So - sell me a Carvex ......

[MikeGE]

What exactly is "the right thing" Mafell is not doing?

The hallmark of a premium brand is support. They should offer to inspect the unit, at no cost, and if it failed because it was defective, fix or replace it for free.  And otherwise offer a repair at reasonable cost.

I agree up to a point; however, the support begins with returning the failed three-year old tool to the service center for evaluation and an educated quote.  I might have missed it, but I can't see where the OP has done this.  Receiving a quote for a component is not the same as sending it in for a thorough evaluation.

I didn't go to Mafell repair school, so I am not able to determine if the cost to receive, inspect, diagnose, remove and replace, test, QA/QC, and ship a failed P1CC for £357 is unreasonable.  Nor would I be able to speculate that the problem was a failed motor and not a broken wire or something less expensive to replace or repair.

If I had such a tool and the quote from the service center was 85 percent of the cost of a new tool with a fresh warranty, I would have to evaluate how much I loved and missed the tool and think of all the good times we had together before deciding to make it better, replace it with a newer version, or change brands.

 

[Crazyraceguy]

Exactly as mino said, I use a jigsaw as a tool of last resort. To me it is a smaller/lighter more precise version of a reciprocating saw (SawZall). I'm never expecting "finish" cuts from it. I cut notches around obsticles, "close enough" for a flush trim bit in a router, around electrical outlets, etc
I have the corded version and have never seen a lack of power. I've cut solid surface, hardwood and all forms of sheetgoods, no problem at all.

 

[woodbutcherbower]

What exactly is "the right thing" Mafell is not doing?

The hallmark of a premium brand is support. They should offer to inspect the unit, at no cost, and if it failed because it was defective, fix or replace it for free.  And otherwise offer a repair at reasonable cost.

I agree up to a point; however, the support begins with returning the failed three-year old tool to the service center for evaluation and an educated quote.  I might have missed it, but I can't see where the OP has done this.  Receiving a quote for a component is not the same as sending it in for a thorough evaluation.

I didn't go to Mafell repair school, so I am not able to determine if the cost to receive, inspect, diagnose, remove and replace, test, QA/QC, and ship a failed P1CC for £357 is unreasonable.  Nor would I be able to speculate that the problem was a failed motor and not a broken wire or something less expensive to replace or repair.

You’re obviously completely right. So for the record, the P1CC was taken to my local branch of a greatly respected UK national tool sales and repair company called ProTrade - they’re sales and repair agents for Mafell, Festool, Lamello, Fein, Milwaukee, Makita and several others. I’ve used them numerous times before, always being happy with their great service, good pricing, and great results. These guys have always gone the extra mile, even loaning me inventory tools to keep me going whilst they repaired mine. This time was the same - the tool was taken apart, examined by an experienced, skilled tech who diagnosed the fault quickly - the motor was totally open-circuit and unrepairable. All of the obvious stuff (cable, switch, connections, motor brushes, fuses etc.) was checked and tested first, just as it should be. These guys have to earn a living and I’d never expect any 3rd-party company to work for free - but their cost to strip down, inspect, test, and diagnose was just £30 - extremely reasonable. The subsequent phone call to me began with the words ‘We’re so, so, sorry - but the motor needs replacing, and Mafell have given us a crazy price …. it will almost be cheaper for you to buy a new one ….‘

 

[Cheese]

Were you cutting strips off the edge of the plywood? All cut settings the same? Front dust shield on Carvex closed? Is the picture order correct? I ask because I have had much better DC with Carvex than Trion. I don't have the Mafell to compare though.

I was cutting a 3/4" wide strip from the bottom of the ply. You'll notice that the Sharpie oblong gets closer to the end with each cut.
Here's a snippet from the full test.

Some standards were set:
1. A new Festool Trion S 75/4 FSG blade was used on each saw.
2. No orbital action was used.
3. All 3 saws were set to approximately the same speed.
4. No chip guard was used.
5. A triggered CT 22 on max suction was used on each saw, that way the length of time the vac was on was approximately equal.
6. A scrap 7" wide piece of 3/4" ply was used.

Carvex photos 1-3, Trion photos 4-6 & Mafell photos 7-9. The stunner is when you compare photos 2, 5, & 8 to each other. There's a channel inside of the base of the Mafell that blows the chips across to the extraction point on the other side. Photo 8 says it all.

Interestingly enough, the Carvex leaves the most amount of dust on the cutting surface while the Trion leaves the most dust on the floor. Also, the area of dust on the floor is similar between the Carvex & Trion.


Seth, I really tried to ensure that there was some equivalence between the 3 saws because otherwise...what good is the test.

 

[ScotF]

My first corded jigsaw did not cut well for me and did not track. My cordless cuts perfectly and just as good as my Trion and P1CC. I think that the base on the Carvex has a little slop in it and if you do not get it seated just right, it can cause ever so slight deflection and cause the saw to not track straight.

Setting the guides can be a pain, but the nice thing is being able to use blades of different thicknesses and get good straight and parallel cuts. My first Trion was a barrel grip and it tracked OK unless I used it with the guide rail adaptor and then it would not cut well. My D handle cuts perfectly with the guide rail adaptor and just following a line. The only thing I can think is that there are good and bad versions of the saw. I can cut precision joinery and cuts with the jigsaw and I would say for me, it is the most valuable saw in my arsenal because of its versatility. I am happy with all three and like having options. The Mafell is still the best of the bunch and can do things the others cannot, but the other two are certain capable saws.

As others have said, try the Festool with the 30 day or 15 day no questions asked and see if it works. If not, consider another option as there are plenty of choices out there these days.

 

[semenza]

Were you cutting strips off the edge of the plywood? All cut settings the same? Front dust shield on Carvex closed? Is the picture order correct? I ask because I have had much better DC with Carvex than Trion. I don't have the Mafell to compare though.

Seth, I really tried to ensure that there was some equivalence between the 3 saws because otherwise...what good is the test.

    I was just wondering since I get better DC with Carvex than Trion. The little ports on Trion always seem to get plugged. The Mafell blower combined with suction sounds great!

Seth

 

[Coen]

DC on the Trion getting plugged higly depends on blade and material being cut.

Without the cover on it blows a throws a bunch of dust forward yeah.

And having the Trion, the TS 55, the Festool routers and the rails; I'm not going to trade in anything to gain one tool that is slightly better. And the last thing I need is two different rail systems. Just like I don't need more different batteries (and why I bought the Bosch GCG 18v-310 instead of the Milwaukee M12 PCG/310C).

 

[woodbutcherbower]

Quick update = I had an out-of-the-blue call this morning from NMA Agencies who are the UK Mafell importer. The guy told me that ProTrade had been in touch to see if NMA could offer a more realistic solution. Literally 10 minutes later, the Hilti rep showed up. The cordless is great - it cuts dead straight and dead true, it's way lighter (even with an 8.0Ah 22v lump on the tail of it), blade deflection is marginal, it takes regular bayonet blades, and it would do exactly what I needed it to. But I was totally honest with the rep and explained the back story. He totally agreed that pursuing Route #1 would be the best way to go initially. So the P1CC will be packed up today and sent away to NMA.

Watch this space ........

 

[Cheese]

The cordless is great - it cuts dead straight and dead true, it's way lighter (even with an 8.0Ah 22v lump on the tail of it), blade deflection is marginal, it takes regular bayonet blades, and it would do exactly what I needed it to.

Curious what model you test drove?  They appear to be cheaper than the Carvex equivalent.

I found a review on it although it's rather lame.
https://toolsinaction.com/hilti-cordless-jig-saw/

Here's a more thorough review.
https://www.jlconline.com/tools/fas...eal-review-hilti-sjd-6-a-22-cordless-jigsaw_o

 

[woodbutcherbower]

The cordless is great - it cuts dead straight and dead true, it's way lighter (even with an 8.0Ah 22v lump on the tail of it), blade deflection is marginal, it takes regular bayonet blades, and it would do exactly what I needed it to.

Curious what model you test drove?  They appear to be cheaper than the Carvex equivalent.

I found a review on it although it's rather lame.
https://toolsinaction.com/hilti-cordless-jig-saw/

Here's a more thorough review.
https://www.jlconline.com/tools/fas...eal-review-hilti-sjd-6-a-22-cordless-jigsaw_o

It was the SJT6-A22 - the barrel-grip version which I prefer. The second review covers the top-grip version which is identical apart from its handle design. The price in the UK is £288 which is good value ....... but only if you already have Hilti 22v batteries (which I do). If you don't - by the time you add (say) a pair of 5.2Ah plus a charger, you're into almost double that.

 

[4nthony]

On the topic of the Carvex, Festool sells a wood blade kit that includes blades for fine, curves, and straight cuts. It also includes "universal" and "basic" blades.

I get what fine, straight and curve blades are for.

What differentiates a universal from a basic blade? The tooth size and shape look very similar.

 

[Coen]

Afaik the FSG is better suited for use with the guiderail, because the teeth stand out wider and therefore is less like to be let astray by the body being pushed sideways in the cut.

 

[Cheese]

Here's a screen shot from a Festool chart.

The basic S 75/4 blade is for general purpose cutting while the S 75/4 FSG blade has a different tooth grind to it.

[attachimg=1]

[attachimg=2]

 

[4nthony]

thanks guys

[member=44099]Cheese[/member] Are those blade charts from one of the supplemental manuals?

 

[Cheese]

[member=44099]Cheese[/member] Are those blade charts from one of the supplemental manuals?

I don't think so Anthony...they're probably just from some Festool marketing info I ran across. I like that they give the Bosch blade equivalents. There are 4 pages in total.

UPDATE

This is the original web address: http://www.festoolusa.com/media/pdf/jigsawbladecompchart.pdf

 

[JINRO]

I use Milwaukee M18 Fuel-Barrel grip. Anyone with both experience recommend if I should swith over to Festool? M18 has dust port which isn't too bad when used with MIDI. I get debris at cutting blade area and front though...hindering cutline sight sometimes.

 

[4nthony]

UPDATE

This is the original web address: http://www.festoolusa.com/media/pdf/jigsawbladecompchart.pdf

Thanks Cheese. That link didn't work for me -- it redirected to the manuals page -- so I googled the filename and was able to find a copy here:

http://www.thewoodshop.20m.com/graphics/festool/trion/bladecomparison.pdf

[cool]

 

[FestitaMakool]

A PDF “Find the right jigsaw blade at a glance”

 

[Coen]

[member=44099]Cheese[/member] Are those blade charts from one of the supplemental manuals?

I don't think so Anthony...they're probably just from some Festool marketing info I ran across. I like that they give the Bosch blade equivalents. There are 4 pages in total.

UPDATE

This is the original web address: http://www.festoolusa.com/media/pdf/jigsawbladecompchart.pdf

Also exist as Festool PDF;https://www.festool.nl/-/media/tts/...decoupeerzaagbladen-salessheet-2019-nl-nl.pdf
And in metric!

 

[Cheese]

Thanks for that [member=71478]FestitaMakool[/member] & [member=8955]Coen[/member] ...those PDF's are the cross reference between the old series numbering and the new series numbering.

It's also nice that some guidance to blade speeds and pendulum stroke are given.  [thumbs up]