Hey Festool here is a suggestion for the next 100th Anniversary Tool. Give us a CTC SYS with a power cord and variable suction. Better yet make it a hybrid vac that has a power cord and a battery option for small jobs. Please make sure it supports Bluetooth when connected to cordless tools. Really surprise us and have it come with a long life re-usable bag.
Okay, This Has To Be Said re: 100th Anniversary Tool Releases
- Thread starter onocoffee
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Redromad
Member
That is one of the reasons I stopped watching
Sparktrician
Member
I think the proper response is, "Be still, my pounding heart..."
Hey Festool, my second suggestion is not even a tool, it’s a consumable. Engineer a domino tenon that has clamping pressure similar to a Lamello Tenso. Maybe it needs to be a two piece tenon (like the the Tenso) which when snapped together “clamps’ both sides in place until glue dries. Even if I needed to double up these new “clamping tenons” that would be an improvement. I tried the Fastcap “FASTenons” and can assure you these are not the answer we need. Personally, I am a little bummed that I have both Dominos and will now likely need to add a Zeta P2 to attach face frames, filler strips, etc without mechanical fasteners, clamps. Having all three machine ties up a great deal of funds.
Crazyraceguy
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The P2 is a fantastic compliment to the DF.
luvmytoolz
Member
I'd be really surprised if you regretted buying a Zeta at all after the first use! I think it's more ground breaking than the Domino's and saves an amazing amount of time, especially not needing to clamp most of the time or wait for assemblies to dry before moving on.
Honestly, I'd say to anyone who has even what they think is just a passing need for a Zeta, to just bite the bullet, you'll use it far more than you'd believe.
Crazyraceguy
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Agreed 95% (I'm not so sure about the "more ground breaking than Domino part)
But yes, if you have even the slightest need, go ahead and get one. They are great and compliment the Domino, perfectly. There are several different fasteners for P2 too.
luvmytoolz
Member
I absolutely love the Domino's, and they perform just fantastic at what they're uniquely designed for, but I think while neither Zeta or Domino can replace each other, there is some overlap in function but as you say they do both complement each other, and I frequently use both on the same projects.
But for me the biggest thing is the sheer amount of time and effort saved with the Zeta. With the Domino I need to clamp and set aside until the glue's cured, which can greatly increase project build time.
The Zeta however in most cases allows you to glue, join and assemble, and then move straight onto the next part of the project without clamps. For anyone in a pro environment this would be a real godsend, and the tool will pay for itself in no time.
That and the fact that it is so easy to achieve quite complex joinery with it as well is invaluable.
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Dr. P. Venkman
Member
This veers off topic, but I’ve never really investigated the Zeta P2 at all.
Is the clamping pressure on the Tenso really such that you don’t need to clamp glued joints?
Is there really 1mm of usable lateral tolerance while maintaining that clamping pressure?
When doing something like face frames, do you just orient all of the biscuits in the same direction to take advantage of that tolerance? And space then all over the frame, so there’s sufficient pressure to hold for gluing?
How might it be paired with the domino? If you’ve got the Tenso or other zeta connector, it does vertical alignment also, right? Plus you’ve got the lateral tolerance while maintaining the connector strength? What does the domino add? Increased glue surface for certain joints?
Just curious after seeing Domino users sing the praises of the Zeta for the hundredth time.
Is the clamping pressure on the Tenso really such that you don’t need to clamp glued joints?
Is there really 1mm of usable lateral tolerance while maintaining that clamping pressure?
When doing something like face frames, do you just orient all of the biscuits in the same direction to take advantage of that tolerance? And space then all over the frame, so there’s sufficient pressure to hold for gluing?
How might it be paired with the domino? If you’ve got the Tenso or other zeta connector, it does vertical alignment also, right? Plus you’ve got the lateral tolerance while maintaining the connector strength? What does the domino add? Increased glue surface for certain joints?
Just curious after seeing Domino users sing the praises of the Zeta for the hundredth time.
Dr. P. Venkman
Member
I like Sedge. He’s enthusiastic and engaging, and he clearly enjoys the tools he’s using.
Is the show polished and super professional? No, but it’s not supposed to be, and it’s much more interesting than somebody dryly talking through tool features.
Is the show polished and super professional? No, but it’s not supposed to be, and it’s much more interesting than somebody dryly talking through tool features.
luvmytoolz
Member
@Dr. P. Venkman The clamping pressure of the Tenso connectors is quite amazing, and yes all the connectors allow a fraction of lateral movement which is real handy. The Clamex connectors though apply an astounding amount of force and will pull joints together very tight. On permanent installs I glue my Tenso's and Clamex's which means it's there for good.
On a recent large oak mantel build (with some pics here https://festoolownersgroup.com/threads/lamello-zeta-project.73562/ ) I used tenons to assemble the panels, and Clamex's to join the mouldings to the plinth blocks, then I used a combination of Tenso and Clamex's to join and pull tight all the components together, also using some Domino tenons for alignment and a bit extra strength on the joint.
The large slab top (1800mm x 380mm x 55mm) was done purely with Tenso's, and despite the massive weight of it all when dry fit assembled, when my son and I lifted it all by the top, it didn't separate from the frame at all!
Mind you all this was done in continuous work, mostly without clamps, with the exception of the initial panel assembly done beforehand which were Domino'd and glued/clamped up.
On a recent large oak mantel build (with some pics here https://festoolownersgroup.com/threads/lamello-zeta-project.73562/ ) I used tenons to assemble the panels, and Clamex's to join the mouldings to the plinth blocks, then I used a combination of Tenso and Clamex's to join and pull tight all the components together, also using some Domino tenons for alignment and a bit extra strength on the joint.
The large slab top (1800mm x 380mm x 55mm) was done purely with Tenso's, and despite the massive weight of it all when dry fit assembled, when my son and I lifted it all by the top, it didn't separate from the frame at all!
Mind you all this was done in continuous work, mostly without clamps, with the exception of the initial panel assembly done beforehand which were Domino'd and glued/clamped up.
Dr. P. Venkman
Member
Thanks. Very cool approach to the mantel.
I guess I have a new tool to research (good, fun), then possibly an annoying amount of money to spend (less good).
I guess I have a new tool to research (good, fun), then possibly an annoying amount of money to spend (less good).
@luvmytoolz and @Crazyraceguy I have heard nothing but good things about the P2. I have held out simply because of the cost. I have two projects coming up that require attaching/gluing pieces onsite after painting/staining where clamps won’t work. To avoid using mechanical fasteners I plan to order a P2 and some Tensos. I am glad you both think I will use it more than I realize and that it’s a good compliment to the Dominos.
luvmytoolz
Member
Looking forward to seeing your report on the Zeta! And while the connectors are way cheaper in the US than for us here, you can always buy the 3rd party equivalent connectors for a fraction of the cost of the Lamello branded ones.
The 3rd party TCT and PCD blades are also ridiculously cheap! For us in OZ, roughly 1/15th the cost!
onocoffee
Member
While I think I understand that the Lamello's forte is for face framing cabinets, is that all it is used for? I'm curious to learn how else it might be used.
What third party connectors do you use? Get the same results? Thanks.
James Watriss
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Ya, this whole 100 Anniversary Festool rollout has been less than inspiring.The first missed opportunity was for Festool to release the new ETSC 2 125 & 150 as just so much chum. They deserved blue Systainers and they deserved more promotion as they were new products. What the
So then with much fanfare we proceed to Anniversary Granat Packs...what the...Festool has been selling Granat for the last 15 years.
Moving on to an Anniversary DF 500...yawn again nothing's different and nothing's changed except for the color of the Systainer. At least put a badge on the tool you're attempting to celebrate.
MB 40 another new tool and worthy of some accolades...it should have been packaged in a blue Systainer and heralded as a new product but it became again...just chum.
Ya I like the engineering aspect of Festool a lot...the marketing side...not so much.
I actually laughed at the MB 40.
I hadn’t posted on FOG in forever, but came back to make sure I wasn’t crazy. Sure enough, it’s basically something I’d proposed 11 years in a thread on “ I wish festool made a…”
Surely, it shouldn’t have taken them that long to make one?
Crazyraceguy
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It definitely does save time, and as a retired pro, I can assure you that does matter. I guarantee that the one I used was paid for dozens of times over.
However. the Zeta is really just a sheetgoods tool, it cannot do heavy joinery. The versatility of the Domino going from tiny 4 x 20, for small boxes or trim joints, all the way to 10 x50 (sticking with the 500). You are never going to join table legs to aprons, with a Zeta P2.
That's my point. The Zeta can assist the Domino with clamping, which leads to speed, but it is not required.
luvmytoolz
Member
I've bought a very large amount of Tenso's in 10mm/14mm, Clamex's in 10mm/15mm (for some reason 3rd party Clamex's are only available in 15mm), and Divarios from Aliexpress, Ebay, and direct import from China with complete success. My tests which I documented in the prior linked thread showed absolutely no detectable difference in use or function and that the halves were interchangeable with the Lamello ones, but at around 1/10th the cost so you can happily go crazy with them!
Note though a forum member here posted in the same linked thread that the Tenso's he bought were a little different to mine, and while they worked he had a bit of an issue with them being slightly more curved so didn't close as easily, so there are some that aren't quite the same, but these are easily identified in the thread.
Crazyraceguy
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Yes, the Tensos are really good, in situations where clamping is not possible, while remaining invisible.
They are very strong. In fact, you have to be careful about dry-fitting, for something that you need to get back apart.
Clamex definitely has more holding power, but there has to be a 5mm hole somewhere, to fasten them. They are far easier to get back apart too.
You will use it. There is a bit of a familiarity, as you work it into your workflow. You know the old saying "When you're a hammer, everything looks like a nail" It's like that. You have it, you will use it.
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