SYS3 SORTAINER?

[semenza]

I am thinking that one reason for Festool to switch to the 3rd gen is that T-Loc will probably be gone at some point.

Seth

 

[squall_line]

Let me just go on the record of saying that the major complaint about the new heights is not necessarily that they're not the same heights as the old Systainers; that's just a knock-on effect. 

The major complaint about the heights is that the T-Loc Systainers (and the original ones) were actually made in heights that allowed one to stack multiples of certain heights to get the same height as another Systainer, allowing you to create a platform or have otherwise semi-uniform heights for Systainer stacks.

Shamelessly stolen fromhttps://systainer.store/pages/systainers-101:

2 x SYS-I = SYS-III

3 x SYS-I = SYS-IV

4 x SYS-I = SYS-V

2 x SYS-II = SYS-IV

2 x SYS-III = SYS-V

SYS-I + SYS-IV = SYS-V

The only Systainer in the 3rd generation that is the same height as a T-Loc is the M112, which is the same height as the Sys-I, which is the same height as the Kapex table when placed on the ground.  Every other Sys3 is a different height than the T-Loc Systainers, which means you can't mix and match to get equal height stacks without significant headache and fumbling, if you're lucky.

 

[Cheese]

Ya, having to perform handle surgery on every new SYS³ Systainer is a nuisance among many other issues.

Before surgery...after surgery.  [smile]

[attachimg=1]

[attachimg=2]

 

[Coen]

Let me just go on the record of saying that the major complaint about the new heights is not necessarily that they're not the same heights as the old Systainers; that's just a knock-on effect. 

The major complaint about the heights is that the T-Loc Systainers (and the original ones) were actually made in heights that allowed one to stack multiples of certain heights to get the same height as another Systainer, allowing you to create a platform or have otherwise semi-uniform heights for Systainer stacks.

Shamelessly stolen fromhttps://systainer.store/pages/systainers-101:

2 x SYS-I = SYS-III

3 x SYS-I = SYS-IV

4 x SYS-I = SYS-V

2 x SYS-II = SYS-IV

2 x SYS-III = SYS-V

SYS-I + SYS-IV = SYS-V

The only Systainer in the 3rd generation that is the same height as a T-Loc is the M112, which is the same height as the Sys-I, which is the same height as the Kapex table when placed on the ground.  Every other Sys3 is a different height than the T-Loc Systainers, which means you can't mix and match to get equal height stacks without significant headache and fumbling, if you're lucky.

Systainer classic and T-Loc were multiples of 52.5mm
L-Boxx's are multiples of 34mm
Sys3 is (a multiple of 50mm) + 30mm. The +30 part completely **** it.

You can get some equal-height stacks... but you pretty much always have to use the same amount of boxes.

And reaching the MFT-height requires a very specific stack while previously it could be with any combination as long as it contained an uneven amount of Sys-II.

 

[Systainer.Store]

I always learn something when reading threads like these, so I appreciate the discussion.

I saw some mention on rails.

True, they aren't as readily available in Europe because of a Tanos/Bott agreement.  I've pushed Tanos, and will continue to do so, that there are customers to serve there.  Meanwhile I've been able to ship order to Europe of rails.  It ain't cheap, though buying in quantity helps.

Right now I offer the SYS-Rail.  It is longer than the current systainer3 because it was based on a specific Bott generation.  Sorry I forget which one.  AND soon, I'll be offering the Bott rails as well at Systainer Store.  It may be just a bit before I have them in my store, but if you are itching for them now, then drop me a message and we can likely work something out.

 

[Coen]

AND soon, I'll be offering the Bott rails as well at Systainer Store.

Will you post about it in this subforum?  [tongue]

 

[Systainer.Store]

Certainly, I'm happy to post when available.

I can do some sales now, I just don't have all the product pages built.  I'm trying to get some backend systems in place before introducing more products.

 

[Coen]

Do you know where they are made? Would be so ridiculous if the only way to get them in Europe is for those rails to cross the Atlantic twice.

 

[Systainer.Store]

Agree.  Certainly there is a Bott dealer you can approach in Europe for the Bott rails, no? 
I don't know country of origin yet on this.  Though I'd bet it is in Europe. 

 

[Coen]

Agree.  Certainly there is a Bott dealer you can approach in Europe for the Bott rails, no? 
I don't know country of origin yet on this.  Though I'd bet it is in Europe.

Yeah... they ask what van you have and if you respond that you don't have one and just want some rails you never hear from them again.  [dead horse]

 

[bidn]

Ya, having to perform handle surgery on every new SYS³ Systainer is a nuisance among many other issues.

Before surgery...after surgery.  [smile]

[attachimg=1]

[attachimg=2]

Thank you, this looks excellent to solve the nuisance of the gen 3 handle.

Actually removing this is very important for me because many of my systainers are stacker  on the sys roll wheeled small trays, with stacks as high as possible. With the gen 2 I could grab the highest, top systainer by extending one arm and hand as high as possible. But with the awful changes coming with the sys3 3rd gen, and when I have newer machines in gen 3 systainers at the top of the stack, this has become impossible because the handle is stuck: when I highly extend my arm and hand this high, I don't have the force to unstuck the handle, so I have to climb a few steps on a small ladder...

Now your solution is something I hadn't dare to do, I was afraid of piercing the top of the sys 3 systainer (their plastic is even thinner than with the T Loc gen 2 version, one of so many downgrades) by applying too much force to chisel.

So, I am very interested in knowing how have you done this and how long did it take ?

 

[luvmytoolz]

It's nothing more than a few strokes downward keeping the chisel straight vertically. The tabs come off with little effort.

 

[Coen]

Ya, having to perform handle surgery on every new SYS³ Systainer is a nuisance among many other issues.

Before surgery...after surgery.  [smile]

[attachimg=1]

[attachimg=2]

Thank you, this looks excellent to solve the nuisance of the gen 3 handle.

Actually removing this is very important for me because many of my systainers are stacker  on the sys roll wheeled small trays, with stacks as high as possible. With the gen 2 I could grab the highest, top systainer by extending one arm and hand as high as possible. But with the awful changes coming with the sys3 3rd gen, and when I have newer machines in gen 3 systainers at the top of the stack, this has become impossible because the handle is stuck: when I highly extend my arm and hand this high, I don't have the force to unstuck the handle, so I have to climb a few steps on a small ladder...

Now your solution is something I hadn't dare to do, I was afraid of piercing the top of the sys 3 systainer (their plastic is even thinner than with the T Loc gen 2 version, one of so many downgrades) by applying too much force to chisel.

So, I am very interested in knowing how have you done this and how long did it take ?

Well, if you replace all original T-Loc systainers with Sys3 your stack will be higher so you can't reach the handle anyway. Festool has thought about that!  [big grin]

 

[Cheese]

Now your solution is something I hadn't dare to do, I was afraid of piercing the top of the sys 3 systainer (their plastic is even thinner than with the T Loc gen 2 version, one of so many downgrades) by applying too much force to chisel.

So, I am very interested in knowing how have you done this and how long did it take ?

Just take a very sharp chisel and pare downwards, just like wood, the sharper the chisel edge the thinner the shaving...maybe 60 seconds per side?

 

[batmanimal]

Just take a very sharp chisel and pare downwards, just like wood, the sharper the chisel edge the thinner the shaving...maybe 60 seconds per side?

I really need to do this. I didn’t understand the differences between T-loc and sys3 until I got the 1010 router, which came in a sys3. I don’t like that handle or the height difference.

 

[luvmytoolz]

There's a lot to not like so far as I'm concerned, the fact that the purpose built racks I made no longer fit them after they increased the height "just oh so much" is my main gripe, the stupid handle on the front of the smaller ones that interferes with the locking mechanism from the one below it, and the tab that locks the top handle in place.

If they "had" to have that front handle on the slim units, they could have curved it so you can lock a stack withouthaving to pop the handle out.

I know some like the tab for the top handle, but I find it extremely annoying.

 

[batmanimal]

[member=75933]luvmytoolz[/member] I also dislike the front handle protruding out over a connecting tab. I can only imagine how maddening the height differences would be when you’ve already built your racks to the prior standard.

The top handle locking is my personal pet peeve. I feel like I’m fighting with the thing. Also, since I have a mix of new and old, I never know when I grab a systainer top handle if it’s going to be a “good” one or a “fighty” one. I’m looking forward to making them all “good” ones with my chisel.

 

[mino]

Agree.  Certainly there is a Bott dealer you can approach in Europe for the Bott rails, no? 
I don't know country of origin yet on this.  Though I'd bet it is in Europe.

Yeah... they ask what van you have and if you respond that you don't have one and just want some rails you never hear from them again.  [dead horse]

Bott does not have "dealers", they have only "integrators" ..

But some dealers are persistent ... though the prices are about € 25/set which seems ridiculous ... at that price one is better off getting a SYS-AZ drawer instead. I guess the price are to match the trouble the retailers needed to get to stock these ..
https://www.naradionline.cz/vodici-kolejnice-festool-na-systainer-sys3-2ks.htmlhttps://www.kofferundschaum.de/en/s...r3/bott-vario3-guide-rail-for-systainer3.html