Sawstop Compact Saw

[woodferret]

a very nice amount of infeed before the blade. It looked quite a bit longer than my Dewalt 745. Not sure if that was mentioned already.

I've been waiting for someone to note that.  Thank you.  The 745's infeed is what stopped me from going for that one.  This sounds promising.

 

[HinksonHomeRepair]

I have the Freud thin kerf general purpose blade on the SawStop CTS and cut seems as good as any jobsite saw I’ve used, it’s definitely not a cabinet saw, but it has had no issues cutting plywood, WindsorOne 3/4 trim or some 3/4 white oak I’ve cut. Mine seems equivalent to a perfectly set up perfect condition Dewalt jobsite tablesaw.

 

[jeh]

I saw one at Woodcraft over the weekend. I'm not too worried about the flesh saving tech I have a very healthy fear of table saws which leads me to plan out each cut with an abundance of safety. But what did catch my eye is the sawstop has a very nice amount of infeed before the blade. It looked quite a bit longer than my Dewalt 745. Not sure if that was mentioned already.

That's what everyone thinks until there is an accident.

 

[DynaGlide]

I had to run out to Rockler to get some things and while I was there I had them measure the table distance to blade on the new saw: 7.5".

 

[ChuckM]

Snip.
That's what everyone thinks until there is an accident.

And table saw accidents/injuries can happen to both newbie and seasoned woodworkers as well as younger folks and elderly folks as statistics after statistics have proven it. One fellow woodworker I know cut his fingers on the table saw a few years ago while in his late 70s -- his first ever table saw finger cut after close to 50 years of woodworking. The nerve pain persisted for over half a year. He has since replaced his table saw with a track saw system.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

I got an ad sent to my phone for one of those today.

 

[ChuckM]

The hot dog test on the compact saw (fastforward to 0:40):
=40s

 

[gnlman]

Hi. thanks for posting this. I am considering this small saw as well to replace my little dewalt. I am wondering how flat the top is, and also how consistent the miter slots are? My Dewalt slots are a little wider than normal, and with the coating a little variable. This was fixed easily with a little sanding. The top on the other hand is not flat. While that is not a big deal as the right side of blade is ok, there is a hump at front of the table on the left miter slot which makes using the miter gauge a little challenging...lol...I realise these little saws are not made for woodworking, but just curious if the sawstop version of this saw might have a little more attention paid to the table saw top.
Thanks again for posting this, not much info yet on this saw and sounds like prices going up next week...
Greg

 

[luvmytoolz]

That's what everyone thinks until there is an accident.

Anyone could get hurt from anything at anytime, I would consider a bandsaw far more dangerous than a table saw, but none of them have any safety technology built in.

 

[Mini Me]

The greatest number of injuries suffered from table saws by a huge margin is not finger or hand injuries from blade contact but kick back and bandsaws can't kick back. Space and money being available a slider is the safest saw, very little to no chance of blade contact, none using an F&F jig and if the sliding table is used for ripping zero kick back as well. Of course if a site saw is required that changes everything and surely a track saw is the ultimate answer.

 

[ChuckM]

That's what everyone thinks until there is an accident.

Anyone could get hurt from anything at anytime, I would consider a bandsaw far more dangerous than a table saw, but none of them have any safety technology built in.

Finger-saving technology has already existed for band saws and been in use. It's an Australian innovation, and first came to use in band saws in the meat industry. The woodworking band saw manufacturers have yet to adopt the technology.

 

[ChuckM]

The greatest number of injuries suffered from table saws by a huge margin is not finger or hand injuries from blade contact but kick back Snip.

Care to share the data source to back that up?

The OSHA record seems to suggest otherwise:
https://www.osha.gov/ords/imis/AccidentSearch.search?p_logger=1&acc_description=table+saw&acc_Abstract=&acc_keyword=&sic=&naics=&Office=All&officetype=All&endmonth=11&endday=25&endyear=2002&startmonth=11&startday=25&startyear=2023&InspNr=

Some table saw finger or hand injuries are also caused by kickback.

 

[ChuckM]

There has also been a widespread misconception that the sliding table saw is a close-to-accident-free machine. Nothing is further from the truth, especially in an industrial setting. If sliding saws were "harmless," the three (?) major sliding saw manufacturers would not have spent money and come up with their own finger-saving sliding saws.

[attachimg=1]

 

[Mini Me]

The greatest number of injuries suffered from table saws by a huge margin is not finger or hand injuries from blade contact but kick back Snip.

Care to share the data source to back that up?

The OSHA record seems to suggest otherwise:
https://www.osha.gov/ords/imis/AccidentSearch.search?p_logger=1&acc_description=table+saw&acc_Abstract=&acc_keyword=&sic=&naics=&Office=All&officetype=All&endmonth=11&endday=25&endyear=2002&startmonth=11&startday=25&startyear=2023&InspNr=

Some table saw finger or hand injuries are also caused by kickback.

It appears they don't log kickbacks because most of them are unreported. You only have to peruse fora such as this to see that kickbacks far outweigh finger and hand injuries. As you say some finger and hand injuries can be caused by kickback, I wonder how many hand injuries are caused by push sticks contacting the blade, they are an unstable and positively dangerous to use but I expect I am in the minority with that view though Jeremy Scmidt of YT fame certainly agrees with me and is very vocal on it in one of his videos.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

That's what everyone thinks until there is an accident.

Anyone could get hurt from anything at anytime, I would consider a bandsaw far more dangerous than a table saw, but none of them have any safety technology built in.

When use correctly, a bandsaw is the safest cutting tool out there. The cutting force is downward, so it cannot kickback at you. The force is constant, so there is no chance of vibrating or jumping, as a jigsaw or reciprocating saw can. The only time a bandsaw can be dangerous is when you (as every Youtube woodworker does) leave the upper blade guide too high. I can't tell you how many videos I have seen with someone cutting 3/4" material, with the blade guide 5 or 6 inches off the table.
I yell at the TV every time. "Put that blade guide down."

 

[ChuckM]

It appears they don't log kickbacks because most of them are unreported. You only have to peruse fora such as this to see that kickbacks far outweigh finger and hand injuries. As you say some finger and hand injuries can be caused by kickback, I wonder how many hand injuries are caused by push sticks contacting the blade, they are an unstable and positively dangerous to use but I expect I am in the minority with that view though Jeremy Scmidt of YT fame certainly agrees with me and is very vocal on it in one of his videos.

The OSHA database includes kickback incidents if they result in an injury. If a kickback doesn't result in any injury that requires a trip to the hospital, obviously it doesn't get reported/recorded. You can browse the OSHA records one by one if you're interested in knowing how often it is mentioned as a cause for injuries (say, to the hand, eye, face, etc.). Same for the use of the push stick incorrectly.

The #1 reason for injuries (based on the first few pages of entries I've read) seems to be using the saw without the guard.

Forum discussions are NOT a reliable or valid source as a basis to say kickbacks happen more than finger and hand injuries. We should rely on official statistics collected or documented by hospitals or entities such as the OSHA.

Based on the info. collected by the US Consumer Products Safety Commission, about 10 table saw amputations happen every day in the States. Let's not downplay the role of finger-saving technology such as the SawStop and those advanced detection technology features on the sliding saws when we discuss table saw safety.

(One can find many examples of table saw injuries to the hand or fingers on the SawStop site. One can assume that most, if not all, of them (in the thousands according to SawStop) didn't require a treatment at a hospital, and hence don't get into any gov't injury data collection system.)

 

[ChuckM]

Snip.
I can't tell you how many videos I have seen with someone cutting 3/4" material, with the blade guide 5 or 6 inches off the table.

The best known woodworker who worked with exposed blade is the late Sam Maloof, but he always forewarned his audience that no one should follow him as an example in the way he used the band saw. For the record, one of his fingers was cut shorter.

 

[dashboardpws]

Speaking of kickback, one time a knotty piece of 2x2, which I probably shouldn't have been ripping anyway, shot past me and lodged in the bathroom door at our shop about 18ft away, exactly at the level where it would've impaled anyone using the toilet at that moment. As a reminder, we haven't repaired the door.

 

[ChuckM]

Even though I have never encountered any serious kickback like the one you shared, its seriousness was etched into my mind when I took my first woodworking lesson for basic machines. After the first night of instruction on table saws, one of the participants returned for the next class, proclaiming that she might not have been able to join us because she had a kickback incident using her own saw at home. She showed us a broken pencil that she put in her apron's upper pocket. A little higher, she said, she could have been hospitalized.

The riving knife does not kick in until the stock reaches well past the back teeth of the blade, and that means kickbacks can still happen with the use of the riving knife. So for me, the best protection against kickbacks (other than not standing in the line of fire, which can be awkward at times as I'm right-handed when using tools) is the use of both the riving knife and JessEm clear stock guides. Properly set, the JessEm table saw guides are fool-proof.

 

[squall_line]

Speaking of kickback, one time a knotty piece of 2x2, which I probably shouldn't have been ripping anyway, shot past me and lodged in the bathroom door at our shop about 18ft away, exactly at the level where it would've impaled anyone using the toilet at that moment. As a reminder, we haven't repaired the door.

I have a few of those reminders from various incidents through the years.

The one that comes quickest to mind is the piece of scrap/pig iron that narrowly missed my helmet and hit me in the shoulder traveling down the interstate on my motorcycle.  I was wearing a protective jacket at the time, and the piece of metal landed in my lap after bouncing off my shoulder and then the tank.