mastercabman
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There's only one thing that we need to solve this problem; "A cordless extension cord"!!! [laughing] [laughing] [laughing]
New Festool jigsaw model?
- Thread starter Miquel
- Start date
Cords are a hassle, but they deliver harnessable power to reasonably compact tools - that's the only reason I put up with them.
And they aren't universally beneficial either - I own a corded chainsaw ( very reputable brand, mind you - it's a Stihl, they don't come any better ), and it s*cks big time. The balance is off, it's a lot less easy to handle and even less powerful then my nice tophandle pruning saw....
I wouldn't dream of taking it up into a tree canopy, the cord would weigh it down severely and besides: there are more than enough hazards to keep me occupied without adding the risk of electrocution to it, thank you! And even my Silky handsaw almost outperforms it anyway...
I've used quite a few cordless tools, and they sure have their place. I've used the first Bosch cordless hammerdrill inside of a computer room, where they wouldn't risk contaminating the grid for fear of the massive UPS kicking in and starting the 1600 HP Dieselgenerator. In fact that was a very good tool, and that must have been almost 20 years ago.....
I've used a ( cordless! ) welding generator inside a fully RF shielded Faraday's cage to reposition mounting points for a hypercubed workstation farm that served some spooky intelligence use - couldn't have done that with a corded welder as well......
I worked on a farm as well, and although 3 phase power was available in a couple of spots and single phase outlets were abundant - the ability to use a powertool out in the meadow fixing a fence is a BIG plus.... lagbolts and cordless impacts are e great combo for anyone creating fences. ( A big John Deere with a frontloader to pull out the old posts and push in the new ones helps a lot too - but hey, even that is a cordless tool.... )
Bottom line: cordless tools have their use, and their usability is spreading like an inkspot. Don't fight it, enjoy it !
It all boils down to harnessing power - the grid is just one way of distributing it. Fuel is another one, and I think perhaps fuel cells may find their way into powertools as well.
I definitely see your point Brice, but I don't think the development effort "spared" from NOT developing cordless technology would have benefited quality: the industry already knows how to develop quality tools, and doesn't really seem very interested, save a few exceptions.
Most manufacturers seem more interested in making their tools cheaper, lighter and using materials and construction methods that only just barely meet the defined specifications - a lot of money and effort is put into finite element analysis modeling to prevent tools to have any quality headroom.... because that costs in mass-production.
In the NEAR future, I don't see much use for cordless tools that produce dust in any amount. If you need dustcollection anyway, why bother loosing the cord? So cordless powersanders may not be your best investment plan for the moment.
But how about sawing? The thinner the kerf, the less dust AND the less power needed... so a cordless rail-compatible plungesaw sporting a superstiff blade with a nice clean 1/64" kerf and a neat high-tech nano-particle non-drag coating may well be your next most wanted Festool.....
Regards,
Job
And they aren't universally beneficial either - I own a corded chainsaw ( very reputable brand, mind you - it's a Stihl, they don't come any better ), and it s*cks big time. The balance is off, it's a lot less easy to handle and even less powerful then my nice tophandle pruning saw....
I wouldn't dream of taking it up into a tree canopy, the cord would weigh it down severely and besides: there are more than enough hazards to keep me occupied without adding the risk of electrocution to it, thank you! And even my Silky handsaw almost outperforms it anyway...
I've used quite a few cordless tools, and they sure have their place. I've used the first Bosch cordless hammerdrill inside of a computer room, where they wouldn't risk contaminating the grid for fear of the massive UPS kicking in and starting the 1600 HP Dieselgenerator. In fact that was a very good tool, and that must have been almost 20 years ago.....
I've used a ( cordless! ) welding generator inside a fully RF shielded Faraday's cage to reposition mounting points for a hypercubed workstation farm that served some spooky intelligence use - couldn't have done that with a corded welder as well......
I worked on a farm as well, and although 3 phase power was available in a couple of spots and single phase outlets were abundant - the ability to use a powertool out in the meadow fixing a fence is a BIG plus.... lagbolts and cordless impacts are e great combo for anyone creating fences. ( A big John Deere with a frontloader to pull out the old posts and push in the new ones helps a lot too - but hey, even that is a cordless tool.... )
Bottom line: cordless tools have their use, and their usability is spreading like an inkspot. Don't fight it, enjoy it !
It all boils down to harnessing power - the grid is just one way of distributing it. Fuel is another one, and I think perhaps fuel cells may find their way into powertools as well.
I definitely see your point Brice, but I don't think the development effort "spared" from NOT developing cordless technology would have benefited quality: the industry already knows how to develop quality tools, and doesn't really seem very interested, save a few exceptions.
Most manufacturers seem more interested in making their tools cheaper, lighter and using materials and construction methods that only just barely meet the defined specifications - a lot of money and effort is put into finite element analysis modeling to prevent tools to have any quality headroom.... because that costs in mass-production.
In the NEAR future, I don't see much use for cordless tools that produce dust in any amount. If you need dustcollection anyway, why bother loosing the cord? So cordless powersanders may not be your best investment plan for the moment.
But how about sawing? The thinner the kerf, the less dust AND the less power needed... so a cordless rail-compatible plungesaw sporting a superstiff blade with a nice clean 1/64" kerf and a neat high-tech nano-particle non-drag coating may well be your next most wanted Festool.....
Regards,
Job
bonesbr549
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mastercabman said:
I'll go one better than that, Wireless Power!!!!!!!!!!! [big grin] Buy a Cisco wireless power hub plug it in and magic! Of course you will need to insulate your shower from radio waves so you don't get electricuted!
This has turned into a most interesting post, and a bit of an eye opener for me. The concern I first wrote about is that it appears to me that those companies who have worked diligently to develop cordless tools have all but abandoned further development of their corded line.
There are aspects of the cordless saws discussed in this forum that I had not considered.
Oh, and Job, try the Husqvarna electric chain saw. I've had one for about 15 years. I cut my firewood to 4 foot lengths in the woods, then buck it up to stove length in a little wood lot by my barn. Using the electric (corded) Husky chain saw makes this job very efficient and pleasant. In most tools Husky compared to Stihl, Stihl will come out on top, but the Husky electric chain saw is all the things that you said the Stihl was not. I'll agree with you though, I'm not dragging a cord up a tree with me. [eek] But, in that case, I'll take 2 cycle petrol over Lithium Ion any day of the week. [big grin]
There are aspects of the cordless saws discussed in this forum that I had not considered.
Oh, and Job, try the Husqvarna electric chain saw. I've had one for about 15 years. I cut my firewood to 4 foot lengths in the woods, then buck it up to stove length in a little wood lot by my barn. Using the electric (corded) Husky chain saw makes this job very efficient and pleasant. In most tools Husky compared to Stihl, Stihl will come out on top, but the Husky electric chain saw is all the things that you said the Stihl was not. I'll agree with you though, I'm not dragging a cord up a tree with me. [eek] But, in that case, I'll take 2 cycle petrol over Lithium Ion any day of the week. [big grin]
Jeff,
I think you're right: I should have bought a Husky - a friend of mine owned one, she used it to cut logs to manageable size to inoculate them with Shii-take spawn. That saw was the reason I ever even considered an electric chainsaw, but a nice offer came up for a Stihl, and I reckoned it would be comparable at least.
I'm actually not very faithful to brands as it is, just faithful to quality. My go-to saw is a new generation Husky 346XP, and when the going gets to tough for that one, my Stihl MS460 gets going.... my tophandle pruner is a Sachs-Dolmar PS-3410 TH, not because it's the best out there, but because it FEELS right. And if all else fails, my Silky Sugoi won't - just stear clear of the rope [scared]......
All power souces have their use. Up in the tree, I prefer 2-stroke or elbow grease. Out in the field, I prefer diesel or a decent cordless battery technology. In the shop, I prefer grid electricity. To run my smithy or melting furnace, I prefer propane....
I could go on, but I guess you all got the point by now.
Regards,
Job
I think you're right: I should have bought a Husky - a friend of mine owned one, she used it to cut logs to manageable size to inoculate them with Shii-take spawn. That saw was the reason I ever even considered an electric chainsaw, but a nice offer came up for a Stihl, and I reckoned it would be comparable at least.
I'm actually not very faithful to brands as it is, just faithful to quality. My go-to saw is a new generation Husky 346XP, and when the going gets to tough for that one, my Stihl MS460 gets going.... my tophandle pruner is a Sachs-Dolmar PS-3410 TH, not because it's the best out there, but because it FEELS right. And if all else fails, my Silky Sugoi won't - just stear clear of the rope [scared]......
All power souces have their use. Up in the tree, I prefer 2-stroke or elbow grease. Out in the field, I prefer diesel or a decent cordless battery technology. In the shop, I prefer grid electricity. To run my smithy or melting furnace, I prefer propane....
I could go on, but I guess you all got the point by now.
Regards,
Job
jvsteenb said:
Oooh, I'm jealous. I really want a one handed saw for both pruning and the limbing of harvested trees. Dolmar's are beautiful saws, but hard to find in the U.S. -- not impossible, just hard. I keep trying to work a pruning saw into the budget, but other things keep getting in the way, like Festools and groceries. [blink]
If this thread wasn't considered hijacked before, it certainly is now. [big grin]
Besides cordless drills, its mains power all the way for me. Had cordless 18v makita rip saw & it was gutless. Just when you are set up for a tricky cut, the battery dies half way through [crying] Besides, I try to plug my cleantex into everything i do now so kinda defeats the point of cordless. But with the way battery technology is going, you never know. Just my 2 cents worth.
Woodguy
Woodguy
I saw a review of the consumer electronics show in Las Vegas where they were touting a wireless powered TV. Who said Tesla wasn't ahead of his time. Wouldn't that be great? A wireless transmitter in the corner of your shop running all of your tools. Now a hoseless DC would be even cooler.
jonny round boy
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greg mann said:
Knowing the half-arsed way some companies think, it may well be wirelessly powered, but it'll still have a standard aerial socket.... [eek] [big grin]
But I agree with the consensus - this has turned out to be a very interesting thread!
harry_ said:
My sentiments exactly. To be fair, I have the Bosch 1587evs and the blade change is a bit of a PITA. However, the 18v jigsaw is a very fine tool: low vibration, good blade change and guides, excellent run time, and plenty of power. I only with there was a conversion for Bosch's new Litheon batteries.
You know, the more I think about it, a cordless jigsaw would make a lot of sense. Bear with me. I have a C12 which I love but I sure wouldn't mind having a T15. My wife has been making noise about using a jigsaw for some of her craft work and a really nice Festool cordless would be just the ticket. Assuming interchangeable batteries (systems, eh?) and I have just enough reason to pull the trigger for both. ;D
< hijack mode>
Jeff,
That may be a lot easier then you might think. Makita have acquired Dolmar, and they've launched a good deal of the Dolmar line-up as Makita's as well.
The Makita DCS3410TH is essentially the same saw, it's just that the colour isn't as pretty [wink]. There's also a smaller tophandle with a carver blade, but the balance is off for me, whilst the 3410 does OK with a carver blade - YMMV.
I must however strongly advise AGAINST limbing with a tophandle - limbing felled trees is about the most error-prone action to be performed with a chainsaw. Most accidents actually happen during limbing..... OTOH, the 346XP is about as perfect as it gets for this action - mount a 12" narrow-kerf blade and with a low-kickback chain and have a go... the grin will wear off eventually. Always have the tree between yourself and the action, and whenever possible, let the saw slide over the trunk - kinda like a chainsaw Gilette..... The pretty colours will wear off fast, but it's safe and very fast once you get the hang of it. My previous limbing saw was quite scarred and the muffler was all but completely worn through, but I never had an accident while limbing. Using a tophandle for limbing is not a very safe prospect - essentially using a tophandle is not extremely safe regardless of what you're doing with it. In most parts of Western Europe, they're only available for sale to professional arborists.... they're hard to beat for rope-work though, and I sure wouldn't want to be without mine!
To get back on topic: I'd love to try a cordless Festool jigsaw - if the technology is on par with that in my T15+3, I'm pretty sure I'd be interested.
Regards,
Job
Job,
Thanks for the comments. I'll take your advice regarding limbing with a top handle chain saw. I'll look into my third saw being a smaller two handed saw with a thin kerf short bar. Even before that, I'll heed your advise to work on the opposite side of the tree, which I will confess, I don't always do now. This winter's heating wood came from two big oaks that came down in May during a wind storm. Limbing trees that came down with more than normal force was a nerve wracking experience, to say the least.
I just know that my trusty 13 year old Husky 55 gets heavy after a few hours. I pick up a new saw at the shop, and it just amazes me the difference. When I bought mine, it was one of the lightest quality saws on the market. Now it feels like a barbell compared to saws of equal power and quality.
I had heard about the Makita/Dolmar thing, but as far as I have seen, only a couple of models are widely available in the U.S.
Stihl has their one handed saw labeled "professional arborist use only", but it is in every saw shop in the country on the same shelf with the consumer saws. I don't believe any saw shop would refuse to sell one to anybody that walked in.
[big grin]
Michael Kellough
Member
I keep an older Makita 18v cordless jigsaw nearby. It's great for quickly rough cutting long boards down to size and removing waste so the router won't have to work so hard, etc. Because it's so fast and gentle I don't have to clamp the board down as would be needed if doing the same work with a hand tool.
Joe Jensen
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I have a Bosch barrel grip with dust collection and the front plastic guard gets in the way on the Bosch too. I cut a notch in the guard about 1/4" wide and 1/2" long in line with the blade (basically in the center of the front of the guard starting at the bottom. I can now see the blade and IMHO the dust collection is a bit better as the airflow is a bit better. I would really like a like in there though. A light on the Festool would get me to switch.
Prices for both 300 Jigsaw models have decreased in Germany recently
I've made an observation about the Jigsaw prices in Germany that would add to the new jigsaw model roumor.
Both 300 models with Systainer were reduced by 34.00 Euros (without VAT) from 273.00 EUR to 239.00 EUR from the original 2009 price list. That's nearly a US$ 50.00 or 13 % price drop and especially for Festool quite significant.
Although the PS 200 price was increased to 245.00 from 240.00 EUR.
I don't know when this price change happened, but it must have been recently. This could mean Festool is trying to empty their stock and the 300 could be replaced soon.
I've made an observation about the Jigsaw prices in Germany that would add to the new jigsaw model roumor.
Both 300 models with Systainer were reduced by 34.00 Euros (without VAT) from 273.00 EUR to 239.00 EUR from the original 2009 price list. That's nearly a US$ 50.00 or 13 % price drop and especially for Festool quite significant.
Although the PS 200 price was increased to 245.00 from 240.00 EUR.
I don't know when this price change happened, but it must have been recently. This could mean Festool is trying to empty their stock and the 300 could be replaced soon.
james burns
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been a member on here for a while but not posted before i was speaking to a rep in UK the other day and he told me about the cordless jigsaw thought i was one of the first to know i was going to let you all know but then i saw this you guys are quick think Brice and others have a vallied point Ive got battery stuff and corded the thing is they both have a place but circular saws suck got a 28 volt Milwaukee one cut on a 8 x 4 sheet rip cut and the battery is done
AlexThePalex
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james burns said:
That's what I think. I don't think battery tools are a replacement for either corded tools or hand tools, they just form a new category on their own, right between the two other categories. Of course they will never be able (or at least not in the near future) to replace corded tools for the heavier jobs, and I don't think anyone really expects that. They just come in handy for a lot of smaller jobs where it's not necessary to bring out the big guns.
richard.selwyn
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From what I can gather from Festool here in France there will be more than one model of cordless jigsaw. As I am lead to believe that they are bringing out 18 volt stuff apparently, one of them is likely to be 18v which should give it enough omph.
Forrest Anderson
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The rumour on one UK woodworking forum is that the new battery powered jigsaw can also be used for carving and will be called the Carvtec!
I have NO idea if this is true or not - have a look at the post and judge for yourselves!
Forrest
I have NO idea if this is true or not - have a look at the post and judge for yourselves!
Forrest
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