Hi FOG
First post, but I’ve been lurking and reading for some time. I’m after a bit of advice - really a chance to consolidate my own thoughts after reading 1001 opinions and bits of advice.
Warning: Waffle
(I tend to be a bit slow [embarassed] - I was watching a whole lot of YouTube by some bloke called Peter Parfitt, and thought he did some good stuff; then I was reading these forums and some bloke called Peter seemed to talk sensibly... and finally I was thinking about a Device (Capital ‘D’) called the UJK Parf system... when finally a little bulb went off and I realised they were all thanks to the same person. Smack upside the head.)
Anyhoo. I’m getting back into woodworking (and metalworking and so on) - making work for idle hands. Background of general handiness, fixing this old house, this old car, this old bike etc. Most of my wood hacking was building stage props for an ex’s theatre productions, so very little precision needed.
I re-started by building a workbench, and ended up [blink] and swearing as the ancient, cheap mitre saw (which I use as a do-all saw) managed to cut every piece of wood at a different angle (and I was only aiming for 90deg!). Initially my own fault for not checking the setup, but after spending a chunk of time smiting the darn thing, I realised it was almost impossible to cure it without re-engineering. It was fine for building stage props where a thousand inaccuracies can be covered by smoke, mirrors, and liberal application of makeup, but it’s not capable of anything vaguely precise.
Which led to me looking at a decent set of tools. I own a T18 drill, and have a friend who’s a Festool saw fan, and here we are.
Requirements:
I’m at a stage in life where I can afford to (slowly) replace my older, cheaper tools with good quality, preferably that will last forever. I don’t mind paying for good tools, but I object strongly to being ripped off.
I’m arranging a demo with one of the local Festool reps, so I’ll get to play with items of interest, or anything advised here.
My workspace is a little limited - I tend to roll out benches and tools, do Stuff, and then pack it all away so I can hide the car away from all those roving gangs of thieves, rioters, and other people that Donald Trump is afraid of (and will surely be on their way here to Australia when they find they can’t get over that wall)
I have been looking at these options, and would appreciate any thoughts you might have:
Mitre saw: Kapex 60 vs 120 - I like the extra cutting capacity of the 120, and who can resist a tool with a laser, but it’s a big beast, so I’m tending towards a dainty little 60. I worry slightly that companies make a great ‘big’ tool, and then a bunch of smaller, cheaper tools that ride along their big brother’s coat tails... the clamp supplied with the 60 compared to the 120 re-inforces this concern. It appears to be as well-engineered as a toothpick.
This is likely to be my first saw purchase, and I may end up not bothering with a table saw... so it may be the One Saw, depending on how versatile it is.
Table Saw: Sawstop jobsite saw vs a TS55 and a CMS. It’s not really portability that matters, but size (oo-er missus). I like the Sawstop concept - I’m an anaesthetist by trade, so I spend a signifacant part of my life looking and the mangled extremities of the latest tradie accident. And She Who Thinks She Must Be Obeyed wants to play as well, and she’s been known to take chunks out of her fingers with a kitchen knife!
The attraction of the CMS setup was ending up with a track saw as well, and further down the road, a router table. It does make all the space saving a little easier.
Which leads me to my second Festool concern: Accessory quality. Do they make great tools, and rubbish, over-priced accessories? I’ve read some scathing reviews of the quality of the CMS table (think it might have been on Axminster). It’s a huge amount of money to pay for an aluminium table with a few attachments, so I’d expect perfection. Similarly, I’ve read many poor reviews of Festool’s saw tracks, particularly when joining them up. I watched a tradie review the Kapex 120 vs his DeWalt mitre saw, and while he loved the saw, he hated the trolley/track system - the DeWalt stand and guides were set up in minutes with zero fuss, which could not be said for the Fesstool trolley and track setup, particularly if you didn’t have a level surface to start with.
Has anyone here lived with a CMS long term? How has it behaved? I could get a very nice Sawstop for the equivalent $2500 (Aussie dollars there) that a TS55 and CMS setup would cost. And then the 55 that only gives me a 55mm cut. If I went for the 75, there’s no discounted CMS kit with evertything included, so I’d have to buy each bit individually and pay a whole lot more. But pro is I end up with two tools and a very compact system.
Dust extraction: I have actually never even considered this in the past. I have used a device called a broom. Researching new, decent tools has been an eye-opener! So I’ve been clamping the nozzle of an old $50 Panasonic vacuum cleaner to anything I work on, and I’m liking the reduced cleanup work. But $1000? For a vacuum cleaner [wink]? Sell this crazy concept to me! Has anyone found or built a reasonable equivalent, or is the Festool system just head and shoulders above the rest?
Sanders: Pretty simple here, I think: ROTEX 150 vs ETS 150. The ROTEX seems a bit more versatile, but quite a chunky device.
*Sigh* What else...?
Mains power vs Battery equivalent. I already have the 18V T18 drill. In the real world, how does the performance of say the cordless TSC55 compare to the TS55?
I’m a little wary of being locked in to proprietary systems - like the blades for the Festool saws. No competition usually means inflated prices, but it does also mean quality control is easier. A bit like iSheep and Apple. The stuff just tends to work - I’m hoping Festool is the same.
I destroyed an Alpen carbide-tipped drill drilling four holes into my drive yesterday. The original set of 5 drills cost $30, so I’m not too fussed (and it’s the first drill that could actually get into my drive). The option would have been to get Festool’s centrotech masonry bits, at 3x the price. That would have smarted a bit if the drill had gone the same way as the Alpen as quickly.
Well, that’s about it for now. Feel free to ignore or pile in wherever. I can look at the tools in the shop, and have a play when the rep comes around, but I can’t get that real world, day-to-day experience that many of you will have, and that’s what I’m after.
First post, but I’ve been lurking and reading for some time. I’m after a bit of advice - really a chance to consolidate my own thoughts after reading 1001 opinions and bits of advice.
Warning: Waffle
(I tend to be a bit slow [embarassed] - I was watching a whole lot of YouTube by some bloke called Peter Parfitt, and thought he did some good stuff; then I was reading these forums and some bloke called Peter seemed to talk sensibly... and finally I was thinking about a Device (Capital ‘D’) called the UJK Parf system... when finally a little bulb went off and I realised they were all thanks to the same person. Smack upside the head.)
Anyhoo. I’m getting back into woodworking (and metalworking and so on) - making work for idle hands. Background of general handiness, fixing this old house, this old car, this old bike etc. Most of my wood hacking was building stage props for an ex’s theatre productions, so very little precision needed.
I re-started by building a workbench, and ended up [blink] and swearing as the ancient, cheap mitre saw (which I use as a do-all saw) managed to cut every piece of wood at a different angle (and I was only aiming for 90deg!). Initially my own fault for not checking the setup, but after spending a chunk of time smiting the darn thing, I realised it was almost impossible to cure it without re-engineering. It was fine for building stage props where a thousand inaccuracies can be covered by smoke, mirrors, and liberal application of makeup, but it’s not capable of anything vaguely precise.
Which led to me looking at a decent set of tools. I own a T18 drill, and have a friend who’s a Festool saw fan, and here we are.
Requirements:
- Long lasting, accurate tools
- General woodworking, DIY; likely some finer stuff later- picture frames, furniture, recycling old wood and turning firewood and old broken trees into something nice
- The tools won’t be subject to trade-type abuse, but they need to magically appear off my shelf and perform well for decades to come
I’m at a stage in life where I can afford to (slowly) replace my older, cheaper tools with good quality, preferably that will last forever. I don’t mind paying for good tools, but I object strongly to being ripped off.
I’m arranging a demo with one of the local Festool reps, so I’ll get to play with items of interest, or anything advised here.
My workspace is a little limited - I tend to roll out benches and tools, do Stuff, and then pack it all away so I can hide the car away from all those roving gangs of thieves, rioters, and other people that Donald Trump is afraid of (and will surely be on their way here to Australia when they find they can’t get over that wall)
I have been looking at these options, and would appreciate any thoughts you might have:
Mitre saw: Kapex 60 vs 120 - I like the extra cutting capacity of the 120, and who can resist a tool with a laser, but it’s a big beast, so I’m tending towards a dainty little 60. I worry slightly that companies make a great ‘big’ tool, and then a bunch of smaller, cheaper tools that ride along their big brother’s coat tails... the clamp supplied with the 60 compared to the 120 re-inforces this concern. It appears to be as well-engineered as a toothpick.
This is likely to be my first saw purchase, and I may end up not bothering with a table saw... so it may be the One Saw, depending on how versatile it is.
Table Saw: Sawstop jobsite saw vs a TS55 and a CMS. It’s not really portability that matters, but size (oo-er missus). I like the Sawstop concept - I’m an anaesthetist by trade, so I spend a signifacant part of my life looking and the mangled extremities of the latest tradie accident. And She Who Thinks She Must Be Obeyed wants to play as well, and she’s been known to take chunks out of her fingers with a kitchen knife!
The attraction of the CMS setup was ending up with a track saw as well, and further down the road, a router table. It does make all the space saving a little easier.
Which leads me to my second Festool concern: Accessory quality. Do they make great tools, and rubbish, over-priced accessories? I’ve read some scathing reviews of the quality of the CMS table (think it might have been on Axminster). It’s a huge amount of money to pay for an aluminium table with a few attachments, so I’d expect perfection. Similarly, I’ve read many poor reviews of Festool’s saw tracks, particularly when joining them up. I watched a tradie review the Kapex 120 vs his DeWalt mitre saw, and while he loved the saw, he hated the trolley/track system - the DeWalt stand and guides were set up in minutes with zero fuss, which could not be said for the Fesstool trolley and track setup, particularly if you didn’t have a level surface to start with.
Has anyone here lived with a CMS long term? How has it behaved? I could get a very nice Sawstop for the equivalent $2500 (Aussie dollars there) that a TS55 and CMS setup would cost. And then the 55 that only gives me a 55mm cut. If I went for the 75, there’s no discounted CMS kit with evertything included, so I’d have to buy each bit individually and pay a whole lot more. But pro is I end up with two tools and a very compact system.
Dust extraction: I have actually never even considered this in the past. I have used a device called a broom. Researching new, decent tools has been an eye-opener! So I’ve been clamping the nozzle of an old $50 Panasonic vacuum cleaner to anything I work on, and I’m liking the reduced cleanup work. But $1000? For a vacuum cleaner [wink]? Sell this crazy concept to me! Has anyone found or built a reasonable equivalent, or is the Festool system just head and shoulders above the rest?
Sanders: Pretty simple here, I think: ROTEX 150 vs ETS 150. The ROTEX seems a bit more versatile, but quite a chunky device.
*Sigh* What else...?
Mains power vs Battery equivalent. I already have the 18V T18 drill. In the real world, how does the performance of say the cordless TSC55 compare to the TS55?
I’m a little wary of being locked in to proprietary systems - like the blades for the Festool saws. No competition usually means inflated prices, but it does also mean quality control is easier. A bit like iSheep and Apple. The stuff just tends to work - I’m hoping Festool is the same.
I destroyed an Alpen carbide-tipped drill drilling four holes into my drive yesterday. The original set of 5 drills cost $30, so I’m not too fussed (and it’s the first drill that could actually get into my drive). The option would have been to get Festool’s centrotech masonry bits, at 3x the price. That would have smarted a bit if the drill had gone the same way as the Alpen as quickly.
Well, that’s about it for now. Feel free to ignore or pile in wherever. I can look at the tools in the shop, and have a play when the rep comes around, but I can’t get that real world, day-to-day experience that many of you will have, and that’s what I’m after.
