR-32 system and a 30mm hinge bit make a hardboard template.
2) Using the 30mm copy ring and either a 20mm hinge bit or a 3/4" bit create the top.

This top is going to be part of a torsion box and will on my workbench.

 

[nickao]

Sounds like a nice project!

I did my two big tables the cheap and easy way, no torsion box. I flip the tops once in a while and I can put a 6 ft straight edge on the table and it is close enough to flat for all my work. I use stock tops and parts and it took me about 3 hours to set up both initially.

These pictures were before I swapped the legs with 4x4 and bracing and set my rolling carts underneath for storage.

Look at these tables. FLIMSY. 3 tops wide, only stock legs at the corners(I had to cut off the legs stock cross bracing) and nothing under the MDF and you know what, no problems with the tops staying flat. So I think that flatness issue is way overblown.

Yes it was flimsy as heck that way, but I used them like that for at least 5 or 6 months and the tables stayed flat enough for any work. And the aluminum extrusions did not sag in the center as I feared they would, stayed stick straight and flat!

In the corners I had a delta disc sander , cast iron and heavy and a Jet spindle sander cast, iron and heavy in the opposite corner. Still, because I set the sanders in the corners very little sag, if any!

My shop is much cleaner and tighter now, but these pictures were just to show that I do not think the sagging issue is an issue with a regular size table at all.

A permanent solution maybe not, but it does help prove a point about the MFT tops staying flat, at least these 6 tops in my particular shop did.

 

[Chris Hughes]

        When I extended my table I made a new top.  One of the short comings of the MFT is its over all weight when the larger tables go to the field.  when I built the new top I replaced my with 12ply birch which is much lighter. 
        All that being said, if you have access to Festool's line boring set-up I believe the spacing pattern on the holes is 96mm.  So, if you plunge every third detent you'll have it.  It's been two years since I cut the top so it might be every forth but that would be easy enough to check.  I used my of 1010 and what ever the appropriate sized router bit provided by Festool.                                                              C Hughes

 

[Woodenewe]

If we were to make a 4 by 8 foot "MFT" top, what would be the spacing on some sort of support structure to keep 3/4 inch thick MDF top from sagging? I initially though a 18 by 18 inch grid would work, but that looks like a bit of overkill. Would 24 by 24 inch grid would be sufficient?  

By taking a 1080 MFT, adding the two added long rails, then splicing the former short side rails to the new long rails (with top and side joiners), the new MFT frame comes out at 109 11/16 long by 48 5/16 wide, and the MFT top to fit in the frame is 107 5/16 by 45 15/16.  I bought a 49 by 108 sheet of MDF for the top and will cut it to fir into the Festool frame.

The Festool frame will be supported 10 inches above the sub-frame with all-thread struts on the 18 by 18, or 24 by 24 inch matrix to allow access for clamps.  All that will be bolted to a surplus hydraulic lift table for support.

Reading the achieves for Jumbo MFT's has been interesting, but has not addressed the question on the needs for long term support for 3/4 inch MDF.  Your comments are appreciated...

 

[woodshopdemos]

Nick,
  I love your hose arrangement. Where did you get the shutoffs for the smaller hose. Are they on a remote? Do you lose any efficiency with a Y and cut-offs?

 

[JeromeM]

Hi Nick

If your

Sounds like a nice project!

Was refering to my

I however do not and am going to make a much larger top (about 1x1.6m) so what I will do is.
1) Using the LR-32 system and a 30mm hinge bit make a hardboard template.
2) Using the 30mm copy ring and either a 20mm hinge bit or a 3/4" bit create the top.

This top is going to be part of a torsion box and will on my workbench.

Then I can post the drawings and Photos of the base that has already been finished.

If any one is intrested let me know.

I do have the problem that my workshop is about 4,800 Km and 6 weeks away so I can only draw up the plans for now.

 

[vteknical]

It's time to get rid of that Bosch Dishwasher and get something better :

 

[nickao]

Hi Nick

If your

Sounds like a nice project!

Was refering to my

I however do not and am going to make a much larger top (about 1x1.6m) so what I will do is.
1) Using the LR-32 system and a 30mm hinge bit make a hardboard template.
2) Using the 30mm copy ring and either a 20mm hinge bit or a 3/4" bit create the top.

This top is going to be part of a torsion box and will on my workbench.

Then I can post the drawings and Photos of the base that has already been finished.

If any one is intrested let me know.

I do have the problem that my workshop is about 4,800 Km and 6 weeks away so I can only draw up the plans for now.

Sure please post it up its always nice to see peoples different setups and plans.

 

[JeromeM]

Sure please post it up its always nice to see peoples different setups and plans.

Here you go then

The starting point for the top is at
http://www.meekings.net/Workbench-Plan/Workbench_Summer_2007/index.html
With the full story

or

The base being put together now I know that it all fits.

and

The base, inverted, being tested to see that it all fits.
(Thanks to mum in-law for lending the living-room)

Here is the scale drawing of the base with sizes

And side and end views

Now at 69cm the bench is clearly too short. Also I need to move it out of the house in the day time when there is dusty work to do. But as this is rural Thailand it must come in at night.
so this means that this may be the way to go

the pdf is athttp://www.meekings.net/Workbench-Plan/mobile base.pdf

The bench must be disassembled when I have to go back to work. This means I need to reduce the weight as much as I can so have large cutouts where I can, so here is the bottom of the torsion box
FWIW the cross and circle are registration aids.

Here are the dividers/torsion box centers

And the top

The work bench base

The work bench base torsion box bottom and dividers

The top and dividers

As you can see the clamping may be a little restricted in some directions.

Lastly for the moment here are the sizes

The bench is going to have 2 tool storage cabinets in the base at the moment 1 is partly finished. it will have 1 deep draw 3 very shallow draws and a pulout dust tray on top

Here are a 3 photos (with a few black and green toys )

Note there is no need for glass in the windows!! But every need for anti theft bars.

Note the overhead wood storage (to avoid power post beetle and termites)

The expanded polystyrene makes a good, cheep cutting surface

Links to all the pdf files are available {send me a PM if you want them} if any one needs the highest quality printouts of the plans. they are also on a 10 to 1 scale so any sizes I have missed can be directly checked.

 

[JayStPeter]

I'll probably use the method demo'ed in the video.  Possibly as soon as this afternoon.  Cost will be however long it takes since I have a few MDF scraps large enough to make a new top.  It looks like the old top should be good enough to be a template.

 

[JayStPeter]

The deed is done.  Took me about 2 hrs, but I'm sure I could do it in less time if I was to do it again.  I didn't have a sharp 1/2" x 1" top bearing bit, so I used a dull one to punch the hole and rough it out.  That one left a little lip, so I flipped the whole thing over and came back with a bottom bearing bit and made it flush.  The right bit in the first place and it would've gone much faster.  But, if I did it again I'd be tempted to drill the hole out with something like a 5/8" bit and still use the bottom guided bit to flush it.  I started off using my 1/2"x3/4" top bearing bit and it took a little more effort with that than the bottom guided bit.  But, that might have been because of the wavy surface on the recently soaked top.
Thanks for the help everyone.

Jay

 

[nickao]

JeromeM that looks rock solid, nice work!

 

[JeromeM]

JeromeM that looks rock solid, nice work!

Thanks I hope it will be.

There are going to be some other features taken from other tables. Then modified for this one. They will include in no special order.
-) Removable side and end extensions bringing the supported area up to about 1600mm x 2600mm for cutting large sheet goods.
-) The extensions will be to the same plan as the main table and will be usable as small independent assembly tables/surfaces or oufeed tables.
-) A dismountable fence on one long edge with rail cutouts and movable length stops. With raisable stops on the other long side directly opposite the cutouts set for exact 900 cuts

FWIW You have a namesake on UKworkshop who is very inventive. He has some brilliant ideas for making inexpensive jigs and tools. I will be using some of them.
Here is an example of a Folding adjustable height table
http://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=19583
and I think you may need to register for image access so here are 2 pics. from that thread

and

 

[Dave Ronyak]

Jay, congratulations on progress on your MFT "recovery project."

Nick, I very much like that adjustable height table, and his clever yet simple height adjustment mechanism.  I'd probably increase the dimensions of the stretchers to increase resistance to racking loads (pushing on an end of the table).  If a fine adjustment mechanism is not needed, a chain could be used instead.  The bottom stretcher in that variation would engage a chain link in a metal-reinforced notch.

Dave R.