Patents...

[pugilato]

I anybody familiar with the patent process?  I have a machine that I would like to patent, but today I saw in the news that some girl scouts invented a device so that a girl born without fingers could write, and that patent was $20,000.  Are they kidding?

 

[Ken Nagrod]

My uncle is a retired federal patent attorney.  Think about the costs involved in attorneys doing research and how long they take.

 

[sadie171]

I went through legalzoom.com. Less than two years and about $1200. No hassles.  ;D

 

[WarnerConstCo.]

Yeah, there is more then one way to skin a cat.

 

[pugilato]

I have been seriously considering legalzoom.com... So, your experience was a good one?  I think the steps are to get a patent pending status first, then what?

 

[JimRay]

Several years ago I was awarded a patent for a very simple thing. Legal fees were over $10,000, and it took about two years to completion. In the end, I would say that you do not necessarily get what you pay for. Proper writing of the application, which includes thinking about every possible alternative design or fabrication method, is absolutely vital. You can spend a LOT of money, and have basically no protection at all, if you are not careful. Don't know much about LegalZoom, but I question whether a Patent awarded using such a service would provide any real protection at all.

As someone said, there are many ways to skin a cat, and when it comes to patents, you want to make sure that you have identified as many of those ways as possible and included them in your application(s).

Jim Ray

 

[Ken Nagrod]

This is one of the reasons the company Fast Cap helps out developers with patents and production of ideas for related products.  That might be something for you to look into.  Of course they take a big share of the profits while assuming a big share of the costs to get it to market and protect it.

 

[pugilato]

Someone mentioned about the costs involved with "attorneys doing research"... what research?  Is this what is referred to as patent search to make sure that a patent for a similar device does not exist? 

Research is something I can do... I think.

 

[Brice_Arnold]

You should also consider what you plan on doing with your idea or patent. Even with a patent, it's pretty much useless unless you plan on defending it in court. If a big company comes after your idea they can pretty much overwhelm you with their deep pockets battling it out in court until you have completely run out of resources.

As an engineer I have a couple of patents under my belt but they are backed by the company that I worked for at the time.

As a small business owner with several innovative mechanical designs, I never had the resources to justify getting a patent and as a result my products/ideas have been knocked off by chinese companies. Not really a big deal for me, I just moved on. I have too many projects that I enjoy working on to squander one idea.

Here are some examples of my designs that have been stolen and are now sold on ebay

This is a two speed that I designed from the ground up, completely original. Spent two years developing and designing. It was knocked-off within six months of release.

Original:

Knock-Off:

This is a starter adapter that I conceptualized, designed, prototyped, and produced. One year to develop. Knocked off in three months of release.

Original:

Knock-Off:

 

[mattfc]

I'm Brice's camp here. A lot of the companies that will rip off your designs will not be US registered so very hard to issue proceedings to defend your patent. Upholding IP law in contries like China for example is not one of their strong points. You will see article in the press these days on a daily basis of industrial espionage. Patents work if they are well written and you have two legit enterprise who are publicly listed for example and therefore have to follow the law to comply with SEC (like Apple and Nokia having a dust up).

 

[pugilato]

I'm an environmental chemist and developed a machine that will save time and money (significant) in the very limited market of environmental laboratories.  The way I figure it, a patent may not be worthwhile because (a) it is not such a very large market, and (b) even if I had a patent, what could I do if someone copies my design?  Or, if they are selling my design without my knowledge.

I am working on the patent because, if some other, bigger company wants to be legit and buy my idea, the patent part would be taken care of, therefore making the product more valuable... at least that's the way I figure it.

Is my logic flawed?

BTW - I am still selling it, patent or none.

 

[Brice_Arnold]

Are you employed as an environmental chemist? if so then you might want to look at your employee contract to see if you even have rights to your idea. Typically if you are developing ideas that are in conflict with your work (even if done on your own time) they may become property of your employer.

 

[pugilato]

Currently unemployed... giving myself a chance to get this going.  If it does not pick up, back to the lab.

 

[mattfc]

Your logic is not flawed with regards to a legit larger Corp seeing value is your patent, that is if the patent is well researched it gives a potential buyer comfort in knowing their investment is protected. What I don't know is the benefit value of that comfort to a potential buyer vs the cost of getting the patent. This also has to do with the size of the potential market, e.g the bigger the potential Market the more valuable the patent in that the patent owner as it gives them exclusivity in capitalising that market share

 

[tbellemare]

It's my understanding that something is no longer patentable but public domain if it has already been offered for sale prior to starting the process.

I'm not positive though.

Tom

 

[Brice_Arnold]

I think you have a year to file before you loose your rights to the idea.

 

[pugilato]

Nah... just starting the whole process.  To the extent that I can control things, I dont want to work for stupid people.  Ever.  Again.

 

[John Stevens]

The way I figure it, a patent may not be worthwhile because (a) it is not such a very large market, and (b) even if I had a patent, what could I do if someone copies my design?  Or, if they are selling my design without my knowledge.

If you speak to a good "patent lawyer," he or she should be able to help you weigh the pros and cons of seeking a patent versus keeping your idea a "trade secret" instead.  Good luck with it!  Try doing a search on findlaw.com for an intellectual property lawyer in a city near you.

Regards,

John

 

[dltflt]

I have been seriously considering legalzoom.com... So, your experience was a good one?  I think the steps are to get a patent pending status first, then what?

Actually it is good to keep it in patent pending because you are still coverEd. Then you have so many years that you are protected by the patent itself.

 

[tbellemare]

In the recent past, there were patent attorneys that frequented this site. I hope they weren't scared off and at least one will jump in and clear up our mutual assumptions/possible misconceptions?

Tom