New shop build - pay drywallers or DIY w/planex?

[estesbubba]

I'm a hobby woodworker and having a 30x40 pole barn built for my shop. The walls and ceiling will be insulated and finished with drywall. I'm doing the insulation myself and debating whether to do the drywall. I have never done drywall before but have some friends that have done some DIY drywall (doesn't mean they want to help). There is 1200 sq/ft of ceiling and 1400 sq/ft of walls to do. So here is my dilemma:

1. Bite the bullet and have it all done for around $2500
2. Buy the drywall for around $700 and do it all myself

For #2 I'll have to add screws, tape, mud, etc. If I buy a Planex will it make the sanding part take no time? I think the CT 36 AC is recommended with it. I have a CT 26 and wonder if that would be good enough for a one time job? Buying a Planex + CT 36 AC + drywall will be the same costs as having it installed and that doesn't include screws, tape, mud, etc.

So what would you do?

- Buy a Planex and use the CT 26? Would I just need a lot of bags for the CT 26?

- Buy a Planex and CT 36 AC? Now I have 2 dust extractors and don't know if any benefit over 1.

- Just have the drywall installed.

I don't see a need for the Planex after using it. Would it be easy to sell and at what percentage of price paid? And the same questions about the CT 36 AC? Maybe sell the Planex and keep the CT 36 AC as a reward for doing the drywall myself?

What do you think I should do?

 

[Administrator_JSVN]

Buying $1000+ of tools for a single job is probably not a good idea as much as I'd like for you to buy a Planex.

If you've never taped and mudded before, I'd really recommend getting someone to do it for you.

I would buy the drywall if I were you and hang it yourself to cut down on labor costs. It's not hard to do, even if you've never done it before.

 

[RC]

+1 to Shanes comment. Also painting ceilings is a royal pain.

I did my own walls & ceiling (131sq.m of ceilings - no idea of the wall sq.m - four bedroom house anyway) and it took me weeks to complete learning leveling, wall sanding & ceiling painting along the way.

If I ever need to do it again I'll happily shell out cash to have someone with the proper machinery come in a get it done in no time flat and get on with the project.

 

[sancho57]

Had the same descion to make a couple of years ago. Hire someone or do it myself.
After looking at the cost of tools , materials etc including renting dry wall lifts,
I hired some guy who did it for about the same price and a lot faster then I could of.

Oh when I return from the UK I plan on getting my shop dry walled, and Ill hire it out again

The OP also for got the cost of insulation. add all that in, hire it out dood

 

[fritter63]

I dry walled my first three basement finishes myself. Took me forever.

When I built our current house, I hired it out. 3600 sq ft (main & granny unit) dry walled, mud & taped , textured....in 4 days.

Sometimes, you can't beat a man at his own job....

 

[Stephen B]

[size=11pt]

Given my experiences with our house owner build, follow Shane's advice. That is what we did.

Alternatively, you could line it with  ply/MDF  which is what most do down here. Or even pine lining boards.

 

[BUTTER]

Even with a Planex, you could still spend many weeks on a project that large, and possibly end up with poor results due to the learning curve.

Do it yourself if your time is free and/or you will feel a great deal of pride in DIYing it, otherwise, spend the saved time on something really cool for your home or shop.

 

[Bigchasbroon]

If you really wanted to do it yourself the money would be better spent on mud tools I bought 2 boxes and pump for 150gbp that's where the biggest potential time saving is. Ply on the walls sounds like a good idea too. Very handy to fix to.

But I'm with everyone else if you can afford it get a pro to do it.

 

[Tinker]

Take the advise ALL of above.  A good taper will not need much in the way of sanding.  A great taper will not even need to sand.  It takes a lot of experience to get into the corners and leave them without a lot of waves.  If those waves are real noticeable, you might ruin the tape by time you sand them out.  AND especially, if you do decide to do your own taping, go to an expert for your advise.  DIY'ers have a whole lot of ideas that can often lead you way astray.

i wrote a TRUE story here on FOG afew years ago about a neighbor who, after getting my estimate decided to do his own taping of 3 or 4 rooms he was putting in his basement.  I gave him as much honest advice as I could, told him what to get for both materials and tools.  I also told him that if he got into trouble, i would be glad to advise as to how to handle any problems.  that i would do for free.  If i had to do any of the work, that would be on an hourly rate basis.  (i had been down that road before)

About three or four weeks later, he called me and asked if i could help him straighten out a mess in his basement.  When I looked, i was somewhat horrified, but not really surprised. Every wall and ceiling was covered with gouges and snots. Humps and valleys.  I had never seen such a mess.  Not since either.

I had not only given him advice on how to do and what materials and tools to get, but how to mix the taping cement (it came in bags in those days, not the readymix with excelerators you get today).  I had told him a specific sales man to go to at the supply yard if he needed assistance.  I never asked about who he went to for the assistance i had advised.  As he was picking out a set of tools, a fellow DIY'er spotted him and asked what he was doing.  "Oh you don't need all of those tools. All you need (and that was when he should have run for the exit) is a sponge."  The man took the advice.  The bigger problem was that he not only did closets as he leearned, but even after realizing he was in trouble, went on anddid everything.  walls and ceilings in all of the rooms.  And then he did a second coat thinking the second coat would even out the mistooks of the first application.

By the time i finished with scraping, sanding, patching and two or three added coats, the repair ended up costing three or four times my original estimate.  And that did not include the dust cleanup.  In later years, I was often asked for estimates on taping.  If the owner decided to DIY, i never offered to help straighten out mistooks again until i had observed the errors.  I have some other horror stories about DIY'er taping, but won't get into here.  There are some who have DIY'ed taping who have done exceptionaly well.  To do a really good job takes a lot of experience.  Even more common sense.  AAANNNDDD a lot of time.  
Tinker

 

[Tinker]

I have another shorty on same subject.  I had a good friend who was (now retired) an excellent carpenter.  He could do anything and do very top quality work.  He was, for many years, the very first guy i would recomment for anything from the roughest framing to the very finest on site cabinetry.  He did it all.  When his company was slow and he needed a little extra work, i even had him work with me doing brick and block work.  He did not like stone, but he also helped me on many a concrete floor and flagstone terrace.

After I retired from mason biz, and got into landscaping, i still got calls for an occasional mason job.  My very best customer had me oversee a major renovation to his vacation home.  he wanted me to hire the subs and to check the job daily.  The very first man i called was my carpenter friend.  since he was still in the building biz, i suggested that he line up the entire sub team except the heating contractor.  The owner had wrked with the heating man before.  My friend, and the entire team did a truly terrific job all the way.  Niether I, the owner, not, of more importance, the BI could find any fault.  Not until my friend decided to do the taping.  I was, by that point, and with owner's approval, not doing daily checkups.  I did not show up for several days, maybe once a week, I don't remember now.  When i did show up, the taping was completed.  I took one look and went into conference with my buddy.  He told me his taper had been too busy, so he decided to do that job himself.  Now, as i said, my friend was one fine mechanic.  He did everything with accuracy and pride. 

I could not believe he had done the taping.  It was horrible.  I told my friend to stop with all of the trim work until the taping was rectified.  we argued, but my cient agreed once he was able to come on site.  My carpenter friend did straighten ut the taping.  I never asked if he did it himself, or got his regular taper.  I had my suspicians but did not need to know.  My friend and I are still friends.  i occasionally hire his son for jobs.  My customer is still my customer and he, his family and i are all good friends.  My customer still laments that my carpenter friend is no longer in business.  He still asks him to do small jobs now and then.  We are all happy with each other as friends, contractors and homeowner.  But, "Please insist that Joe does not do the taping."  is the homeowner request.
Tinker

 

[JPF Woodworking]

I couldn't agree more with everyone who has already posted here. My only additional comment is to also get an estimate for a professional to install the insulation as well. I have been in the remodeling business for many years and I have found that you just can't compete with the drywallers AND the insulation installers. Generally speaking the insulation companies purchase their insulation in such large quantities (read: big discount) that they can install it for about what you will end up paying for the material at one of the big-box-stores. And of course they have learned all the tricks of the trade and can do a much better job than someone who doesn't do it everyday. Just my two cents!

 

[Saskataper]

This is what you get when you DIY drywall, and my best guess is that a contractor did this. You can see where I have started repairing it the joints that should only be 12" wide are now over 24" and will end up closer to 36" wide when I am done. I have to charge the same as I would have to tape it right in the first place.
As far as DIY boarding goes, yeah it's easy to put on the wall but doing it right is not, I charge the same regardless if my guys hang it or the home owner does as 95% of the time it will take me twice as long to tape a DIY boarding job.

 

[tjbier]

Hire it out, it will take you longer and you probably will knit pick it  ane still not be happy with it.

Personally, I would hire out the insulating also, especially if  you were going to do batts. By the time you buy all the batts or blown in stuff and rent a blower you could have it done for less, and not have your labor into it. I thought about doing our house but got our insulator from work do our 1450sqft house and 2.5 stall garage for $3500! I'm not touching it for that.

Also personally, I would put galvanized steel, or white pole barn steel on the ceilings,  and plywood the walls and paint them white, or possibly white steel on the walls too. Walls get hit a lot,  and drywall will not stand up to any abuse.
My .02$
Tom

 

[estesbubba]

After reading this I'm going to do it myself - NOT!

I figured it wouldn't be worth the pain to get a tool I would never use again.

 

[RKA]

The only reason to attempt a DIY here is if this is a skill you wish to acquire.  The shop doesn't have to be perfect.  At the end of it you will have either learned something to make the next job better or you will have learned enough to hire out the next job.

 

[deepcreek]

I did it myself in my shop but would never attempt it again on anything that I actually wanted to look good.  Lesson learned.

It's one of those skills that people who are proficient (through years of experience) make look easy.  It's also relatively inexpensive to hire someone who has mastered the craft compared to other trades.

Blown texture can hide a lot of sins but it catches a lot of dust.  We just built my Mom's house with a Level 5 finish http://nationalgypsum.com/resources/tech-talk-revisiting.htm and the walls are baby butt smooth.

 

[Paul G]

1200 sqft of ceiling, have you factored in an added extension tube cost and possibly the harness? Also if the ceiling is vaulted the harness is a pain to use and keep adjusting the extension height. If you're inexperienced in mudding you'll likely be making your sanding work even harder (like me lol). The only thing in me that says DIY is it's a shop and doesn't need perfect and is a learning experience. And to save $ there are other ways to sand, even for dust control there are pole sanders with vac attachments that do a respectable job of dust capture. With those I use a Dusty Deputy/shop vac combo that works great. Same vac setup with a 5" or 6" Rigid RO sander works well too to capture the dust also. Point being is you don't need the planex and vac to do this if you want to DIY.

 

[Tinker]

I did it myself in my shop but would never attempt it again on anything that I actually wanted to look good.  Lesson learned.

It's one of those skills that people who are proficient (through years of experience) make look easy.  It's also relatively inexpensive to hire someone who has mastered the craft compared to other trades.

Blown texture can hide a lot of sins but it catches a lot of dust.  We just built my Mom's house with a Level 5 finish http://nationalgypsum.com/resources/tech-talk-revisiting.htm and the walls are baby butt smooth.

A level 5 finish is almost like doing a white coat with plaster.  Everything gets atleast a skim.  A good taper will do that without even sanding.  However, even the best can run into problems with a level 5 at some point.  On the last fireplace/chimney job i did before retireing, every sub ran into problems with the lady (I use the term subjectively only  [mad] ) of the house.  For my part, the first day was a nitemare and i should have walked away. it was a battle all the way. When the taper was finished with what I thought was about the finest taping job i had seen, ever, the LOTH brought a large portable light to check.  She had a laborer hold the light at various angles close to the wall.  she went around with a marker to show every shadow, no matter how insignificant.  by the time she finished marking walls and ceilings, the poor taper had to do the entire house with, i guess you would call, a level 6 or maybe even a level 7.  There was not one sub who finished that job with a smile.  Even the hubby got out of there within six months of finishing the house.  The builder was a great guy with tremendous patience, but he would never go back as well.  That was one exceptional job.  :-X
Tinker

 

[joraft]

So what would you do?

... Buy a Planex and CT 36 AC?

What do you think I should do?

I obviously hold the minority opinion here, but that's just what I did. Facing the same decision, I chose to take advantage of the recent discount on the Planex and do the job myself.

We are beginning an addition and remodel to our house this year and there will be a lot of drywall work, plus I've long wanted to get rid of the textured walls and ceilings that came with the house.

Thoughts that went into my decision:

1. While I've never done drywall hanging or taping professionally, I've done enough of this type of work to become pretty good at it. With the Planex I may even be able to take my work to another level.

2. I'm retired and have enough time to do the kind of job that I could not afford to pay someone else to do. I don't care how long it takes to make it perfect (although my wife may not agree on that  [smile] ).

3. I love the feeling of satisfaction that I get when I'm able to get a wall as flat and smooth as a piece of slate.

4. And maybe most important, it gave me an excuse to acquire another Festool.

 

[Brice Burrell]

So what would you do?

... Buy a Planex and CT 36 AC?

What do you think I should do?

I obviously hold the minority opinion here, but that's just what I did. Facing the same decision, I chose to take advantage of the recent discount on the Planex and do the job myself.

We are beginning an addition and remodel to our house this year and there will be a lot of drywall work, plus I've long wanted to get rid of the textured walls and ceilings that came with the house.

Thoughts that went into my decision:

1. While I've never done drywall hanging or taping professionally, I've done enough of this type of work to become pretty good at it. With the Planex I may even be able to take my work to another level.

2. I'm retired and have enough time to do the kind of job that I could not afford to pay someone else to do. I don't care how long it takes to make it perfect (although my wife may not agree on that  [smile] ).

3. I love the feeling of satisfaction that I get when I'm able to get a wall as flat and smooth as a piece of slate.

4. And maybe most important, it gave me an excuse to acquire another Festool.

Yeah, get back to us when you've actually done the work... [tongue]