NEW Kapex KS88

[joiner1970]

Just got an email from Festool, it shows a new smaller Kapex looks good.

http://www.festool.co.uk/artikel/artikel_weiterleiten.cfm?id=1190

 

[ForumMFG]

I just looked at the differences.  Looks like the same saw blade dia. but they just removed a couple features.  Seems like they are trying to make it a little cheaper to buy, can't think of any other reasons why they would come out with this.

 

[Frank-Jan]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it appears it's not smaller, just missing the "tall miter latch" and the angle divider. Overall, not a bad move to make it less expensive.

/edit: This is what happens if I ignore the red letters saying "while you were typing bladibla.."

 

[Neill]

Just got an email from Festool, it shows a new smaller Kapex looks good.

http://www.festool.co.uk/artikel/artikel_weiterleiten.cfm?id=1190

Joiner,

I wish you had not posted this.  Now the B & M will start about when, how and why not in NA.  I pity Bob Marino and Shane Holland at this point.

:

Neill

 

[joiner1970]

Dont worry guys you will get them in a year or so  ;D ;D ;D

I didnt mean to say it was smaller I meant it looked like a cheaper model it says its aimed at site carpenters.

Looks like they maybe having trouble selling the dearer one so they have come up with this.

 

[ccoln]

If i understand  the KS88 is the KS 120 without:
dual lasers guide
magnetic brake blade
the SM-KS 120 (Miterfast Angle Transfer)

Cordially
Olivier

 

[Frank-Jan]

Olivier, it makes sence they left the angle divider (the sm-ks 120) out since it doesn't have the lasers. But I don't think they would take the brake off, because it still has the MMC rpm control.

 

[ccoln]

But I don't think they would take the brake off, because it still has the MMC rpm control.

Your point of view is coherent.

If you switch the pictures of the KS 120 and kS 88 you can see the warning laser message, the SM-KS 120, the Tall Miter Latch and Tall Miter Release are missing (in red on the picture)

You can see too the Bevel Adjustment Knob is missing (in yellow on the picture).
I just do hypothesis to explan the price difference.

Cordially,
Olivier.

 

[pheadland]

Olivier, it makes sence they left the angle divider (the sm-ks 120) out since it doesn't have the lasers. But I don't think they would take the brake off, because it still has the MMC rpm control.

The comparison table on the Festool UK web site clearly says the brake is not provided on the 88 (which I think is a bad idea - they should never remove safety features).

 

[Barry]

Seems kinda silly to me.  Why put out a "cheaper" version of the kapex rather than lower its price to make it more affordable.  What makes the kapex a pretty kick ars saw is the dual lasers and superior bevel adjustment, without those there are ALLOT cheaper alternatives IMHO.

 

[Frank-Jan]

Oops, I totally missed the comparison chart..., I scrolled past it because I was curious about the mentioned weight-difference, then clicked through to the "see the online catalog" part, where I tried to compare them...

I think it's an odd decision to drop the brake but keep the mmc electronics (since most of the competitor's saws do have brakes, but no rpm dial)

Well, I'm a bit happy that they didn't find a way to make it lighter and  add a precision dial for the mitersetting, this way I remain happy with what I got  

Out of curiousity: is the new makita 10 inch saw already available in the UK?, might be interesting to see the difference in cost.

 

[Tony M]

The new one has 88mm cutting depth, as compared to 120mm cut on the other. 

 

[Mike B]

What makes the kapex a pretty kick ars saw is the dual lasers and superior bevel adjustment, without those there are ALLOT cheaper alternatives IMHO.

I agree. Unless the price is significantly cheaper, this move does not make as much sense as Festool might like it to...

 

[AlexThePalex]

Except for some green knobs missing, I don't see much difference between them. Same size, same cutting depth.

I also don't understand why they call this the more mobile solution while the weight is only 800 grams less then the KS120.

The price is about 200 pounds lower than the KS120 though. My guess is Festool realised the price of the Kapex is too high compared with the competition and therefor made a toned down model for a more competing price.

 

[ccoln]

Thanks Peter for comparison, I don't see it.
To be honest If I must buy a kapex,  I prefer buy a KS 120 for 3 raisons :
price difference is too insufficient
the laser guide,
the angle divider.

Cordially
Olivier

 

[festoller]

Funny the KS 88 is available in the UK first. Nothing on the German site, but it should be on next week or so.

It's without laser, brake and limited to 88 mm. Sales in Germany is supposed to start in the next two weeks or so at 820 EUR + VAT.

P.S. The next Kapex special (coming out next week in Germany) includes a Festool site radio. First a toaster now a radio, what's next?

 

[jonny round boy]

Price on the '88 is GBP644, as opposed to GBP835 for the '120 (prices ex VAT).

That's a 23% reduction, so I wouldn't say it's insufficient.

Having said that, the fine bevel adjustment and the lasers whas what made the KS120 so much better than other SMCS's on the market - other manufacturers have had time to catch up, and to bring out a 'basic' version now seems (to me at least) the wrong thing to do. It's now no better than most other offerings, but still significantly more expensive. I don't think of Festool as being the kind of company to get things wrong, but I think they may have done with this.

I also find it puzzling that they've removed the brake, a major safety feature. Especially since here in the UK at least, regulations are trying to increase the use of brakes on saws, not remove them!

Since the '88 still has the MMC circuitry, I can't see the cost saving of removing the brake, either (other than half a dozen very low cost electronic components).

 

[vajper]

I have never used either versions of the Kapex but Festool state that the 120 has a "magnetic brake" to stop the blade. Can it be that Festool has removed this extra magnetic brake on the 88 and replaced it with a standard electronic brake such as the one found on most power tools with electronic motor regulation?

 

[jonny round boy]

I have never used either versions of the Kapex but Festool state that the 120 has a "magnetic brake" to stop the blade. Can it be that Festool has removed this extra magnetic brake on the 88 and replaced it with a standard electronic brake such as the one found on most power tools with electronic motor regulation?

Any electronic brake of this type is 'magnetic', in that it uses the coils & magnets in the motor to stop it free-wheeling (via the electronics). So 'magnetic' and 'electronic' brakes are simply different descriptions of the same thing. I assume from the website that the KS88 had no brake whatsoever, and will simply run down until friction overcomes the momentum of the blade...

 

[Wim]

I don't know if there are many people on this forum with connections to World War 2, but I think that marketing-wise the number "88" is quite ill chosen. This number refers to the German AA and AT gun, that was one of the most feared by the Allies. Rounding it to 90 would be nicer. A round number like 90 sounds a little better to me at least.
About braking; with some type of electric motors, when you short the magnetic coil, it will produce a counter-force that will brake the rotor. I don't know if it works with the Festool motors, but it is very effective and cheap.