Please help re: Domino for trim carpentry

[clisbyclark]

I've got a trim job coming up where speed and accuracy will be paramount.  The casing is simple 1x4 stock all around the windows and doors.  I'm thinking of pre-assembling the four pieces on the ground using dominoes for alignment and pocket screws for quick holding power.  If anyone has any experience with this techique and can offer any advice on placement/number of doms and screws or what type of assembly table works best, I will greatly appreciate it.

 

[Eli]

I'm going to try this for my next big install. Looks good. There's an excerpted magazine article on this site with his complete method.
http://www.miterclamp.com/

 

[Dan Clark]

Clisby,

I second the use of the ClamClamp.  For 1X4 casing, the Domino plus pocket screws will work fine, but the ClamClamp should hold it more tightly. 

For Finish Carpentry info, you might want to check out JLC Online Finish Carpentry forum at:http://forums.jlconline.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=7.  It's a forum for professional Finish Carpenters.  Try the advanced search and enter the words "domino and casing" (or maybe some other combo of words:http://forums.jlconline.com/forums/search.php.

The moderator is Gary Katz.  He has a website with lots of great info too.  Finally, Gary has a series of DVDs here:http://www.garymkatz.com/publications_dvds.html.  You might want to consider the "Installing Casing & Installing Baseboard" DVD.  You can watch a preview of the DVD on that web page. 

Good luck,

Dan.

 

[Lou Miller]

If you're willing to buy the clam clamps (which are awesome), then the pocket screws are not needed. I do my pre-assemblies with one domino using the smallest setting on the tool. The location is determined by putting the pins on the long point of the miters. Then I put the joint together with the clam clamps and let it dry for about an hour before installing. They come out perfect every time. Only time I use pocket screws along with dominos is when I can't afford to wait for the glue to set-up. If you have enough pre-assemblies to do, then you'll have plenty of time for them to set up. Get yourself some of that molding glue that Titebond sells (sorry, always forget the actual name of it). That stuff is better than Titebond I,II, or III, for most trim applications. Its thicker and it sets up faster. It has a pretty decent initial tack too.

Its really very straight forward, and you won't need many tips, if any, once you get started. Just do a few trial runs in scrap first so you get the hang of the domino.

I strongly recommend ditching the pocket screws and picking up some clam clamps. The Collins clamps aren't bad either, but I prefer the Clams.

 

[Overtime]

More ideas....

Using the domino and some pocket holes you can make your own squaring jig with the same 1 x 4 stock. Like an L shape, 2 -3' long. Just two boards connected to make a square inside corner. ..."Accuracy"

After you decide what method you will make the joinery then you could use this jig on the floor or on a table - (saw horses and plywood)

........ Then you can use this stuff  - 2P-10 Adhesive   ..."Speed"
I have used the Gel version and it's good stuff.

This stuff is so good you won't need pocket holes or clamps.  But the domino will be perfect for for alignment during assembly.

  After 30 seconds you can toss around the assembly as if it were welded together  ;D. 

   Only drawback is  - you only get one shot at alignment of the joint. You have about 4-5 seconds to make the actual connection and alignment. Then you hold the connection together with your hands for 10 seconds - Done.  After that it's basically welded. And after a couple of joints you quickly get the hang of it.

Second thought  - since I have not used the domino and this adhesive on the same joint, only the adhesive alone. I would 2P-10 one end of the domino into one mortise joint first. Then proceed to mate the two.

 

[clisbyclark]

I forgot to mention that the 1x4s are going to be butt jointed (edges flush), not mitered.  I've read great things about the clam clamps, but I'm pretty sure they won't work for butt joints.

 

[Brice Burrell]

I forgot to mention that the 1x4s are going to be butt jointed (edges flush), not mitered.  I've read great things about the clam clamps, but I'm pretty sure they won't work for butt joints.

Since you will be butting the joints, you can try two 5mm dominos and one pocket screw or maybe the other way around and a 6 or 8mm domino.

 

[Jack Rafter]

You have picked the worst possible joint combination, end grain to a straight grain. No matter how you think you might "pin" the joint, it's gonna move. . .

I'd forgo all the "extra" work and just nail the joint together if you must use a but joint. Doing it with a miter will balance the wood grain across the joint and give the joint a better chance to move in unison. If you use a miter you can use either a biscuit, dom or even a spline. Good Luck

 

[Warrior]

I dont think y0u need to do any pre-assembly of the joint. just cut the parts, cut the mortisii (on the med setting) and assemble at the opening w/ yellow glue.

I pre assemble all mitered casing on the bench. But I dont really see any benefit of doing that in this case. I actually think you will lose time if you go that route.

Thanks,

Eiji Fuller

 

[stevelf]

As a "newbie" here I was wondering if/ when I would come upon reference to Fast Cap's 2P-10 adhesive that Scooter mentions. Used properly, I have had excellent results using it on baseboard, crown, not to mention a hundred other instant-applications...the stuff is awesome--!! The gel was mentioned, but for our woodworking, the thick works best.
  I also use West System epoxies a lot for my joints. Anybody else ??

 

[Eli]

I like West System for boats. It's cost prohibitive here in Australia though, you'd use Boatcote epoxy in it's place. I wouldn't use it for trim, architrave or crown, I'm too fussy, too many shaving recuts, and using a long pot life defeats the purpose.

2P-10, though I've not used it, sounds faster than I like as well. But I've heard great things about it. I just use Titebond or PVA.

I liked your idea of using epoxy on columns. I'm a freak doing a glass up though, I don't know how much I'd like the added pressure.

 

[stevelf]

Eli, g'day, mate !
I'm sure you're aware, with the West system epoxy, there are (at least) two hardeners available--slow and fast . I tend to use the fast and gives me about 10 minutes to begin-set-time...
And the fast Cap can be used without the "accelerator", and the bond extends from 12 seconds to maybe 1 minute. I swear by the stuff....(in a good way...).